Feedback: The War Within Season 1 Class Sets

Welcome to the War Within Beta!

We’re excited to share the bonuses you’ll discover on Class Sets in The War Within.

Please note: These bonuses will be playable in the second Beta build.

The War Within Class Set Armor Design

We’re aiming for relatively simple bonuses for these class sets to let Hero Talents breathe as the primary focus for The War Within Season 1. We’re still looking to influence gameplay in a light manner, but we want these sets to have a minimal impact on talent selection and as close to zero impact on Hero Talent selection as possible. Similar to the first season of Dragonflight, there are significant changes coming to classes and we would like to establish a baseline we can build upon throughout The War Within.

It’s very important for us that these class sets do not influence Hero Talent Tree selection in meaningful ways. We’d like for players to feel like they can select either Hero Talent choice in any content they participate in. As we move through The War Within, we’ll be exploring ways to increase the complexity of class set bonuses while maintaining this as an obtainable and core goal.

In terms of the gameplay levels players can expect from these bonuses, we aren’t looking to make these demand high levels of focus to optimize. These bonuses generally avoid things such as heavy cooldown reduction, large resource generation, and influencing talent selection particularly in the final gate.

We’d also like to note that there are not currently any plans to change the acquisition of class sets in The War Within Season 1. As in 10.2 Guardians of the Dream, players will receive a Catalyst charge when the season begins and subsequent charges every other week.

Playing with These Bonuses and Providing Feedback

We consider the flow of testing, feedback, final design, and adjustments to be crucial to the success of an addition to the game like new class sets. It’s good to keep in mind that in the first season of The War Within, set bonuses are not intended to have the same high level of impact as previous seasons. As you test the new class sets in The War Within’s Beta and provide your feedback here, please review the following guidelines.

To make a feedback post here, please provide:

  • The class and specialization being discussed
  • The game content type being referred-to (raiding, M+ dungeons, PvP)
  • When and where you feel like your set bonuses will be the most and least useful
  • Some sort of feeling about the above (positive, negative, indifferent)

The types of feedback posts that are most useful include all of the above, and might also detail:

  • How bonuses may not have their expected value, given how the class is often played
  • How bonuses could have very different value in single target and AOE situations
  • How bonuses help or don’t help in specific situations that are relevant to players
  • Likely degenerate or unintended impacts on rotations, including:
    • Using single target abilities in AOE or vice versa
    • Being flooded with resources faster than they can be spent
    • Being encouraged to use core abilities repetitively, or not at all

We’re always on the lookout for posts describing major upheaval in established talent builds.

To try these set bonuses in the Beta once they’re implemented, log into an endgame realm and look for Setzertauren near the current PvP and professions vendors in Orgrimmar and Stormwind City. Please share bugs you find via the in-game bug reporting tool and your feedback about the bonuses in this thread.

Set Bonuses

Death Knight

Blood

  • (2) Set Bonus: While you have one or more Boneshield Charges, the damage you take is reduced by 2%. Losing a Boneshield charge has a chance to reduce the damage you take by 1%, up to 3% for 6 seconds.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Your damage is increased by 1% per active Boneshield charge. Taking damage while below 6 Boneshield charges has a chance to generate 1-2 Boneshield charges.

Frost

  • (2) Set Bonus: Your Runic Power spending abilities deal 8% increased damage.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Consuming Runic Power has a chance to increase your Strength by 10% for 8 seconds

Unholy

  • (2) Set Bonus: Your minions deal 8% increased damage.
  • (4) Set Bonus: When you summon a minion your Haste is increased by 2%, up to 8% for 8 seconds.

Demon Hunter

Havoc

  • (2) Set Bonus: Blade Dance deals 20% increased damage.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Chaos Strike deals 20% increased damage, and has a 25% chance to reset the cooldown of Blade Dance.

Vengeance

  • (2) Set Bonus: Soul Cleave deals 15% increased damage and has a 35% chance to shatter 1 Lesser Soul fragments from a target it hits.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Consuming a Soul Fragment increases the damage and healing of your next Fel Devastation by 2%, up to 30%.

