FEEDBACK: Mythic Keystone Dungeons

Prideful is cool as hell. Credit where credit is due, thank you for listening and introducing Kiss/Curse affixes.

1 Like

Summary for Prideful

  • Overall, low complexity, high depth. Fantastic design.

Specific Feedback

  1. Due to the way Belligerent Boast spawns, the “correct move” is to permanently stack and thus no one has to move as the missiles spawn around the player.
    1a. This is a lot due to Belligerent Boast doing so much damage if a player is hit (and the fact that it allows it), compared a basically non-existent stun. Getting hit by Boast is basically a death sentence with the pulsing AoE, and it almost feels like Boast should be more about the disruption from the stun than a flat out kill. That being said, Boast is well telegraphed and it is easy to dodge when you can see it.
    1b. Unsure exactly how, but you can stun yourself with your own Boast. Needs more testing to figure out how it works.
    1c. Just like other ground spells in the Necrotic Wake Necropolis, Boast does not fire any missiles. This is a Necrotic Wake Necropolis thing though.
  2. The Manifestation of Pride not being targetable during its spawning animation means it will get off one “random” melee before a guaranteed taunt can land. Please let it be targetable during the spawning animation, so taunts can land a taunt the second it lands.
  3. The Manifestation of Pride is skippable. You’re making a tradeoff here of losing the damage buff which obviously is a choice. As keys start to get higher and higher, it starts to become not really a choice. You have to pump increasing amounts of damage and healing into the Manifestation of Pride, and the Manifestation of Pride starts to require more and more cooldowns that a 30% damage buff isn’t worth the tradeoff. You’re still probably going to see people skipping it (if possible) using the Theatre of Pain teleporters, Spires of Ascension angels, Night Elf meld. If this is not intended, the Manifestation of Pride probably needs to snap or have a global aggro radius.

Will write dungeon feedback stuff later, since I have a lot of thoughts.

Logs: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/XwqPjm3zLbpJVnBQ

2 Likes

Make a 5/5 Pride killed requirement for dungeons with the Prideful Affix. Similar to 100% trash and 100% bosses killed for completion.

1 Like

Just finished my first +10 on time while doing all the new affixes at the same time. and my suggestions would be:

  1. Spiteful shouldnt proc from little adds, just like there are some adds that dont spawn explosive or bolster or even burst.

  2. The procs from storming seemed a little overwhealming in small areas since it procs a lot from little amount of adds. making it almost impossible to manage some add packs in small rooms. and i think small adds where spawning or increasing the spawn rate for this aswell. maybe lower it.

So, I just want to throw in my 2c of feedback but I also want to preface it by saying that I have not personally tested M+ on the Beta. I am saying this as someone who is not color blind and as someone who has no major vision problems.

I am really not a fan of how Storming looks, visually, on the Beta right now after having seen it in action in both screenshots and video footage. It looks to be pretty much a copy paste of the tornado’s in the Tidesage Council encounter of Shrine of the Storm. Which, mechanically is fine, but for me personally I have always struggled to see those tornado’s in the heat of action.

Visually, the color and transparency in the heat of things makes them somewhat hard to spot and paired with the fact that they are so cylindrical it kinda messes with my depth perception a bit.

I think it would be really helpful if the base of the tornado’s had a much clearer visual effect on the ground itself. Maybe a lightning circle of some kind, that would fit the “Storming” theme, yeah? Just something to make it stand out more.

The nice thing about Affixes like Volcanic, Quaking, Explosive, etc was that they all have very clear visuals you can’t miss. Even the new affix, Inspiring has a very strong visual that makes the creatures stand out (Kinda reminds me of a D2 Paladin Aura haha)

I really think it would be nice, if this is going to be an Affix we have the entirety of Shadowlands if not longer, if the visual could be made a bit clearer and stronger. I think the mechanics of Storming will freshen things up but I really believe that, for me, the visuals are going to make the mechanic more frustrating than anything when you also throw in player spell effects and enemy spell effects. I really think that Storming would benefit from a stronger visual, at least at the base/ground point, of the Tornado.

