FEEDBACK: The Council of Blood

Please use this thread for feedback and bug reports regarding this encounter, or related issues. Noting the nature of your group (Mythic guild premade, PUG, etc.) is helpful, as are any logs.

Thank you to everyone who has come out to help test!

Just tested this for an hour. 2/3/7 pug. Couple thoughts.

  • **[Oppressive Atmosphere]
    Was working fine. Damage seemed a little low and felt manageable. With higher stacks, this will get pretty intense.

[Castellan Niklaus]

[Tactical Advance]
This ability happened perhaps too often. I feel like I got stunned out of nowhere more than once because of this ability. The void zone indicator gets covered up by the Anima explosions more often than not. Maybe make the vertical white indicator more apparent and the anima explosions smaller.

[Unyielding Shield]
Easy enough to manage and see visually.

Just in general, I’m sensing that this raid has too many red indicators in red rooms that make them hard to see.

The Danse Macabre mechanic was amusing once and very very tedious afterwards. You’d have to be pretty silly to screw it up. It’d be more interesting if there were more moves in a row. More fun too would be if there were a reward for doing well. Overall, this mechanic was a let down.

The anima explosions from Frieda and the waltzers both seemed pretty undertuned damagewise. I could get hit by them and barely take any damage.

There was an occasional bug where a player got into the light during Danse Macabre and saw the new buttons but still got oneshot before the dance began.

Pretty fun fight! We tested in an 11-man group. I liked that your kill order is up to you, and I can imagine some groups might want to swap their orders depending on their available utility.

  • That said, Scarlet Letter seemed so difficult to help soak that I have a hard time imagining not killing Baroness first.
  • We often had a bug where, even when someone got in the beam of light, they would be instantly killed as if they weren’t. Here’s a link to my VOD of it: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/695540652?t=01h48m28s
  • You could stand up near the stage area and completely avoid all of the waltzers.
  • The amount of voiceovers is a little high. I think the charge dude doesn’t need to talk every time he charges.
  • The damage from getting hit by the waltz also seems a bit low.
  • The link on Dark Recital should probably change color to indicate you are correctly close to one another.
  • The dance mechanic seems fun, but even on Heroic this seems way too easy and slow-paced. I think it should be sped up, you should have to remember 2-3 moves in a row (on Heroic, more on Mythic), and it should be individual to you.

too many red abilities. Charges need a bigger and more robust telegraph. Dancing takes too long and is too easy at the current pace. when we gripped scarlet letter targets the ring didn’t come with them like it should

The fight felt like, once Frieda was dead, it was pretty much over. We stacked in front of Niklaus, ate the Charge, dodged the dance, and then Niklaus died, and then it was… …just killing Stavros, with nothing going on, at all. It was exceptionally straightforward. Mythic might add some more mechanics, but as is, if you do Frieda first, it’s just not really a factor.

Scarlet Letter sending people to EITHER side is a little rough. We had one near-wipe from having to soak it on the far side, and then having to SPRINT back to the start for Danse Macabre. I get it should be a factor, but as it is, on Heroic, I just don’t see groups not killing Frieda first.

The damage seemed incredibly undertuned. The DoT was just never a meaningful factor at any point, and everything, from Tactical Advance to Anima Fountain to the dancers was so low it could be basically ignored. Tactical Advance was hitting for 45 damage.

Niklaus shouted basically every 3 seconds. He never shut up, shouting over and over about falling to his blade until I was ready to throw myself off a bridge.

Danse Macabre was bugged. We had many moments where people reached their spots, but then, once the UI popped up, their characters weren’t standing in place and they died. Once, after we all reached our spots, the entire raid just wiped instantly for no identifiable reason. If we all did it correctly, it was still just sort of a dull mechanic - you go, it slowly tells you to hit 1, 2, 3 or 4 at a sloth-like pace, and then you’re done. It takes far too long for how simple it is, especially considering how late in this dungeon this boss appears to be. It feels like it either needs to be an actual mechanic that someone COULD conceivably screw up, or it just needs to be much, much shorter, because as is it’s just 15 seconds every 2-3 minutes of doing basically nothing. I guess the mana regen is nice, but the fight isn’t so healer intensive that feels necessary.

EDIT: I did forget two items, one real, one sort of a pet peeve:

The pet peeve is that Unstoppable Charge sounds like an ability that actually moves the boss. It’s not a big deal, but he doesn’t charge anywhere, and he doesn’t need to be stopped, he just slams in a line in front of him. It’s fine, it’s not a big deal, just a thought I had.