Druid

Balance

  • (2) Set Bonus: Starsurge damage increased by 8%. Starfall damage increased by 10%.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Lunar Eclipse and Solar Eclipse each increase the Astral Power Wrath generates by 1 and Starfire generates by 2.

Feral

  • (2) Set Bonus: Tiger’s Fury increases your chance to Critically Strike for 10 seconds, starting at 6% and increasing by 1% every 2 seconds.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Critical Strikes with your combo point-generating abilities increase the direct damage of your next Ferocious Bite and Rampant Ferocity or Primal Wrath by 15%, stacking up to 3 times

Guardian

  • (2) Set Bonus: Thrash and Moonfire increase your damage done and reduce damage you take by 1% for 8 seconds, stacking 3 times.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Arcane damage you deal is increased by 5% and bleed damage you deal is increased by 8%.

Restoration

  • (2) Set Bonus: Regrowth, Wild Growth, and Swiftmend healing increased by 10%.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Your healing is increased by 8% when consuming Soul of the Forest’s bonus and for 6 seconds afterward.

Evoker

Augmentation

  • (2) Set Bonus: Upheaval deals 30% increased damage and increases the damage of your next 2 Eruption casts by 30%.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Ebon Might increases primary stats by an additional 0.4% of your own every 2 seconds it remains active, up to 2.0%.

Devastation

  • (2) Set Bonus: Disintegrate damage increased by 10% and Pyre damage increased by 10%.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Eternity Surge’s cooldown is decreased by 2.5 seconds and it now grants Essence Burst.

Preservation

  • (2) Set Bonus: Reversion and Emerald Blossom heal an injured ally within 30 yds for 10% of any amount healed.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Verdant Embrace increases the healing of your next Reversion by 200%.

Hunter

Beast Mastery

  • (2) Set Bonus: Barbed Shot further increases your pet’s attack speed by 5%.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Your pet’s attacks have a 10% chance to increase all pet damage you deal by 10% for 8 seconds.

Marksmanship

  • (2) Set Bonus: Arcane Shot and Multishot damage increased by 20%.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Consuming Precise Shots increases the damage of your next Aimed Shot by 10%, stacking up to 2 times.

Survival

  • (2) Set Bonus: Wildfire Bomb damage increased by 5%.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Raptor Strike deals 10% increased damage to targets affected by Wildfire Bomb.

Mage

Arcane

  • (2) Set Bonus: Arcane Blast and Arcane Explosion damage increased by 6%.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Casting Arcane Blast or Arcane Explosion has a 10% chance to make your next Arcane Barrage deal 10% increased damage and grant 4 Arcane Charges.

Fire

  • (2) Set Bonus: Phoenix Flames damage increased by 10%. This amount is increased to 25% on its primary target.

  • (4) Set Bonus: After dealing damage to its primary target, your Phoenix Flames has a 10% chance to return to you, refunding 50% of the cooldown of Phoenix Flames and granting you 6% increased spell damage for 10 seconds.

Frost

  • (2) Set Bonus: Ice Lance damage increased by 5% and Ice Lance increases the damage of your next Frozen Orb by 10%, stacking up to 10 times.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Frozen Orb increases Ice Lance’s damage by 15% for 10 seconds.

Monk

Brewmaster

  • (2) Set Bonus: Blackout Kick and Keg Smash deal 20% additional damage, and Shuffle also grants 3% damage reduction.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Blackout Kick increases your damage dealt by 1% for 15 seconds, stacking up to 3, and has a chance to reset the cooldown of Keg Smash and make its next cast cost no energy.

Mistweaver

  • (2) Set Bonus: Enveloping Mist and Renewing Mist healing increased by 10%.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Vivify extends the duration of Renewing Mist and Enveloping Mist on its primary target by 2 seconds, up to 4 seconds.

Windwalker

  • (2) Set Bonus: Tiger Palm increases the damage of your next melee ability by 5%.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Your melee abilities increase the damage of your next Tiger Palm by 25%, stacking up to 6 times. 15% of Tiger Palm’s damage is dealt onto nearby enemies, reduced beyond 5 targets.