8 Likes

Greetings and thank you for all your help testing Mythic+ so far! We wanted to share details on some affix updates in this week’s Beta build:

  • The following affixes are taking a break for Shadowlands Season 1. They may return in the future!
    • Teeming
    • Skittish
  • The following new affixes can appear starting at Keystone Level 4.
    • Spiteful
      • “Fiends rise from the corpses of non-boss enemies and pursue random players.”
    • Inspiring
      • “Some non-boss enemies have an inspiring presence that strengthens their allies.”
  • The following new affixes can appear starting at Keystone Level 7.
    • Storming
      • “While in combat, enemies periodically summon damaging whirlwinds.”
  • On the Torghast (Max Level) realm, the Keystone Vendor has been updated to offer these new affixes for testing.

We look forward to hearing about your experiences with these new affixes!

why is necrotic still in the rotation?

Necrotic really only affects tanks which already is the least represented role in wow. Necrotic punishes tanks for just being tanks. Overflowing was an old affix that was removed for only affecting healers.

Necrotic is similar cause it only affects tanks, sure some of the dps can acquire necrotic stacks but again because the tank messed up probably. Again, a tank affix. There’s no good counterplay to necrotic other than to run away and kite, but that negates the whole idea of being a tank which is to stay in and keep aggro. You can’t really keep aggro if you are running away, which has been reinforced even further by tanks losing all threat modifiers in Shadowlands. Tanks or healers have no effective counterplay that isn’t already counter intuitive to their playstyle. Therefore it’s just a badly designed affix that has no affect on the group besides the tank.

It’s in the same vein as skittish and I’m glad skittish and teeming are gone but Necrotic also needs to go.

9 Likes

Crazy, nice idea to keep things fresh! Looking forward to seeing the rotation of weekly affixes then.
Skittish I am not sure I would want to see gone, but very happy with Teeming going, even though I did like it personally.
Its just not fair to have the route change that significantly for a single affix.

Hopefully we can swap Necrotic, or just dump that one too, and then I will be extremely happy with the affixes!

3 Likes

I tested it for about 4 hours today, and have to agree. Its WAYYYY too hard to see whenever any mobs are actually near it.
It also spawns way too frequently and lasts way too long.
Even had some spawn AFTER we were out of combat, which surely is not right.

On big pulls, there was simply no counter to it. The tornados were everywhere and there was no way to move from them all, unlike with Volcanic.

The big issue visually is the base though.
You can see the top well enough, but the base is impossible to see with mobs overlaying it.

Find a way to make it more visually distinguished or rethink its movement patterns.

First step would be try to make it a Shadowlands theme?
Maybe a blue and white bastion themed tornado?
Or maybe a blood vampire theme for Revendreth?

This is how “Explosives” were handled, remember?
They were “fel explosives” and green at one point, for Legion no doubt.
Then they changed to standard explosives and red with BFA.

4 Likes

They could always take a color scheme similar to what the Death Elemental’s use.

As long as they do something to make the base very distinctive so its easier to understand just where it is because the length and movement of it can make collision feel very deceptive in terms of 3d depth. That’s my two copper at least.

1 Like

Oh, ya just literally take that ghostly looking mesh and make that the tornado haha. Would be perfect!
My other idea was make it knock back mobs too to make it less important to be able to see it perfectly, but that would probably make the affix too easy.

They could also do a brown and black theme with yellow lightning like the whirlwind that is the maw. Would fit the theme since affixes are dangerous and the maw is dangerous. I don’t know if brown and black would be hard to see as well in some places, but with enough yellow in it it might be fine.