Second, as some other people reported, Hunters feigning death, or if you wipe during Danse Macabre, the bosses just don’t reset, and you can then return to the fight and they’ll still be there, and you can reengage them. Once, it happened, Frieda was already dead, and the other 2 bosses continued to do mechanics as though Frieda was there, with Niklaus charging around and Stavros not linking people after we reengaged, which took us a little bit to do while they just stood there on the dance floor politely waiting. It seems like it’d be a long way to walk for a short drink of water to recreate the bug on live, but if we’d wanted, we could’ve just killed the bosses like that and never seen the add phase on that kill.

15 raid pug with voice comms. Here are the logs: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/W6c2Ld9vZf1arxPM

A couple things that you might look into is the overlap of the red puddles with scarlet letter. That felt a bit rough if you go to stand on the scarlet letter person and then can’t cause of the red puddles. Might as well just consider the scarlet letter person dead.

The amount of talking is insane. Some form of throttle for the talking would be appreciated.

Feels unintended how you can avoid the dancers if you stand at the very front.

Went in with a group of around 25, 2/5/18 or so. Mostly pug group.

Logs can be found here - https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/CPkVZvMYj4fxQt8L

Solid fight but I think it needs some tweaks.

  • Red anima fountain + red circle from the dancing adds + red from the shield is just so much red overlapping at once.
  • If Hunters feign death on a wipe, it will prevent the bosses from resetting. This can be used if you have a boss dead already to get everyone back in and pull and start at phase 2 or phase 3. When this happens, the bosses also don’t necessarily have their empowered abilities (Frieda had scarlet letter, Niklaus didn’t have unstoppable charge).
  • For us we had the most issue with Stavros being killed first as at times we have the dark recital pair a melee and a ranged or melee and healer and the constant moving required sucks for non-melee. My guess is whichever you can handle best (dark recital or scarlet letter) depending on raid group will determine first kill and Niklaus being final boss alive is just very easy.
  • Niklaus is kind of a joke anyways, but for giggles we killed him first and the melee just hated their lives.
  • Scarlet letter does not indicate a stack to shared damage in the encounter journal, in fact it seems to indicate the opposite, but it is a stack.
  • Dark recital will remain active during danse macabre and can kill people. Not sure if you just have to time it so it isn’t up during (ala scarlet letter, which we pushed to danse when letter was up and had everyone sent to soak die) or if the danse should break it.
  • Tank damage seems very high compared to raid damage, the dot was worthless as it resets during danse and when a boss dies.

The bosses also talk a lot. Like all the time. This was a stark difference compared to the Huntsman. That being said, not sure if it can be changed considering it is tied to their abilities which seem to come at a solid pace.

A quick bug report:

  • Hunter’s disengage was able to be used during the Scarlet Letter mechanic (mid-air) and completely canceled out the mechanic from happening at all.
  • During the Danse Macabre, players going into their designated spots were still killed in the process before the mini-game started.
  • Castellan Niklaus’ Unstoppable Charge was being aborted and attempted to re-cast each time a targeted tank would move(?) and basically allowed us to ignore him the entire time until he was the last boss alive.
  • Scarlet Letter can disengaged while in mid-air cancelling the mechanic.
  • Probably cut down their voice lines a bit.

I think many people hyped up the Dance mechanic a lot, and were largely disappointed by it. For a gimmick mechanic, especially one that represents the ONLY thing you are doing at the time, the gimmick needs to work and right now it feels very unsatisfying, especially for Heroic when compared to a fight like Mekkatorque.

  • Some players were expecting the Dance on Heroic to be a memory or communication mechanic.
    – Memory like the Multi-sided Strike ability on Jadefire Masters
    – Communication Mechanic like on Mekkatorque.

Now of course, we haven’t seen the Mythic mechanic, but I’m hoping for something great from the Mythic version of the Danse Macabre and a little more on Heroic.

  • You could pair players up, have one player see the dance moves that the other in the pair needs to perform. You see the dancers that go across the floor and in the air are partnered in pairs why not do the same.
  • Going even further, each move only one person in the raid gets the instructions for the entire raid to do.
    Communication mechanics are something that I feel like WoW has scratched the surface on, and I think this would be a great spot to do more.
2 Likes

Hi, we had around 16 people for the fight, consisting of 2 to 3 groups of premade players. Here’s the link to the logs
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/KkC2mHrDTZV6Wdtx/#fight=13&type=damage-done

The ‘Dark Recital’ (player link) mechanic frequently overlapped with Dance Macabre and Scarlet letter. This resulted in linked players taking significant damage outside of their control.

If Dark Recital overlaps with Dance Macabre, both players are automatically separated while suffering from continuous and uncontrolled damage. In one instance, there was also a bug where a linked player could not see their additional buttons for the dance, while sustaining damage from Dark Recital.