Paladin

Holy

  • (2) Set Bonus: Holy Shock’s healing is increased by 10% and its cooldown is reduced by 10%.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Holy Shock increases the initial healing of your next Word of Glory of Light of Dawn by 8%, stacking up to 4 times.

Protection

  • (2) Set Bonus: Shield of the Righteous deals 10% increased damage and grants 3% damage reduction.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Casting a Holy Power ability increases the damage and healing you deal during your next Avenging Wrath by .5%. This effect stacks.

Retribution

  • (2) Set Bonus: Blade of Justice damage increased by 15% and Wake of Ashes damage increased by 10%.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Wake of Ashes increases your damage by 10% for 8 seconds.

Priest

Discipline

  • (2) Set Bonus: Atonement healing increased by 5.0%.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Smite and Penance increase the damage of your next Mind Blast by 25% or absorb amount of your next Power Word: Shield by 15%, up to 3 times.

Holy

  • (2) Set Bonus: Serendipity is 10% more effective.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Heal, Flash Heal, and Prayer of healing have a 50% chance to cast again at 35% effectiveness.

Shadow

  • (2) Set Bonus: The duration of Devouring Plague is increased by 1 seconds.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Devouring Plague increases your damage done by 2% for 10 seconds, multiple applications may overlap.

Rogue

Assassination

  • (2) Set Bonus: When your bleeds deal damage, they have a chance to grant you Vile Tincture for 8 seconds, increasing your poison damage by 1% per stack (up to 10 stacks).

  • (4) Set Bonus: While you have 5 or more stacks of Vile Tincture, Garrote, Rupture and Crimson Tempest deal 10% additional damage.

Outlaw

  • (2) Set Bonus: Your Sinister Strike, Pistol Shot, and Ambush have a 20% chance to Ethereal Rampage, dealing 15% increased damage as Shadow.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Ethereal Rampage additionally increases the damage of your next Between the Eyes by 6%, stacking up to 3 times.

Subtlety

  • (2) Set Bonus: Symbols of Death increases the damage of your next Secret Technique by 20%.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Secret Technique increases the damage of your other finishing moves by 16% for 7 seconds.

Shaman

Elemental

  • (2) Set Bonus: Earth Shock damage increased by 25%. Earthquake damage increased by 25%.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Spending Maelstrom grants you 5% increased critical strike chance and 10% increased critical damage dealt.

Enhancement

  • (2) Set Bonus: Stormstrike, Lava Lash, Ice Strike and Crash Lightning deal 15% increased damage.

  • (4) Set Bonus: Feral Spirits last 100% longer.

Restoration

  • (2) Set Bonus: Tidal Waves increases the healing of affected spells by 10%.
  • (4) Set Bonus: Tidal Waves is 80% more effective and reduces the mana cost of affected spells by 8%.

Warlock

Affliction

  • (2) Set Bonus: Malefic Rapture damage increased by 5% and its critical strike chance is increased by 10%.
  • (4) Set Bonus: Malefic Rapture has a chance to increase damage dealt by your Agony, Corruption, and Unstable Affliction by 15% for 8 seconds.

Demonology

  • (2) Set Bonus: Your primary demon deals 5% increased damage, and your Shadow Bolt damage is increased by 50%.
  • (4) Set Bonus: Shadow Bolt has a chance to enrage your primary Felguard, increasing the damage of their next Legion Strike by 300%.

Destruction

  • (2) Set Bonus: Incinerate critical strike chance increased by 20%. Conflagrate critical strike chance by 25%.
  • (4) Set Bonus: When Conflagrate critically strikes, your Fire damage is increased by 5% for 6 seconds.

Warrior

Arms

  • (2) Set Bonus: Mortal Strike and Cleave increase the damage of your next Overpower by 10%.
  • (4) Set Bonus: When Overpower has its cooldown reset by Tactician, your next Mortal Strike or Cleave has its damage increased by 10% and critical strike chance increased by 10%, stacking up to 2 times.