A few observations noticed from some runs with the three new affixes:

SPITEFUL
-Spiteful Shade spawns were a bit too frequent to feel like an engaging affix to play around vs a death sentence to an unfortunate fixate on a melee player. In addition, their fixate was inconsistent and they could also autoattack other players in the time between spawning in and fixating their target.

-From a tuning standpoint, the amount of damage a single shade could put out was brutal. Simultaneously, if they did end up attacking the tank for whatever reason the damage felt comparatively nonexistent. These heavy autoattacks, combined with their ability to crit, creates huge swings in variance and punishment for wandering too close to a fixated shade.

-The baseline movespeed of Spiteful Shades definitely felt on the fast side. Compared to the plodding pace of Atal’ai Deathwalker Spirits, the shades may as well be sprinting for how mandatory an immediate snare application is against them when combined with how long they can live if untouched.

-It felt like a bit of a time waste to have to deal with spiteful shades keeping the party in combat after the end of every pull, especially when one party member per shade cannot safely help remove them. Perhaps they should automatically despawn if the pull ends and shades are the only enemies in combat? Probably a bit too messy/capable of abuse, but healers wanting a moment to drink as soon as possible would certainly appreciate it.

INSPIRING
-This affix is marginally better than the former Tides Emissaries of the Beguiling affix by virtue of the inspiring enemies not needing to cast a teleport at low health.

-At the moment, the affix’s impact in a given dungeon feels like a pendulum swinging from nonexistent (a pack containing irrelevant mobs with melee mechanics that can still be kited in the absence of cc) to downright mean (a pack with multiple casters using spells that damage the entire party when not kicked).

-We’ll see what counteractive strategies get developed over time, but I don’t want a case of a level four affix rendering entire dungeons as “dead keys” for the week compared to being capable of running albeit at a lower level or two. Be incredibly mindful of applying Inspiring Presence to packs with party-wide kickable abilities, healing, or damage reduction.

-I hope that, unlike Tides Emissary placements, there won’t be a rotation of enemies with Inspiring Presence as this affix isn’t active every week like Beguiling was.

STORMING
-Storming’s spawn rate is pretty absurd, to the tune of dwarfing the threat that explosive orbs normally create in a big pull. Does each mob have a static procrate of making Storming tornadoes, and is there meant to be an internal cooldown on them?

-Visually it’s impossible to keep track of tornado spawns in a pull of enemies (or even on party-stacked bosses a la Domina Venomblade), and it’s currently spawning around enemies that are in combat with eachother. They also seem to rotate both clockwise and counterclockwise, creating further tracking difficulty.

-On any stationary boss in particular, this affix results in a real no-win situation for a tank or melee player if the pathing of the storming tornado at the wrong time forces a disengagement (Margrave Stradama would be a good example of multiple stormings from adds turning it into a tanking nightmare with this affix).

-In an environment with walls, storming currently can clip right through some of them and can become more difficult to track. I’m not sure if this would be preferable to the alternative of crowding up a tight hallway given the current spawnrate.

Overall early thoughts
In their current iterations, I’d honestly take teeming and skittish over spiteful and inspiring. Those two affixes arguably had more elements of counterplay without feeling too unfair, and that’s in spite of teeming adding some brutal mandatory enemies/increasing required trash percentage. Their removal is understandable, however, and I hope that all three of the new affixes can be suitably worked into something that’s engaging, but fair without feeling like too much of a punishment rather than encouraging a different way to look at a given dungeon.

12 Likes

I love that we are getting few new affixes and some older affixes were addressed. However, I am hopeful some of the others were affixes are changed as well. I will try to name few issues and how affixes could be changed to address them.

Raging - this is the best example of all or nothing affix. Either you can remove Enrage or you cannot play the keys that week.

  1. Just make it Dispellable, Purgable, etc. Spellsteal should remove it as well but don’t give buff to the Mage.
  2. Shadowlands dungeons have a lot of poisons, diseases, bleeds. All of these interact with Raging. You take twice as much damage even though you got the debuff before mob enraged. You can get 1-2 ticks and die even if you have person ready to remove the Enrage. I can see a lot of issues going into Shadowlands if this not changed.

