FEEDBACK: Priest Class Changes

Two points. One regarding the Kyrian Ability with Holy Priests and the second a suggestion to help Holy feel stronger in Plus.

Regarding Holy Priest and the Kyrian ability:

The ability is great. However, as a holy priest, it feels awkward to use. The portion that replaces Smite temporarily (Ascended Blast) is the big issue. For Disc., they always target baddies so it’s feels natural for them. For Holy, though, we have to alter our play style in a way that I feel is a detriment.

Suggestion:

Allow Ascended Blast to be targeted on allies as well as enemies. In it’s current iteration the Holy Priest has to swap from targeting allies on their raid frame to some enemy to cast Ascended Blast, then back to their allies, then back to the enemy. This generally results in us (holy) getting less stacks than we should.

One could argue that if you’re using the Kyrian ability, you should just focus on building stacks, but, in practice, you’re often popping this ability when it is hitting the fan, so you have to do other spells in between. If Ascended Blast could be cast on allies, we could build stacks while not having to disrupt our gameplay too much.

For the help in plus:
Would it be feasible to add Echo of Light to our offensive spells? This would help Holy be able to do more damage in mythic plus (maybe keep up with some of our healing brethren) and make it so mastery isn’t a dead stat for 5 mans. Currently, you have to build out a raid set but any gems/enchants for mastery are wasted for mythic plus content. We’re already pretty weak in plus (not throughput, but in other utility/damage), and having our best raid stat be our worst in plus is kind of rough.

Thanks!

4 Likes

MY SW:D has been criting against elites for 33K. While nice, it creates a large problem if the elite doesn’t die :skull_and_crossbones: Against regular mobs it crits for 6-7K. I am a lvl 52 disc priest. is this normal?

Further point for the use of SW:D. It is a problem when questing and the quest has you sparring or dueling with NPCs that cannot die. The SW:D mechanic puts that damage back to you. :worried:

Currently mindgames is incredibly underwhelming and undertuned. Compared to unholy nova and Boon the throughput gain from it isnt worth hitting the global for disc or holy and im not sure why any disc or holy priests would choose venthir if it goes live like this. It should be the stated value per player and not a lump sum. In m+ and raid it will do less than a percentage of overall healing vs unholy or boon doing 10-15% of overall. Also, the mana gain from it is split on half for whatever reason so you can’t get the full 4% unless a particular mob will do damage AND heal within 5 seconds.

Side note: none of the covenant abilities actually interacts with any of the 3 priest specs besides mindgames for Shadow(they all trigger atonement but that doesn’t make it feel like priest abilities). I’m not sure what RPG meaningful choice a priest is making to pick these abilities that have 0 interaction with their class, especially holy priests. Looking around at other classes it is very clear how some abilities have synergy with some core abilities of a class and it feels pike the devs forgot to add anything like that for priests

3 Likes

I have been getting 6-7K crits on my Disc priest (lvl 52) for non-elite mobs and for some strange reason was getting 32-33K crits on elites mobs.

1 Like

Greetings,

We’ve heard your feedback on Shadow Priests and spent some time performing more extensive changes to the spec – including changes to baseline skills and talents. Most importantly, we’ve taken a deeper look at Voidform.

Voidform

Along with Insanity, Voidform was introduced in Legion as a central component of a Shadow Priest redesign that explored the fantasy of tapping into dark, mind-twisting void magic for temporary power. From a gameplay standpoint, this was expressed as building up Insanity, entering Voidform, then battling against decaying Insanity to prolong your time in this powerful state. This design has not been a clear winner for several players as we often receive feedback that people do not enjoy fighting the resource decay in order to inflict reasonable damage. On the other hand, we also hear from people who enjoy Voidform but feel it is not transformative enough. Over time, the design has proved problematic and Voidform uptime has dominated the spec, going far beyond our original intention. Now, any talents, items, legendaries, etc. that do not feed into Voidform are considered undesirable. We want time in Voidform to feel more impactful and as a result, we are limiting the time you can undergo the transformation by applying a cooldown. By default, the ability will no longer have the decaying resource mechanic, but that gameplay will be more appropriately placed in the redesigned talent, Legacy of the Void, so that players can have the option to choose the “legacy” feel of Voidform.