Fury

  • (2) Set Bonus: Bloodthirst increases the damage of your next Rampage by 10%.
  • (4) Set Bonus: When Raging Blow resets its own cooldown, the damage of your next Bloodthirst is increased by 10%, stacking up to 2 times.

Protection

  • (2) Set Bonus: When your Shield Slam cooldown is reset by Strategist, you gain Expert Strategist, increasing the damage of Shield Slam by 5% and reducing all damage taken by 3% for 6 seconds.
  • (4) Set Bonus: Shield Slam critical strikes increase the damage dealt by Thunder Clap and Revenge by 10% for 8 seconds.
2 Likes

Hunter/Survival
Game Content: PvE
Pre Hunter rework feedback

Initial concerns: Tuning. The 2pc bonus is looking to be a very low number tuning wise for AoE (~2% at the very, very best) and entirely insignificant for single-target. Like wise, the 4pc doesn’t impact AoE at all, so this set might feel very not great in M+ or AoE encounters.

Single target wise, as mentioned the 2pc is not even a 1% gain and the 4 set is maybe a 2% gain in single target.

Gameplay wise not invasive at all which is nice, it does not strongly encourage either hero tree which is nice. Very on brand for a s1 tier set bonus

2 Likes

Hunter- Marksmanship

PvE Raiding/ Mythic Plus

Pre Hunter Rework Feedback

The previewed 4pc Tier Set for MM on Beta is the kind of thing that desperately needs to be a baseline talent, near the top of the tree, not a conditional gear acquisition from catalyst/raid and limited for only 1 season. It’s a good design, implemented in the wrong place.

Pending the other changes to the spec still, it might need further tuning adjustments regardless because it either results in focus starved and overcapping/munching during Trueshot still, or the other situation of “this isnt strong enough to change trueshot” meaning the same problems that have existed with our major cooldown still remain and this 4pc is wasted during it and needs to be stronger.

3 Likes

I only care about PvE.

Arcane 4-set

This set feels redundant with abilities like Touch of the Magi, Burden of Power/Glorious Incandescence, Arcane Soul, and Orb Barrage. All of these basically are designed around restoring charges after you use Arcane Barrage, this set, due to its RNG nature, is very likely going to result in frequently munching charges generated. There are other issues I can think of with this set, but I think the biggest is that 10% Arcane Barrage damage is likely very weak without the Arcane Charges being leverageable. This needs to be something we can play around instead of a random proc or it runs a severe risk of feeling clunky. Arcane already has quite a bit of randomness in its kit already and adding more is disheartening for players. I love refunding charges on Arcane Barrage, but it needs to be controllable to ensure it doesn’t overlap with our other planned actions.

Frost 4-set

The additional emphasis on Frozen Orb uptime could push Frost Mages towards Spellslinger due to the Spellfrost Teachings resetting Frozen Orb’s cooldown. I loved Packed Ice in BFA and this set is similar so I want it to be great, please don’t drastically change it when considering the above.

1 Like

Enhancement shaman
Gametype: PvP

I like the 2p and 4p bonuses being implemented. I love wolf uptime and some simple buffs to core abilities is a nice plus as far as simple tier goes. My big hope is that it also increases the duration of the storm wolf summoned by stormbringer hero talent tree. In PvE I imagine that it will mean 100% uptime on wolves and a solid enough boost to PvP uptime (I imagine it’ll be 50% or lower duration increase in PvP by the time it makes it live). I wish physical wolves were more than a 5% physical damage increase in PvP to make me really like this tier but all in all I’m happy!

1 Like

Havoc DH
Game content: PvP (mostly) & PvE

I feel like this is crazy op compared to every other set bonus on the list. Probably should be nerfed or tuned down… DH will run amok in arena if they are resetting blade dance every 4 chaos strikes. Idk I could be wrong but it seems crazy op.

Augmentation Evoker
Game content: PvE

…and I feel like this is incredibly terrible compared to every other set bonus on the list.

The 2 set is very very… bad… fundamentally?
The 4 set might be decent if its tuned up a bit… but I guess you are hitting the mark if the goal is simplicity.