Bolstering - this is probably the hardest affix to play around in whole rotation. Even when you play very well, it slows down a dungeon. AoE cap will make it even worse.

  1. Bosses shouldn’t Bolster. That would allow us to pull mobs into boss if we feel like doing it. At the same time, someone pulling a mob or two by accident won’t mean instant wipe.
  2. Bolstering should be linear instead of exponential. Give it stacks rather than new buff for every Bolster. That has multiple positive effects: 1) easier to track (one buff with number 4 for stacks instead of 4 buffs), 2) scaling is less out of control
    100 * (1 + (0.2 * 4))=180
    100 * 1.2 * 1.2 * 1.2 * 1.2 =207
    The exponential scaling goes out of control more and more with additional stacks. Maybe even introduce cap of 10(?) stacks so making mistakes on Bolstering in casual groups are less punishing.

I dont think either of these changes would be hard to implement but it would provide quality of life as well as limit negative aspects of Bolstering.

Necrotic - as a tank player. It is only affix where I have zero desire to play the game. I am saying that as a very experienced tank player who did very high keys throughout BFA. I can only imagine the nightmares lower level/less experienced tank players deal with.

  1. I think Necrotic damage component should go. There is no worse feeling than running away to drop stacks and dying from debuff because you run out of Healer range.
  2. I like how Necrotic works out in a boss fights. There were some issues at the start of BFA but they were mostly fixed and I believe same thing will happen with Shadowlands. However, number of stacks you get on normal mobs is too high. I don’t know what is the perfect solution for it but you should consider few options: a) Every stack of Necrotic has its’ own duration which is not extended by getting more stacks, b) Mobs have a chance 20%(?) to apply Necrotic rather than applying it every time. A solution would make it more consistent, B solution would introduce lucky and unlucky streaks but either of them would help to make this painful affix better.

I hope my feedback will help you to improve M+.

5 Likes

Can you please change explosive so that if you are targeting an Explosive ball, AoE abilities you use do damage to it?

It’s particularly awful on a spec like Guardian, where our filler (Swipe) is an AoE ability. Guardian has only 3 single target abilities that can damage Explosive balls:

  1. Mangle, which is on a cooldown.
  2. Moonfire, which is a DoT that takes longer than the Explosive timer fuse.
  3. Maul, which we need to use in place of mitigation (so we get trucked).

If you’re targeting an Explosive ball, any ability you use should damage that specific ball. Even if it’s an AoE ability.

Thank you.

2 Likes

Explosives is a widely avoided affix at high keys, but I don’t necessarily think it is because people have trouble targeting explosives. At lower keys, that can be an issue, but also has work arounds via tanks kiting mobs in a small circle so explosives are away from the group to begin with. I think you may have missed the mark on the adjustments for this affix.

The largest issue with explosives is their scaling health. What is the point of the affix? I don’t mean that to be negative and hyperbolic, I mean to seriously ask you, what is the goal of the affix? I always interpreted the goal of the affix to be that you had to play whack a mole during encounters, testing players reflexes. I really like this as a concept, but the issue comes when the explosives have their health scaled with key lvl. I think explosives should have stagnant health pools, similar to totems in how low their HP is, so that any class is able to target them and kill them with 1 GCD. You still get the fun play of testing player reflexes, without the disparity in damage different classes can do to them. It’s an affix where you feel compelled to bring specific classes to deal with explosives, and leave some classes behind (looking at you Spriests). If you lowered their health and let them die to 1 shots, you would find a lot more players playing these weeks and actually enjoying this game.

As someone that runs a lot of keys it is really frustrating only being able to get serious groups together every other week as it is for fortified weeks, but to add to that with affixes like explosive, is really frustrating.