Devouring Plague

Feedback suggested the duration of Devouring Plague was too long. While we reduced the duration from its historic 21 second duration to 12 seconds, we agree this still feels too long so we’re reducing it further to 6 seconds. We’ve also fixed bugs that prevented Devouring Plague from scaling with Haste or Critical Strike and we’ve also increased its damage.

General Gameplay

We’re introducing a new passive called Dark Thoughts that adds a baseline proc in the rotation which we feel spices up the general rotation. We want damage over time effects to matter to Shadow Priests, so we’ve made it so Dark Thoughts and other mechanics interact with that core theme.

Talents

We’ve gone through a number of talents and made adjustments in an effort to make choices a bit more competitive in a variety of situations. Unfurling Darkness and Psychic Link support Shadow Priests multi-dotting strength, while Damnation and Surrender to Madness provide tools for Shadow Priests to quickly burst targets down when the encounter demands it.

Lastly, we want to spotlight the new talent, Searing Nightmare. Searing Nightmare can assist Shadow Priests in situations like Mythic+ where higher sustained AOE could be useful.

Thanks everyone for your feedback and your unending passion.

Baseline Changes

  • Void Eruption’s cast time is reduced by 40%.
  • Mind Blast (Rank 2) reduces cooldown of Mind Blast by 7.5 seconds (was 7 seconds).
  • Shadow Word: Death no longer generates Insanity.
  • Shadowy Apparitions re-designed – When you use Mind Blast, Devouring Plague or Void Bolt you also create a shadowy version of yourself that floats towards all targets afflicted by your Vampiric Touch dealing Shadow damage. Critical Strikes will cause two Shadowy Apparitions to be created.
  • Voidform
    • Now has a 90 second cooldown and now increases damage by 20% and lasts for 15 seconds.
    • Voidform no longer reduces the cooldown of Mind Blast, but now refreshes the cooldown of Mind Blast and you gain 2 charges while in Voidform.
    • You no longer gain Haste every 0.5 seconds while in Voidform.
  • Devouring Plague
    • Devouring Plague’s duration reduced to 6 seconds and damage increased by 50%.
      • Developers’ note: Lowering the duration of the damage over time effect to make it punchier so that sequential Devouring Plague’s don’t overlap (accounting for potential overflow).
    • Devouring Plague will now properly critically strike.
    • Devouring Plague is now a level 20 spell.
  • New Spell
    • Dark Thoughts (Passive) (Level 16) – For each of your damage over time effects on the target, your Mind Flay and Mind Sear have a 2% chance to instantly add a charge of Mind Blast, causing it to be instantly cast, and allowing it to be cast while channeling Mind Flay or Mind Sear within 6 seconds.
      • Dark Thoughts can stack up to 5 times for situations where the Shadow Priest will proc many in a short time.

Talents

  • Tier 15
    • Shadowy Insight has been removed.
    • Shadow Word: Void has been removed.
    • Death and Madness is now available on this tier.
    • New Talent: Unfurling Darkness – After casting Vampiric Touch on a target, your next Vampiric Touch is instant cast and deals 155% SP Shadow damage instantly. This effect cannot occur more than once every 15 seconds.
  • Tier 40
    • New Talent: Psychic Link – Mind Blast deals 60% of its damage to all targets afflicted by your Vampiric Touch within 40 yards.
  • Tier 45
    • Lingering Insanity has been removed.
    • Dark Void has been removed.
    • New Talent: Searing Nightmare – Instantly deals Shadow damage to all enemies around the target and afflicts them with Shadow Word: Pain. If the enemy is already afflicted by your Shadow Word: Pain, Searing Nightmare deals double damage. Only usable while channeling Mind Sear.
    • New Talent: Damnation – Instantly afflicts the target with Shadow Word: Pain, Vampiric Touch and Devouring Plague free of cost. 45 seconds cooldown.
    • Void Torrent – No longer pauses your Insanity while used, but now refreshes the duration of your Shadow damage over time effects on the target while its channeling.
  • Tier 50
    • Dark Ascension has been removed.
    • Legacy of the Void re-designed – Voidform no longer has a duration. However, during Voidform your Insanity will drain increasingly fast until it reaches 0 and Voidform ends. Voidform increases spell damage by an additional 5%.
    • Surrender to Madness – Reduced to a 90 second cooldown.
    • New Talent: Ancient Madness – Entering Voidform increases your critical strike chance by 30% for 15 seconds, reducing its effect by 2% per second.