I honestly think if you had 2 augs with and without a set bonus, you wouldn’t know who had the tier set because these are so menial

Game content: PvE

This is ok… but it just ends up further buffing Chain Heal when its already incredibly powerful. There is already no real reason to cast any other heal spell as resto… outside of riptide/unleash life to buff chain heal. Why even spec into healing wave or have healing surge on your bars lol.

Just chain heal?

Game content: PvE & PvP

The 2 set is fine if you’re going for simplicity but the 4 set will change how you play with those abilities… if the goal is to not disrupt the way the classes play with the new hero talents, I feel like this misses the mark and should probably be changed.

It will be incredibly powerful in PvP and very lackluster in PvE imo.

As a for fun WW player, FIRST IMPRESSIONS OF COURSE the Windwalker tier set does not feel good. Having Tiger Palm be the main focus doesn’t feel good with the general feel of the class. Talent reworks have been great, but the tier in my opinion should be more focused around spenders.

2 Set- This part feels okay but very clunky to play around as it just simply does not feel like it interacts well with the 4 Set whatsoever; press as filler vs hold for 6 stacks.
4 Set- Beside simply not meshing with 2 Set, this set bonus will never be properly maximized as TP is the only Chi generator outside of procs. There will simply never be a world where you’re able to stack to 6 for efficiency sake. Likewise - beyond the WDP Choice Node - TP is also the only source of Teachings stacks which makes saving casts feel even worse.

Overall, outside of some fine tuning to talents that I’m sure someone else with more practice time can touch on, this tier seems poorly thought out interaction wise, and should be open to rework as recent WW sets have in the past. I look forward to what it could be, thank you.

Unholys tier set is generally very bland, but, gets the job done. Though does bring up some concerns when it relates to the stated goals.

The 2-set bonus here favors Rider of the Apocalypse quite heavily, just due to the sources of damage being pets for Riders. At the same time, with San’layn we instead focus far more heavily on Diseases, reducing the power of the 2pc by ~60% for San’layn compared to Rider of the Apocalypse.

The 4-set on the other hand, almost forces Doomed Bidding in the spec tree, while Summon Gargoyle casts do give 2 stacks of Unholy Commander, unlike the expected 1. We see Doomed Bidding Magus’ spawn once every 8-10s on average, letting us keep the haste buff up for far longer, albeit in a very RNG manner. At the same time, Summon Gargoyle is always cast after Army/Abomination due to its shorter duration, but just before Apocalypse, leading to its stack contribution making no practical difference.

Similar to Doomed Bidding, this does tend to incentivize Army of the Dead over Raise Abomination due to the stacks given over a period of time. Army takes 3.5s to summon all the ghouls, leading to an 11.5s buff duration and 4 stacks from pressing Army. Conversely, Raise Abomination would result in an 8s buff with 2 stacks due to only summoning 2 minions.

2 Likes

Class and Specialization: Blood Death Knight

(2) Set Bonus: While you have one or more Boneshield Charges, the damage you take is reduced by 2%. Losing a Boneshield charge has a chance to reduce the damage you take by 1%, up to 3% for 6 seconds.

(4) Set Bonus: Your damage is increased by 1% per active Boneshield charge. Taking damage while below 6 Boneshield charges has a chance to generate 1-2 Boneshield charges.

Game Content Type: Raiding, Mythic+ Dungeons

Feelings about Set Bonuses:

Positive:

  • The set bonuses align with the Blood DK’s role in enhancing survivability through maintaining Bone Shield and resource management under optimal conditions.

Negative:

  • When Bone Shield charges cannot be effectively lost, the 2-set bonus feels useless, reducing overall survivability in these scenarios.
  • The complexity of maximizing the 4-set bonus conflicts with the stated philosophy of simpler bonuses for Season 1.

Unintended Impacts on Rotations:

Degenerate Impacts:

  • Encourages maintaining a high number of Bone Shield charges for damage output, conflicting with the need to drop below six charges for resource generation.
  • The random chance to generate Bone Shield charges adds unpredictability, leading to potential resource management issues and rotational disruptions.