An overlap between Dark Recital and Scarlet Letter meant that one of the linked players could randomly get thrown to the other end of the room, followed by a crowd-control. This forces the opposite player to travel a significant distance while sustaining a potentially lethal damage.

A possible suggestion for the dance mechanic would be that it work like an actual dance, in that you are paired with 1-3 other people, and while a general dance is called, your specific role in that dance (and what you need to press to complete it) would vary pull-to-pull.

So as a basic example, you could be paired and have to perform a basic box step, which would mean 1 player goes forward - right - back, and the other goes back - left - forward.

Granted, explaining all of this in a dungeon journal might be difficult. But I think that the general idea of making this an actual DANCE, where you have to coordinate with other people, rather than effectively pressing X, Y, A or B as dictated, would make this more engaging and more suitable as a stop-everything-you’re-doing style mechanic.

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Ran into a funny issue where if you failed the dance and were ported up and stunned outside of the arena.

The stun lasts longer than the phase (which seems intentional) but this causes an odd side-effect due to the fact that the bosses can target you for mechanics. We had the bosses charging to people on the sides and getting stuck outside of LoS of the rest of the raid. Seems like that is likely not intended. :slight_smile:

Overall it was fun. Dance mechanic was a little underwhelming and somewhat buggy. We had an issue where if you used movement abilities to get into the dance circle, you could get desynced after freezing in the circle and get ported back out of the circle only to die. Saw this happen when using Grappling Hook, for example.

Scarlet Letter seems really unfair. As others said, this strongly encourages killing Frieda first. I don’t think the difficulty of the other abilities is actually undertuned as much as Frieda is just too much.

The voice lines were mega OTT. :smiley:

Cool fight though, really enjoyed it.

Dance Bugs

If you have an immunity or displacement effect when you go into the dance zone, it counts as you never entering so you just die.

Voice Line Frequency

After the first boss died, it was more tolerable, but the first few minutes of the fight were insanely annoying to listen to.

Scarlet Letter

It feels as though there should be a way to bait it to the closest edge rather than random edges, if it went too far away we just sacrificed that player.

Fight Feels Empty

The fight starts off hectic, but as you kill the bosses it becomes more chill. Seems possible counter intuitive to the design?

Ability Overlaps

The Unstoppable Charge overlapped with the Anima Fountain far too often making it difficult to soak.

Unstoppable Charge

The radius/range of this conal is really small.

1 Like

The dancing venthyr that come across when all 3 are alive dont go all the way to the front so theres a safe spot that the entire raid can fit in and avoid that mechanic completely

Not sure if it’s intended but Niklaus is tauntable. So if you are trying to focus him, if he jumps too far away, a class who can taunt him and lead him to an area that you want him to be in.

Our group was attempting a strat where we focused him down first to see what happens in phase 2. So we had our tanks take Stavros and Baroness on the far side while the rest of the dps took down Niklaus. But while the tanks were positioning the two bosses, Nik would jump to one of the tank healers. So we had myself (Windwalker Monk) Provoke Nik until he stayed on the dps side of the room.

13m mostly guild group with a couple pugs, voice coms

We noticed much of the same that has already been noted.
The voice lines were too frequent.
Nikalus also seemed to be inconsistent with indicating where he was jumping. His direction was always accurate but there wasn’t always the ground indicator so the player could move out. I think someone mentioned it above being covered by the blood pools, however we had the bosses separate and didn’t have the blood pools but there was still about a 60% chance that you would see where he was charging to with Tactical Advance.
One question - does Stavros favor mobile classes? May have just been RnG with Dance Recital but as BM hunter, I was paired every single time.
Not sure if intentional, but dance recital targets can be targeted by scarlet letter, but the scarlet letter root didn’t seem to cause damage from not moving with dance recital.
I tend to agree with the above as well that damage seemed undertuned and most mechanics could be ignored.
I also thought that it seemed unintentional that you could stand at the front of the room and not even deal with the waltzing dancers. Because of the above, it was a minor inconvenience just to eat the Tactical Advances if you had to.
Experienced the problem that if your were near where your assigned spot was for Intermission, it would kick you out and then kill you. This seemed to be if it spawned directly on the player or within 2y of the player (very close). This was repeatable.
The journal was very unclear as to how Scarlet Letter would share the damage. It would be helpful to edit this to be more clear.

2 Likes

Thanks Blizzard for allowing us to test and no random disconnects :slight_smile:

With that said, a few of the issues we encountered are already stated in this thread:

  • Way too much voice acting going on that should be pruned a bit as I know a lot of people play with sound on
  • The amount of red from various mechanics on top of the floor being brown/red is a bit much. If possible, it would be helpful to adjust the colors a tad bit. Mainly the Dark Recital having some sort of difference in color to tell you when you are close enough to the other player or not.
  • There were numerous times where we went into the circle for the dance but just died instantly. I’m sure this will be fixed.
  • Scarlet Letter sending you to the other side of the room in a small raid seems way too punishing. Maybe a central location would be helpful or the side with the most people?

