Fixing mass exodus from Wintergrasp

PVP Battlegrounds
1

Step one is acknowledging there is a problem.
Step two is fixing the problem.

This is not an easy solution, but I wanted to open a discussion, specific to Wintergrasp, for helping to reduce the max exodus after the initial scrum.

People tend to port out en masse after the first battle, which tends to mainly occur at SR. The team that experiences the loss at SR and subsequent mass exodus is placed at an even greater disadvantage because the new pvpers that port in have zero kills and thus cannot build vehicles.

I considered asking for the WG debuff for leaving to be expanded to 30 minutes. This would also likely deter people from going afk. Unfortunately, this doesn’t fix the root cause of the exodus. I won’t get into that here as it is covered in another forum post.

I do not think preventing people from quitting the BG is an acceptable or viable option. Nor do I think preventing new people from porting in during the middle of the battle is a fair option (although those who port into a lopsided loss certainly would appreciate it).

Are there other options out there other than trying to fix the underlying problem?

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Shadowlands PvP wish list - #11 by Bynir-dragonblight this is how I’d attempt to fix Wintergrasp. Fewer vehicles, and neutral workshops so the first PvP battle isn’t immediately over as soon as 5 people are killed.

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How about just having the rank transferred to the new player? Sore of like a “commissioned” rank that lets the new player benefit from the work done by the previous player, though there should be something to offset that.

1 Like
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An epic battleground requires an epic cool down for leaving early. I would go further than 30 minutes to 45 minutes or even 1 hour. I would do the same for regular battlegrounds queues. Double it at a minimum.

Speaking strictly from the perspective of the Alliance, I don’t often experience the overall resilience from a group - that will to win - that is required for successful come backs. Each one of us can make a difference in a battleground. All those little moments can add up to a victory. Football 101 for the sports fans out: fight for the inches and the yards takes care of themselves.

Perhaps game systems need to change to reflect the changing gaming / pvp culture. From my own perspective as a player, the fundamentals of our battlegrounds are solid. I’m not a game designer and certainly don’t have the information that Blizzard has. The deficiencies seem to lie in the player base: willingness to work for a win, no matter what it takes. A change in player culture may be an unreasonable aspiration but just my two cents.

5

What exactly is the problem with wintergrasp? Seems like 50/50 win chance to me.

If you meam people just don’t lie kit, I think they should bring back the blacklist system.

To clarify, why are poeple leaving all of a sudden after the SR skirmish?

1 Like
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the problem basically is when defense wins. games where attack wins are either over fast or an active fairly fun match. when defense wins they drop teh towers in 5m then spend the next 25 minutes circling the map with a 20-24 strong train of demos that destroys everything in its path, if they 4 cap then they will all head to ally spawn and hold them at their GY for the remainder of the game.

tbh, it sucks for everyone when defense wins because there is hardly a game there.

7 Likes
7

I just blacklist epic bgs altogether at this point. Most of them have horrible design or balance issues that blizzard refuses to acknowledge.

8

It should just end once the towers are destroyed.

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Remove the kill requirement to build vehicles.

The start of the battle would be strategic as both teams would have to decide which vehicles to build at what location.

Matches would be much more competitive throughout instead of having the dominant team becoming more dominant with first access to vehicles while the other team is left stranded without enough kills to build anything.

Players filling in for quitters or disconnects would be on even footing, coming into the battle as productive members of the team able to build vehicles upon entry.

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The problem is the map is garbage and people don’t want to play it. The problem is Ion removed blacklists.

The problem is not the leaver penalty. Stop victim blaming.

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Expanding the debuff to 30 minutes won’t do anything productive.

I personally like the large convoys of vehicles, but I do think maybe people should have a debuff from making another one for at least 1 minute if not 2. Can be very annoying to kill someones mech, just for them to make another.

Another alternative is to avoid SR completely, and by that I mean make guards count for EVERYONE in the area or at least who hits them. Would help with rank ups for both teams without necessary needing to launch yourself into a fight to get Vehicles are the beginning.

The games would definitely be a little longer as the Vehicle warfare would not be as one sided initially, but evolve into Offense having to use its vehicles to capture Workshops initially rather than just outright win a fight to be successful.

Another alternative would to make the WS in the fortress itself only count for 2 each instead of 4, giving defense less of an edge overall and encouraging a team to actively be getting WS so defense isn’t overrun. Its very possible to own no WS and just have the enemy team knock a wall down and funnel themselves if you get set up right.

Yet another basic alternative is to just return the damage bonus for Attackers per tower up by 5%. Give offense an edge in the initial fight as they need sometimes.

If you ever see me in WG I am a strong supporter of Vehicles doing specific things.

Catapults kill players
Demos/Sieges kill walls

Maybe scale down Demo damage on players and make players choose for mowing people down with Flame Breath in Catapults, but be more vulnerable… or go more for long range demos for support fire.

Another possible solution is to increase the power of Siege Engines specifically all around and not allow Defense to build them. Give the Attackers a vehicle advantage and encourage people to take the up close and personal vehicle. Currently, people just take Demos most of the time.

I don’t think its because Demos are too powerful, but they are cooler and more thematic in WoW. Siege Engines are not exactly the same, but they also don’t feel too powerful in WG IMO. Give people a reason to want a Siege Engine.

Maybe even buff Siege Engine and just make an additional rank.

5 Kills Catapults
15 Kills Demos
30 Kills Sieges

Encourage PvP to get a vehicle thats actually very good for sieges.

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If it’s over after 5 deaths it’s your teams fault for not fighting inside the shop and preventing those vehicles from being made.

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i think they should just fix the balance of wintergrasp, it shouldn’t be so hard to win on O and it shouldn’t be over after 1 battle.

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the problem with Wintergrasp is that the defending team is winning almost all the time, i see 10 people instantly leave before the bg even starts on the offensive team because it is pretty much an auto loss, imo the offensive siege damage needs to be buffed towards walls and enemy siege, and the defensive siege damage nerfed against players.