Detailed Feedback on Specific Issues:

2-Set Bonus:

  • Issue: Ineffectiveness in scenarios where Bone Shield charges cannot be effectively lost (e.g., spell-casting bosses).
  • Impact: Reduces survivability in these encounters.
  • Feeling: This makes the set bonus feel underwhelming and situational.
  • Suggestion: Consider alternative triggers for the damage reduction effect that do not rely solely on losing Bone Shield charges.

4-Set Bonus Complexity:

  • Issue: Conflict between maximizing Bone Shield charges for damage and dropping below six charges for resource generation.
  • Impact: Adds unnecessary complexity and reduces the simplicity intended for Season 1 bonuses.
  • Feeling: Managing this balance feels cumbersome and inconsistent with the season’s design philosophy.
  • Suggestion: Simplify the bonus mechanics to provide more straightforward and consistent benefits.

Ossuary Talent Conflict:

  • Issue: The 4-set bonus requires managing Bone Shield charges in a way that conflicts with the Ossuary talent, which reduces the cost of Death Strike when at or above five Bone Shield charges.
  • Impact: Creates a situation where maintaining fewer than six Bone Shield charges for the set bonus can result in dropping below five charges, negating the Ossuary talent’s benefit.
  • Feeling: This conflict adds further complexity and diminishes the synergy between talents and set bonuses.
  • Suggestion: Adjust the set bonus to avoid conflicting with talents like Ossuary, ensuring smoother gameplay and better synergy.

Summary:

  • The tier set bonuses’ heavy reliance on Bone Shield charges is problematic due to scenarios where charges cannot be effectively lost, resulting in reduced survivability.
  • The complexity of managing Bone Shield charges to balance damage output and resource generation adds unnecessary difficulty, conflicting with the intended simplicity of Season 1 bonuses.
  • The conflict with the Ossuary talent further complicates gameplay, as it requires balancing charges in a way that undermines the benefits of key talents.

Conclusion: By addressing these issues, the set bonuses can become more consistent and less situational, enhancing the overall gameplay experience for Blood Death Knights in various content types. But I actually would like to see a tier set around Death Strike, which is the most iconic spell of BDK.

1 Like

Hunter looks like a remix color of stuff my hunter already has. It is horrific to me and makes me want to stop playing my hunter

1 Like

Can we add Spirit Bomb to the 2pc please. It is used way more in AoE than Soul Cleave and I don’t want to be punished for using it. This might even force some builds to drop Spirit Bomb altogether and force us down the Aldrachi Reaver path, which seems counter to your goal of not wanting to influence hero talent choice. Basically follow the same philosophy as Soul Furnace and Demonsurge and allow me to choose which to use at the right time.

Thanks.

2 Likes

Why shadowbolt, I don’t know any Demo lock that likes to press that button, since the core aspect of the spec is like… demons and demonbolt.

4 Likes

This is a very weird (in a bad way) set both by design and numerically.

By design: it shoehorns us to always attempt to pick ALL talent nodes related to Phoenix Flames, which are located entirely on the left side of the tree and in the process it literally kills builds that would like to take on a more flamestrike/living bomb based approach. This is especially prominent when thinking about AoE scenarios.

Numerically it is abysmally weak too:
The 2p bonus is in the realm of 2% on single target with a build which takes literally every phoenix node in the talent tree, while the 10% chance on 4p is fairly laughable due to how much we actually press Phoenix Flames (last I checked it’s around 10 phoenixes per minute at best).

Numbers aside, Phoenix Flames is notorious for being the clunkiest spell in our kit, with a unresolved delayed impact bug which persists for almost 4 years now and we already just had 2 tiers of being forced into it.

Please reconsider just making a plain ol’ tier bonus tied to Pyroblast/Flamestrike or literally anything that isn’t Phoenix Flames.

Looking at the 4 set here. I could be mistaken, but as talent builds currently stand today there is simply not a spec that will be spamming Raging Blow to fish for resets and this set bonus will be next to non-existent.