Where there could be improvements:

  • Less Tactical Advance’s. It really punishes melee and when it occurs right after a mechanic where people are spread a bit more, it’s feels awful to play less mobile melee classes. You could accompany this change by upping the damage done in the line that he charges in.
  • Harder Dance. The mechanic itself was very underwhelming as mentioned by most other people. Maybe have this in set groups or much faster movements. I’m curious to see how it functions on Mythic
  • Scarlet Letter. I can’t imagine a 10 man group trying to deal with this on heroic when it’s on the other side of the room. It should either be on one side and the middle or one side. Trying to get to the other side to help deal with it in a small raid isn’t very forgiving.

All in all, decent fight and with a few changes I’m sure it could be fantastic.

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I was in the same group as Choppeh.

It was a fun fight but very buggy lol.

Not sure if our tanks were just really hyperactive or if the bosses really move around that much/need to be moved around that much but it felt like it would have been a nightmare for melee and it was extremely difficult to use the AoE ability from the tar trap legendary with them moving so much, which would go for any AoE ground effect.

The lines of dancers seemed to not always stun when the circle went through you. There were a couple of times it went under my feet but I had no stun. It also was a very brief stun.

The damage of the red puddles on the ground was low but there were so many of them that if it’s actually tuned to do damage this fight is going to be hell for casters. As BM it wasn’t an issue for me but the casters seemed unhappy.

The link from Dark Recital is clear enough but it picks ranged-melee pairings way too much it feels like. No one actually likes getting mechanics that will 100% destroy your DPS. It also really needs to cancel at major mechanics like Danse Macabre. I had it when Danse went out once and me and my partner were nowhere close and we were just standing still, separated, taking lots of damage no one could do anything about.

Danse was… Underwhelming. Slow paced. The in-game indications of the mechanics are kind of irritating to look for, having to look over to read the chat. I don’t play with game sound on because I have auditory processing issues so if there’s a less annoying auditory signal great but not everyone can or wants to play with sound on so something more friendly to that would be nice. Maybe a glowing arrow at your feet? That’d be great. It also seemed to not actually accept the commands a couple of times.

The 30 second stun for failing it seems overly long but it could be worse I guess.

Scarlet Letter was a massive pain to deal with. We tried tanking in the middle but it was still kind of a mess and the dungeon journal is not at all clear about the split.

The bosses do not like to reset and we had issues with both feigned Hunters and Warlocks running Absolute Corruption. At one point people who’d released after a ‘wipe’ the bosses remained in combat after were able to go back in and continue a bugged fight.

I was able to see the white thing for the charges most of the time but if it’s behind you or under something you won’t see it and there isn’t much of a telegraph visually on the bosses. Again, a bit of an accessibility issue and also apparently an annoyance issue given the number of people complaining about too much boss chatter in this thread.

Overall it’s got the makings of a really fun fight, it just needs some tuning and the danse macabre bit spruced up.

1 Like

Fight was buggy (if you kill Lord Stavos Last, he doesnt do anything)

Dislikes:

  • Choose your own adventure encounter, there will be a correct way to kill this boss (EX: Boss 1, then 3, then 2) and that will likely be the best ways. Knowing this means trying that the key to learning this fight is going to be learning only one route (Best guess: Kill Baroness Frieda, then Niklaus, then Stravros) . I would very much like to see weekly rotation on which boss can die first.

  • With the last point, my biggest issue is that Scarlet Letter is SIGNIFICANTLY Harder than Dark Recital or Unstoppable Charge. And we couldnt test Castellans Cadre (Time) or Dancing Fools (bugged and was not working) the tuning just seems off on the second tier of abilities.

  • The Danse Macabre is too easy: You have 3 seconds on heroic to click your button. I would like to see either less time to react OR randomizing where each button is every Danse (EX: Shimmy is 3 on the first dance, and 2 on the second dance). If the Danse isnt made more interesting then it will just be boring/arduous.

  • Oppressive Atmosphere is boring, the damage it deals is low. I feel as though it should also apply a slow to each player so that you cant just heal through the damage, because the fight has an enormous amount of movement.

  • The Shields/Bosses corpses should stay on the ground so Necrolords can fleshcraft off of them (This may already be in, I was not playing as necrolords for this fight, But I am concerned with necrolords having as many opportunities as possible to have cool moments)

Overall I really enjoyed this encounter and if released as is, I think it is too easy for how late in the instance it is, and its encounter “hook” is weak and will end up being unfun (The Danse)