A ton of data has surfaced breaking down runs attempted across BFA for different affix combinations. This includes information on attempted runs, timed runs, completed runs, and runs that people just bail on. I really hope your team has studied this data in order to provide more weeks where we are enjoying the game than not enjoying the game. Since you are married to the idea of Fortified and Tyrannical for reasons (?), I implore you to at least ensure that there are more good fortified weeks than bad ones. We are already below 50% of playable weeks, don’t make it less than 25%.

M+ is my favorite content, and I really just wish to play it every week.

5 Likes

Just tried out Spiteful, and I have some comments. It’s definitely an interesting affix for sure, I would like it however to be easier to see what player is being fixated. Tiny little eyes above the player isn’t enough. If it could have a line directly connecting the Spiteful add to the player that would go a long way in being able to avoid them.

Also not sure if it was just the way it appeared in the dungeon, but the Spiteful adds seemed to not stick to one target. It kept looking like it was refocusing, which should not be a thing. It shouldn’t be able to just randomly swap targets especially if the new target is a player that is right next to it trying to slow/kill the add for the person that it was originally targeting.

Also DEFINITELY not a fan of it being able to target tanks, especially since tanks have a lot on their plate to begin with, but I also understand that we should have to deal with the affix as well, rather than just slowing/CCing/kiting the Spiteful adds.

1 Like

Last week their melees were almost insta killing us as well. If they were a little less lethal, that would help if they fixate on someone right next to them.

2 Likes

Some feedback on the new affixes.

Storming

  • The tornadoes spawned by Storming seem a bit too quick to dodge properly, to the point where you are just running in figure-eight patterns when there are multiple tornadoes present.
  • The way the tornadoes follow the mobs they spawn from seems really unpredictable, making it difficult to plan ahead movement when kiting.
  • I’m glad the damage was changed over night to be a percentage of health rather than a flat amount scaling with key level, that’s a good change.

It is a bit too punishing on melee. I’m unsure if this affix is to kill the melee meta but if that’s your goal it’s definitely working (and also punishing melee healers like Monks and Paladins).

Some possible reasonable changes to me personally would be:

  • Reducing the speed of the tornadoes.
  • Making their movement patterns more predictable.
  • Keeping them on the same path once they spawn so they don’t follow mobs.
  • Reduce the amount of tornadoes and/or have them disappear quicker.
  • Have the visual stand out more. In Spires of Ascension for example, the tornadoes are more difficult to spot due to them blending in on the white floor.

When at least one of my first 3 proposed changes happens:

  • Make the initial knockback smaller, but have it apply a stacking debuff (about 5 seconds in duration) that punishes repeated failure rather than an oversight. Each stack increases the power of the knockback.

I realise the last proposed change might not be as attractive to some people, but for me it would greatly increase engagement with the affix.

Any of these changes would make this affix better in my opinion and make it more fun to deal with rather than the pure annoyance it is right now.

Spiteful
As mentioned by the posters before me:

  • The melee attacks of the spawned adds seem too strong. I have been one-shot in a +10 by these spiteful shades with a Priest stamina buff up (about a 35k health pool) on multiple occasions. It was a critical hit, which doesn’t help.
  • It is difficult to see who’s being targeted. This is especially a problem for melee players, as the clutter of spell/ability effects and the textures of mobs still alive make it difficult to see the eyes above your head.
  • They move so quick, you can hardly escape them without movement speed abilities.
  • A lot of them spawn in some packs with small, lower health mobs.

Some possible changes:

  • Implement some form of ‘grace period’ when they spawn, so players have more time to notice who’s targeted.
  • Make it easier to see who’s being targeted.
  • Remove the ability of shades to have their hits be critical hits. When you’re heroic geared as a leather class, they shouldn’t be able to one-shot you.
  • Reduce the speed of the shades.
  • Only have them spawn from elite mobs.

