Thanks for the quick communication and update, we really do appreciate you guys talking to us early instead of later on.
Any thoughts on helping Feral access more than just Regrowth easily to take further advantage of the healing sides to Wildstalker, such as maybe allowing Predatory Swiftness to be spent on Wild Growth?
This makes it much worse for resto tbh, rejuv keeps getting pushed away when its our staple spell in favor of regrowth which was always our spam filler, was nice to see a tree actually promote rejuv again.
Thanks for the quick iteration. It is much appreciated. That change alone makes this tree more interesting for Feral.
However, as stated above, there is a huge opportunity to make this tree much more interesting overall by not just adding an Adaptive Swarm-esque ability in the Vines and Blooms, but actually making this tree build on Adaptive Swarm and the gameplay that many of us already enjoy.
And still, with Feral essentially unable to access many of the Restoration-based talents in the Class Tree due to its disproportionately restricting design as compared to other classes, it is a little difficult to get fully excited for a Feral-Resto crossover tree, so if there’s any insight you or anyone can give on how or when our Class Tree will be iterated on, it’d be much appreciated.
But tying it to Regrowth actually means Feral gets to play with Blooms.
As many others have noted, quite boring really.
But as the same time, Feral is doted as one of the busier “plate balancing” specs. While i was hoping for more personal interaction and choices, could the spec really handle juggling more?
Id be either way. Just a little annoying seeing it all be passive and forgettable
I really like what I’m seeing so far, at least from the feral side. What we don’t need, is further rotational complexity - at least that’s my opinion.
They did take away Savage Roar some time ago, so that’s one less plate to spin in retail at least.
Honestly they’ve made Feral too simple. Too much energy means energy management no longer matters. Tiger’s Fury has near infinite uptime so snapshotting barely matters. The spec doesn’t feel like a management spec anymore. I wouldn’t mind if the Feral tree gets reworked just to get some of that identity back.
I guess but then shred or bite need to trigger bloodseeker so resto has a way to proc vines without putting a point in the feral line to keep it even.
And rejuv needs some love in one of these 2 trees besides just the 10% option in keeper, this is a good place to put it.
regardless of tree being good or not, my fear of playing M+ next expansion, the ‘survivability’ issue in both pve and pvp (if it still persists), the sole reason people will take this talent tree over feral/(whatever i forgot) is because of harmonious constitution.
I really dont wanna see that.
I think Rake being a baseline ability alongside or over Shred makes more sense in this case.
Feral’s complexity is largely diminished from prior expansions, honestly. If you were to tie in something with Adaptive Swarm, I don’t think it would increase complexity by that much, unless the player wanted to deep dive into how to properly manage your swarms to maximize the number of them. Which can generally be gleaned from actual gameplay and paying attention to what the swarms are doing. Although managing colonies is mostly an Unbridled Swarm thing, not Adaptive Swarm thing.
I would only be in favor of this if feral got a damage boost commiserate with the added difficulty of the rotation. As it is right now, it’s way more effort than paladin, warrior, BM hunter, for nowhere near enough payoff.
Oh of course. Tuning is tuning. But I’m focusing entirely on playstyle in this thread.
Fair, I just don’t trust Blizzard to do both, lol
From restoration point of view, this tree focuses on Catweaving almost exclusively. Root node and the capstone and various other talent “prep” the targets in the cases of needing on-demand healing via Regrowth while the Druid lay down Efflorescence and go cat.
Besides the fact that Adaptive Swarm wasn’t mentioned anywhere in the tree, personally feel the tree is pretty on-point for Catweaving Resto Druid.
However, a side-effect is that this does seem to pidgeon-hole raid-healing resto Druid into Keeper of the Grove, which sucks for healers hoping for a non-pet raid healing spec, I suppose.
Yea, no thanks.
This isn’t about complexity, frostfire doesn’t add complexity for fire and frost, it’s just shaping up to be a great tree that actually compliments the specs.
And frankly speaking this “complexity” word is overused to the point where it’s starting to lose meaning. The only overly complicated specs i can think of are arcane and outlaw rogue.
That’s it.
Wildstalker is boring as hell. The only thing that has an effect on gameplay is literally a few more seconds of rake, THAT’S IT. How can that ever be considered good design?
::shrugs::
I like it just fine. Personally, I don’t need the ‘hero’ talents to add convolution to my rotation, but that’s my opinion. Not every new addition to the game needs to add more buttons, more reasons to tie my fingers into knots, more reasons to get addons to manage rotations, more reasons to stare at my bar while I should be watching the combat.
If those things are what you enjoy, then there are options for you to explore. Not every class/spec needs to follow that same model.
Also…
There are many more specs than the two you listed that are enormously difficult for some people. Lets give everyone the benefit of a doubt here, okay? What is difficult for one person might be easy for another. The more buttons and rotational quirks added in makes a class or spec less accessible for a segment of the player population.
Buttons and rotational complexity should not be added just for complexity’s sake. A spec can have an easy rotation AND be fun at the same time. Just look at Retribution. It’s the most popular dps spec in the game right now, and while some folks might find it difficult while others might find it boring, a large portion of the population have deemed it good.
While I will say that changing the Blooms to proc off of regrowth is tremendously better than my initial impressions, the tree is still a disappointment from a feral perspective.
I like that the combination of Implant and Vigorous creepers gives us a similar mechanic to our current tier set. I like Flower walk thematically. But the rest… is just boring numbers. I love tossing out my predatory swiftness regrowths as much as the next guy, but if it is just for a chance for some additional healing to happen, that is a big letdown. Also, why is there a talent for moonfire and sunfire damage? Sure they both have access to those spells, but does it really go in the Wildstalker tree?
I would love to see something like a talent that gives Feral efflorescence, and resto gets feral frenzy. That way both specs have another way to proc the other half of these talents. Otherwise, these are just the most boring kinds of feral and resto talents crammed into one tree.
Something I wanted to add to this. If we’re going to make hero talents assuming the selection of a talent at the capstone level in the spec tree, that seems oddly restrictive (this was brought up in the GoE thread relating to Lunar Beam). This brings up a question of where the selection complexity should live.
Before I continue I do want to note that picking up Swarm is significantly easier for Feral than getting Lunar Beam is for Guardian (ignoring tuning).
If we want to make a given Hero tree - and again this might not always be the case for every tree - dependent on a spec talent selection, does it make sense to provide that talent for free? On the one hand the Hero tree doesn’t operate without it, but on the other maybe you want to use that requirement as a way of controlling the tuning of that given Hero tree.
I’ve thought about this some, and I think my current stance is the talent should stay in the spec tree and be provided for free if possible (thus refunding a spec point if it was selected).
I recognize that this is largely a philosophical question, but I think it’s an important one to think about (and maybe you already have) when putting together these trees.