PvP Talents

  • New Talent: Lasting Plague – Increases the duration of Devouring Plague by 6 seconds.
121 Likes

Shadow Priest Rework Thoughts

Blizzard has destroyed the Shadow Priest fantasy with this change.

Even if you do not like Voidform or you prefer Orbs, the gameplay fantasy of Voidform is the single most visceral feeling in the game and they have effectively removed it. Voidform is about getting increased haste to mimic the descent into madness. Anything else is Voidform in name alone.

Instead of trying to embrace that fantasy, they have removed the gameplay option from the game entirely with this rework. I don’t care that you can talent into existing Voidform because existing Voidform is not fun.

And instead of trying to make Voidform engaging and worth the fantasy it promises to deliver, they have decided to go the opposite route, and spend a ton of development time; designing it differently to where it is unrecognizable to Voidform.

I spent the better part of two months building a better Voidform in hope to demonstrate to the community that Voidform can be saved with just a few tweaks. And that its past flaws are not inherent to its design.

You can play with my design here.
https://voidform-optimizer.com/?template=ryeshot
And you can view my philosophy behind the design here.
https://voidform-optimizer.com/articles/design-philosophy

I also spent some time to write up an analysis on why Voidform has failed in this past. You can read it here.
https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/an-analysis-on-the-failings-of-voidform/593227?u=ryeshot-icecrown

Over this beta cycle, the Shadow Priest community has had a schism of those who want to #removevoidform and those who want to #savevoidform. We all knew that this would result in one side losing, and it looks like it was the latter side.

Because this isn’t Voidform.

37 Likes

Can’t wait to try this out. People are going to need to get over their relative expectations (From any side of the debate. Just because this isn’t VF doesn’t mean it’s by default amazing) and provide informative and useful feedback on what is Infront of them. Looking forward to seeing how it all fits together and what continues to be iterated on.

128 Likes

tried it. it’s awful. i for one welcome our new (old) shadow orb (increments of 20 insanity) overlords.

44 Likes

i mean you say “they destroyed the fantasy” as if this "fantasy’ has been around for longer then 2 expansions.
cause how it is now, is how it has been for most of history, your fantasy versions has only been around for a very short time.

150 Likes

I can’t wait to try this out. I’m really excited it for it. I understand why Shot is upset and it’s unfortunate that those who love what Shadow has become has to lose what they love about the spec while those of us who loved what shadow was finally got what we feel we lost back.

That aside thanks so much for listening and giving this a shot. I look forward to testing this out and giving as much feedback as I can on new shadow.

Also forget what I said about shadow ravens in void form, can we get a glyph that turns shadow form into raven shadow form? Lol, thanks.

79 Likes

As Taliesin would say: “EEEEEEEEEEEEEE!”

17 Likes

Excited to try these changes in the next build. Thanks for the reply.

24 Likes

Grats you just alienated another group of players; don’t see how LOTV delivers what we love about voidform gameplay. All I see is another dull dps spec to add to the pile of trash.

Nice ‘safe’ design…does’t make it FUN
Typical blizzard to just solve problems on paper and don’t think about what is FUN in the game and build upon a success by refining it’s implementation

16 Likes

Except instead of making any effort to preserve it, they removed it.

6 Likes

Objectively not true. It was changed into a talent. They are trying to give both sides a bone here. How about we try it prior to shaming the hard work of the developers?

77 Likes

It doesn’t provide stacking haste. That is the core of Voidform’s design.

7 Likes

Also, perhaps that can be some feedback for the talented version when we try it?

8 Likes

They don’t have TIME it is impossible to have time to fix this crap they just threw at the wall.

A rework isn’t going to deliver polish; especially in the time that’s remaining

9 Likes

LOTV is still there. it’s like all the other unpopular playstyles (momentum DH for example). exists and is undertuned so you’re not forced to play it.

10 Likes