In addition to this, my guildies and I agree on the following:

  • The health pool of the shades is too large. It feels like a complete waste of time trying to damage them as they kill themselves, even our Warlock’s Chaos Bolt only took off 5% health. This makes running away the only viable option and the shades an annoyance that is really dull to deal with as you just have to slow them and wait for them to kill themselves and combat to drop. We (my guildies and I) would like to see the health pool and amount of health they lose every second reduced, so it actually feels like we’re the ones killing them. This makes the affix way more engaging.

Overall though, it’s an affix that shows a lot of promise and can be a fun addition to the affix rotation with some tweaks.

Inspiring
The most plain affix, I don’t have a lot of feedback to provide for this one.

  • The range on the CC-immune aura seems well thought. By pulling the Inspiring mob 20 yards away it gives you a chance to deal with any casters that remain.
  • Having the Inspiring mob able to be CCed is a really nice QoL feature.

Overall, though well implemented, the affix is not super engaging.

2 Likes

New Affix Feedback

I tested out a few dungeons, but wasn’t able to complete them due to various bugs and tuning issues, though those issues likely belong in another thread. I did get some good experience with some of the new affixes though and feel like I’m in a good enough place to give feedback on them. The dungeons we ran were Halls of Atonement and De Other Side, both at key level 15. Our group was full of experienced M+ players, each with every dungeon timed at ~+20 or higher in the current BfA season. I was tanking on a Brewmaster, and we had a Balance Druid, Restoration Shaman, Unholy Death Knight and Demonology Warlock group. We also ran a couple with the Balance Druid substituted with a Fury Warrior.

Storming
This affix has some major issues. Firstly, it heavily favors ranged over melee. For the ranged players in our key it was essentially a non-affix, but for our melee players it was extremely annoying and lead to many deaths or greater healing pressure. Now one might say that this isn’t a problem, since Volcanic heavily favors melee over ranged. However, Volcanic is a one time dodge for 3-4 small AOEs which sometimes doesn’t even spawn under you. Storming tornadoes persist for a long while, in a much larger AOE, proc’ing way more often, with more up at once, and moving constantly forcing constant dodging. It’s far too much in a single affix to play around, and absolutely dominates every trash pack in a way no other affix in the game does. It often feels more like you’re fighting against Storming more than any of the mobs in the pack.

The pressure and disruption this affix causes on top of it generally only affecting melee makes it feel really unfair for melee players, and will generally lead to bringing multiple ranged DPS, if not an entirely ranged DPS comp on a storming week rather than a melee just so that you’re not constantly losing damage from melee having to dodge Storming.

Inspiring
This affix feels really bad. Beguiling was not well liked in Season 3 of BfA and for good reason, an affix where the only answer is “this mob has to die” isn’t engaging because the only counterplay or strategy is just doing more damage. This also combines with the fact that most mob packs (particularly at higher key levels) feel designed around good CC and interrupt usage, both of which get completely disabled by this affix. This affix’s difficulty also swings far too much. In some packs where interrupts and stuns aren’t important you can practically ignore it, in others where those things aren’t important it feels far too hard. Of course you could also root the Inspiring mob and kill the rest separately so you can stun and interrupt them, but that isn’t very engaging either and completely nullifies the affix.

This is also a side note, but placing Inspiring on almost every patrol is very annoying. As players get better at the dungeons they’ll obviously learn how to dodge the patrols, but it’s still frustrating to have one get pulled as it runs over to you and all of a sudden you can’t CC anymore.

Spiteful
Much like Storming, this affix feels like it disproportionately targets melee players. For ranged players, this affix was essentially a non-issue. A slow would get thrown on them, or they’d be controlled by Ursol’s Vortex or Ring of Peace and the ranged wouldn’t even have to run away from them. They just got to keep casting while the mobs slowly died before they even reached them. For the melee in my group though, it felt terrible. If the mobs didn’t chunk them for half of their health (or sometimes even one shot them, though that was likely a bug or tuning error), then they’d be forced to run out and drop all damage for the entire time the mobs were alive. Just as with Storming, this will result in melee players not getting brought to Spiteful weeks because they have to deal with an affix that forces them to drop damage while ranged players are fine.