1 Like

Spec: havoc
Content: raid/m+
Unfortunately I feel like this tier set goes against the design philosophy of not wanting to push specific hero or capstone talents. While fel-scarred only has a small buff to these abilities when outside of demon form, aldrachi reaver is all about buffing chaos strike and blade dance in a combo, giving it more value from the 20% buffs. In addition, this tierset all but requires us to talent into essence break for the season. It might not say we have to take it for the tierset to work, but there is no world we dont take it if blade dance is being buffed and possibly reset in the window. While not to the same degree as essence break, it also favors shattered destiny (another capstone talent) to extend demonic windows to fit as many buffed death sweep resets in as possible. It also appears to slightly favor relentless onslaught (which is also in the final gate) because it would increase the chance of blade dance resetting. Again, this is different from actually forcing us to take talents like the hunt or fel barrage for it to work so maybe that is ok with the devs, but it feels effectively the same to the majority of players. This tierset is definitely at its strongest when we have CDs rolling, especially if lust is also going, as proccing resets on a 20% buffed death sweep is obviously massive damage. I will say that as far as actually playing it goes it felt nice, but the points listed above have me overall concerned about the pressure it puts on our talents despite the design goal being the opposite.

Arcane Season 1 Set Bonus Feedback

  • Class/Spec: Mage/Arcane
  • Raiding primarily, M+ secondarily.

2-Set bonus: Arcane Blast and Arcane Explosion damage increased by 6%.

Problems: Weak in AOE. Emphasizes the least interesting spells.

The primary issue with this bonus is the discrepency between a single target and AOE. On a single target, Arcane Blast is a significant contributor to throughput, but in AOE, Arcane Explosion is not. Arcane will primarily cast Arcane Barrage and Arcane Orb, and will only cast Arcane Explosion to generate arcane charges and get Nether Precision to amplify the damage of Arcane Barrage. This is compounded on in the Hero talents, where Spellslinger emphasizes Arcane Orb, and Sunfury emphasizes Arcane Barrage. With this in mind, the bonus feels weak and pointless in AOE.

I think Arcane Explosion is in a fine spot where it is used to build up and amplify Arcane Barrage. The only change I would like to see is to change the bonus to affect either Arcane Barrage, Arcane Orb, or both.

Alternatively, it should be possible to make a bonuse that is non-intrusive and also does not just become “All damage increased by 6%”. Suggestion:

  • (2) Set Bonus: Nether Precision grants you X% increased critical strike chance to Arcane Blast and Arcane Barrage.

As already explained, this would work for both single target and AOE and does not change how Arcane plays as generating and spending Nether Precision a core mechanic of Arcane.

Lastly, on a single target, I find Arcane Missiles a lot more interesting, in particular now that Arcane Missiles is more impactful. So I would be more happy if Arcane Missiles became stronger rather than Arcane Blast.


4-Set bonus: Casting Arcane Blast or Arcane Explosion has a 10% chance to make your next Arcane Barrage deal 10% increased damage and grant 4 Arcane Charges.

Problems: Weak in AOE. Wasted resources.

Similar to the 2-set bonus, Arcane Explosion is not a spell Arcane casts often in AOE, so the 4-set bonus simply does not activate very often when compared to a single target. Furthermore, with Arcane Orb cooldown resets from both Spellsplinger and Sunfury and Orb Barrage, the Arcane Charges part of the bonus is often wasted. Because Arcane Charges are so plentiful in AOE, the bonus often just becomes “rarely, Arcane Barrage deals 10% increased damage”. This feels bad, but it is also hard to fix because the Arcane Charge generation is integral to making the bonus work on a single target.

On a single target, the bonus feels pretty good when it does proc, most of the time. It has nice interactions with Nether Precision and Bombardment. The times it does not feel too great is with Touch of the Magi and Arcane Harmony. Since Touch already generates 4 Arcane Charges, that part of the bonus gets wasted if it procs as you do the Arcane Barrage → Touch of the Magi sequence. For Arcane Harmony, I want to save my Arcane Harmony stacks for an upcoming Touch of the Magi window, but then I risk munching 4-set procs and is guaranteed to waste the Arcane Charges if it does proc.

