Up until Warlords, flight was always available from the get-go when an expansion launched. All that was required was to reach max-level and pay the required fees. Many players were flying within the first week of game play.
Flight in the old world was not introduced until Cataclysm. It was one of the main features for that expansion. Old world Vanilla zones weren’t coded for flight. Only Outlands and Northrend had flight until Cataclysm.
Considering how easy it would be to modify the example he gave so that you would still need to fight through the enemy camp, rescue the prisoner, and escape, even with flying, I’m going to say that the lead dev is full of hogwash.
I’m also going to say that you don’t revamp the entire vanilla world because you’re including flying out of a sense of “ingrained habit”. That was a massive, heavily hyped undertaking when they could easily have left flying in Outland.
For reasons that had nothing to do with flying.
You don’t know that or have the answer for that as much as you want to think you do.
THINK about what you just said. If you were flying all over Azeroth, as you claim, why were you switching between flying and ground mounts? Why were you not always on a flying mount?
Sadly the dev philosophy has devolved into a “keep your arms and hands inside the cart” theme park ride. I have no problem with theme park narratives but they REALLY need to think about allowing character customization (passive talents talent trees?) and increasing options. We need flying sooner IMO the .5 patch after the first big content patch of an expansion. There also needs to be a focus on encouraging players to in a passive matter to group together or have world events in both new and OLD content. It’s not stepping backwards if say we have few incursions in old world zones, we all love this game and its vast world. So don’t be afraid to bring us around those old zones to enjoy some new systems (so we can enjoy some flying). I am also happy with how zones also get redesigned for warfronts …even if warfronts really need some work mechanic wise to make them a bit more engaging and fun.
Leveling an alt is “doing something” though. So are transmog, achievement, pet, mount, and recipe hunting. Flight makes all of those activities easier.
Also, when flight was enabled in Legion, it was on the Broken Shore, which was progression content at the time. Even after Argus came out, BS was still relevant because of farming mats, legendaries, artifact power etc.
So you list the only unfliable new zone in Cata as an example. How about Hy’jal , Twilight Highlands ,Uldum and Deepholm .
3 of those mentioned zoned you needed flying just to get into dungeons and raids and even some questing.
The most fun I had in WoD was the Legion pre-patch invasions. (I know, low bar, but still.) I genuinely loved going to those old zones, filled with players of all levels, all working on the same objectives. I leveled this toon up from level 54 almost to cap through invasions, and the thrill when I dinged 60 midway through one. Instead of staying around the fort in Westfall mopping up smaller demons, I could join the army rising up on their flying mounts to chase down the big bosses! It felt amazing.
After they’ve gone to all the trouble of developing scaling, it seems a shame that higher level toons remain cordoned off in “Current Zone of Warcraft” rather than having things to do in the rest of the world. I would love to experience something like those original Legion invasions again.
That’s hardly the only bad-faith argument he’s making, considering he continues to swear he could fly “all over Azeroth” during BC.
And as others have pointed out, it’s not even a no-fly zone. The surface is very close to the “land” in most areas, and it’s easy to fly to your destination and simply dive down.
Plus the fact that even though the primary means of movement is “swimming” and not “flying”, it’s functionally the same given it’s free movement in all three dimensions. They could have made Vashj’ir a cloud city and the only real differences would be that you’d NEED a mount at all times, and that you could fall off things. Unless they gave you a levitation buff, which would make a sky city exactly like Vashj’ir.
Goodness, yes. The Legion pre-patch invasions were the most fun I’d had in the game since’s Wrath expansion launch. It was an awesome sight to see 40+ players descending on their flying mounts to the invasion point and everyone running around in the fight.
Part of the fantasy of WoW is being able to fly on exotic beasts that frequently take time to earn, such as the years it took for Ashes of A’lar to drop for me. I love seeing the world from above, traveling with my dragon or flying carpet. It feels magical and amazing to fly. When flying came out in BC, I was SO excited!
That said, I understand that Blizz wants us to put some work into it… but in Legion it was so time consuming (and I was pretty bored with that expansion), I actually didn’t get Legion flying until BFA came out. It was a breath of fresh air to be able to fly again!
I really hope that as time goes on, flying remains an achievement to be earned. I do think that flying should be available as soon as you achieve the Pathfinder, and that you shouldn’t have to wait longer after putting in all the work.
My new strategy, although I have to wait 4 months for my sub to expire because I bought the 6 month sub with the boat mount.
From now on I’ll just buy the new Xpac when flying is available. By then I’ll get the Xpac at a reduced price and I can actually enjoy being able to fly. Not to mention all the catch up percs blizzard puts into everything.
You realize that one of the major incentivizing reasons to rebuild the old world in Cataclysm was to allow flying everywhere, right? Flying wasn’t going to happen in the original world as it had too many illusions and non-existent geography.
This isn’t my quote, it was a quote I was responding to.
Were you starting that new area close to a flight point? Using the whistle and flight points will get you there much, much faster than flying. However, if you’re going to a point not close to a flight point flying will get you there faster. I’m not suggesting everywhere much much faster, but faster still. You said you didn’t have to sit around tapping, waiting for him. But you did get there before him and started to engage. Which was my point, flying to places not close to a flight point is faster than having to take the flight point and ride a ground mount to that location.
And of course you realize the Cata was the experiment in unlimited, free flight the broke the camels back. The devs Cata experience had a significant impact on the downfall of free flight.
The only reason flight was not more restricted in MoP is simply because the expansion was too far along to pull the plug on it. All 3 of the end game zones did not allow flight. Also, the Shieldwall Offensive and comparable Horde event were both “anti-flight”, having cannon to shoot you out of the sky. Thunder Isle stands out since it was a portaled instance, like Argus was. But Isle of Giants and Timeless Isle were part of the free flight world, and there was no technical/resource reason for those to have no flight other than gameplay.
And gameplay they focused on, there were distinct element in TI that were there because they knew you could not fly.
It’s clear they decided to end flight in mid MoP, using the end zones as experiments for design, and player acceptance. They knew this since by the time those areas came out, they were already neck deep in Draenor, and designing for no flight.
This was not some sudden decision they made. They watched Cata, the fantasy of WoW free flight – free flight from the beginning, “for free [it was dirt cheap]” for everyone, for everywhere. And clearly they did not like what they saw, and how it turned out. Thus prompting the decisions made manifest through MoP and WoD.
Flying is glorified ~noclip and has no place in the game until its had significant overhaul
Yes, it’s faster. Of course it’s faster.
But it’s not significantly faster. It’s not OH MY night and day faster. And, as I also mentioned, of course there are exceptions for particularly treacherous terrain where flying certainly clobbers ground mounts.
But in the large, in practice, combined with the taxis and whistles and such, it’s not hugely different.
For example, in Val’Sharah, as often as not flying was a pain because of all the trees for even short hops, you may as well use the ground mount. By the time you flew up and over the canopy and then back down in to the destination, someone on the ground may well be there. You’re flying, but you’re also traveling farther.
Again, of course, anecdotes, but effective just the same. Flight is very empowering over water, for example. (Why, yes, I did have to swim to Shield’s Rest in Stormheim…pre-flight and sans water walking)
From what I can tell by reading the millions of flight post on this forum.
People that believe flight ruins the game are from PVP servers and people that love flight are from PVE servers. This makes perfect since as the pvpers get bent when some one mounts and flys away before the gank can happen. PVE players actually explore the zone and flight gives access to places a ground mount just will not go.
How about a compromise? Release pathfinder 2 sooner and disable flight WORLD WIDE if a player has warmode on. This way we can all have what we want.