Also, currently Spiteful can target tanks and this feels like a problem. While I was usually fine to tank it on my Brewmaster, the damage it dealt would sometimes chunk through my health and result in me dying when combined with the other mobs in the pack. Since tanks usually can’t be targeted by fixates, this feels inconsistent with how the rest of the game works and also forces weird positioning from the tank having to run around. This wasn’t a huge issue for my group but this could potentially cause threat issues as the tank runs while not damaging the mobs, particularly as DPS damage scales with the expansion.

Prideful
I really like this affix. It reminds me of the much beloved Reaping, but unlike Reaping the time when you hit 20/40/60/80/100% matters much more due to the minute long buff you get after. There’s going to be a lot of interesting routes people will make where you’ll clear trash perfectly to have the buff going into a boss or a particularly dangerous pack. All around this is that perfect kind of Seasonal affix, the one that changes up how you play the dungeon and generates new strategies in a positive way, rather than railroading specific routes to avoid certain powerful mobs.

That being said, it does unfortunately follow the trend with these new affixes of punishing melee more than ranged. The debuff from Belligerent Boast is much more difficult to deal with if it goes on a melee than a ranged. On a ranged there’s instantly a wide berth to dodge the Belligerent Boast bolts without the targeted player having to move. Often movement from the other players wasn’t even necessary. But when it goes on melee or a tank there’s a problem. Due to how much more packed in melee are to the Manifestation of Pride they have a lot less room to work with to dodge the effect without outright running out and losing damage.

Unlike Storming and Spiteful though, running out and dropping damage hurts a lot more due to the spell Bursting With Pride. This stacking buff forces a dps race to kill the mob before the damage becomes too much to heal, so a melee dropping DPS so they don’t stun their fellow melee compounds into a harder Prideful fight overall. Once again Prideful encourages bringing fewer melee players in order to make the affix a lot easier to deal with, which is a pretty sour note to an otherwise cool affix.

Concluding Thoughts
I’m very concerned for how melee will perform in M+ in Shadowlands. They already have the target cap which limits how effective they can be in larger pulls to worry about, something that has not been equally applied to the AOE spells and multi-DOTing of ranged classes, but on top of that there’s now a suite of M+ affixes that harm them much more than ranged. Many of the dungeons also had mechanics that seem to exclusively harm melee while there were far fewer that did the same for ranged.

This might seem fair, since melee were extremely dominant in BfA, besides season 4 where Beast Mastery Hunters have reigned supreme. Having affixes that incentivize bringing more ranged would make sense after that, right? Well not quite in the way that these affixes will address. The reason why melee were so much stronger than ranged in BfA is not due to some inherent greater strength, but due to interrupts. Most packs in BfA (if they didn’t outright require interrupts being spammed off-CD) were much easier if you had a melee class’s 15 second CD interrupt. As far as I can tell from the Shadowlands dungeons I’ve done, this hasn’t been changed. There are still several trash mobs in dungeons that require a chain of 15 second interrupts or are made much easier by 15 second CD interrupts in a way ranged players can’t do.

Essentially, it feels like a bandaid has been put on melee dominance not by fixing the root of it, but by making melee suffer so badly from these new affixes and multiple new melee-specific dungeon mechanics that it may well be better to bring multiple ranged even at the enhanced risk of trash that requires frequent interrupts. Alternatively, melee will still dominate because their interrupts are required, it’ll just feel really bad to play them due to these affixes that disproportionately target them.

All in all I am very much in favor of new affixes, but these feel far too punishing of melee players while barely harming ranged so it’s not looking like they’ll be fun to deal with in Shadowlands.

3 Likes