In general, for this bonus to be really interesting, Arcane needs to be better rewarded spending charges than Mana Adept or just more Arcane Charges (Orb Barrage). Mana Adept is extremely weak and is not competitive. An example could be the Arcane Rebound trait from the Arcane Legion artifact or both of the set bonuses from the Antorus tier.

1 Like

Hello Kaivax,

Respectfully, I think the team is making a mistake lowering the power and build defining nature of tier sets to allow for the Hero talent system.

Why not instead, create adaptive, spec based tier sets that change bonus based on hero specialization?

This would promote use for both Hero Talents for a spec, and allow you leeway to add more power back into the tier sets without the tier set itself promoting a particular hero talent build.

More so a way to keep class sets interesting, while promoting a build for both hero specializations.

Thanks,
Caelin

2 Likes

Enhancement M+/Raiding

The 2pc I don’t think favors one hero spec to the other, but if I had to guess I’d say maybe totemic because of it’s capstone. Stormbringer gets the extra crash though so in AOE that might put it over the top.

The 4pc, assuming it applies to the Stormbringer wolf, it heavily favors the the stormbringer hero talent. Stormbringer will have multiple wolves out where Totemic won’t, so it gains much more benefit from the 4pc. This is definitely a thumb on the scale towards stormbringer.

The set bonuses force players into taking talents. Every single thing except stormstrike(it is but it can’t be avoided) is a talent you have to take. It’s entirely possible to have a build where you only have stormstrike. Don’t get me wrong, you’re more than likely to have at least Ice strike and Feral spirit because our talent tree is in desperate need of a rework and those talents are part of the central core of required talents, but some builds don’t utilize ice strike, lava lash, and/or crash lightning and it would suck to lose 3/4 of your 2pc bonus.

It’s also good to note that elemantlist build does not really use stormstrike so they lose 1/4 of the 2pc right off the bat and if you’re taking Ice Strike it really influences taking Hailstorm. It’s never fun being forced into talents even if you were going to pick them anyway.

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Can the restoration druid 4 piece icon be changed a bit, currently i hit swiftmend, get soul of the forest and then get the same icon for the 8% heal bonus after consuming it. Make me think i still have soul up everytime i see it.

Besides that its a perfectly boring but well balanced tier set with no particular leaning for KoG or WS.

Outlaw Rogue

All of it.

They have very low impact at all times, neither affecting gameplay, nor meaningfully impacting damage output.

That feels pretty bad, if I’m honest. I assume that even if they’re not supposed to add mechanical complexity, they’re supposed to still produce a measurable change in output, but even the napkin math doesn’t work out - and it’s worse than that in reality when you play it.

I don’t know what the damage output goals for this tier set are, but if “more negligible than most talent nodes” is the sweet spot, these hit it. The outlaw rogue 2pc bonus has a 20% proc rate for 15% bonus damage on builders that only account for 15% of our damage output - all up, that’s around +0.4% damage. That number is borne out in play - Ethereal Rampage has a pretty sweet visual effect, but just about no change in damage output. The 4pc bonus is only a tiny bit better. At only a 20% proc rate, you can expect to get a bit less than one rampage stack for each between the eyes you cast on average. In reality, it’s worse - outside crackshot windows you’ll actually often overcap these stacks and waste them, and you can’t do anything about it - btte has a CD after all. Being generous, a 6% boost to every btte, when btte only makes up, generously, 20% of the class’s damage output, puts it at only a ~1% change in output, on the generous high end. In reality it’s much lower. All up, both tier bonuses matter less than the difference between capstone talents. If that’s a goal, then… good job? They certainly can’t affect gameplay patterns with benefits tuned that low, anyway. Though even with an order of magnitude higher damage bonuses, I wouldn’t see these tier bonuses affecting outlaw gameplay - between the eyes is already cast on CD (at least if you take improved between the eyes, which everyone does for a number of reasons), and builders are already cast constantly. This tier set very much just gives you a bonus for playing the spec the only way the spec plays - it’s just a bit clunky in so doing and doesn’t actually change the numbers very much.

But hey, as I said, the shadow clone vfx for the 2pc proc looks cool, at least. Get to pretend I’m playing subtlety rogue.

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