We didn’t scale well during DF, and we were doing pretty good then. Not great but pretty good. This sums it up perfectly…
I really think as time goes by, despite the single target nerfs, once we come out the gate, players will eventually look at ret and say: “Holy Moley! Ret is cranking!”
We’re not the top dps spec and I’m VERY cool with that. This way, Blizz can put their attention on other specs as far as I’m concerned and leave us alone (I’m looking at you, Death Knights). Because trust me, there WILL be more tuning in the near future.
All the buffs they gave us all throughout DF because we didn’t scale?
They didn’t claw those back much.
FV at DF start (10.0) was 136% AP.
When the rework came it stayed at 136%
In 10.1 it was buffed at 163%.
And finally in 10.2.5 it was buffed at 179% AP.
BoJ did something similar throughout the patches.
We can say that it might have been too low at the start and that’s fair, but they scaled it back to 10.1.
Interestingly, Divine Storm was left mostly untouched throughout, gaining only 7% AP from 10.0 to now (86% to 93%).
Truth be told, I wish they didn’t touch our single target (no one likes getting nerfed, especially me). But apparently the fact of the matter is that as time goes by we’re gonna scale better and in the total scheme of things, I think we’re gonna pull ahead many other classes.
Hey, we’re paladins, the best in all Azeroth. We’re supposed to be positive.
It cannot be overstated how poorly ret scaled with secondaries in DF. Haste was strong until a point, but very weak beyond that. Crit and mastery were both bad, and versatility was equally bad for all classes (and yet ended up being ret’s best secondary).
Going into TWW its likely that mastery will be the best stat, crit will be strong, haste will be very good in moderate doses, and versatility will be last like it should be.
Scaling well with secondaries is one of the best things a class could hope for.
On Tuesday the class disappears, I really can’t believe that they don’t realize the tremendous nerf they are going to give us, when it already felt good to play ret, it’s the same old crap again, nerf without damage, without healing and without survival or nothing, it’s not fun anymore, they killed our class again
When they buffed mastery back up and ADDED a whole new effect that wasn’t there before, did they nerf something to compensate?
No
When they reworked Highlords Judgement to increase mastery effect, did they nerf something to compensate?
No
When they made it so Judgement debuff now stack, did they nerf something to compensate?
No
When they gave AoW an increase proc scaling with crit, did they nerf something to compensate?
No
The only thing they nerfed was Wake and they only did that because they rolled Truth’s wake into it for free and ADDED MORE talents that increases it’s potency.
If you didn’t think a nerf was coming, you were delusional.
They kept just adding damage on top of everything we already had and you thought “Ahh yeah, it’s for sure gonna stay like that”
New Talent: Holy Flames – Divine Storm deals 10% increased damage and when it hits an enemy affected by your Expurgation, it spreads the effect to up to 4 targets hit. You deal 3% increased Holy damage to targets burning from your Expurgation.
Crusader Aura talent is no longer granted by default in the Class tree for Retribution.
Greater Judgment talent is now granted by default in the Class tree for Retribution.
Consecrated Blade is no longer a talent and now learned at level 11.
Word of Glory healing increased by 44%.
Final Verdict damage reduced by 10%.
Templar’s Verdict damage reduced by 10%.
Justicar’s Vengeance damage reduced by 10% and now heals for 3% of maximum health (was 5%).
Hammer of Wrath damage reduced by 15%.
Blade of Justice damage reduced by 20%. Does not effect Blade of Vengeance.
Blade of Vengeance damage increased by 25%.
Expurgation damage reduced by 10%.
Divine Storm damage increased by 25%.
Templar Strike damage reduced by 10%.
Templar Slash damage reduced by 10%.
Crusading Strikes damage reduced by 10%.
Crusader Strike damage reduced by 10%.
Blessed Champion now deals 25% reduced damage to secondary targets (was 50% reduced damage) and is now a 1-point talent (was 2).
An issue causing Radiant Glory to not function with fast back to back procs has been resolved.
The following talents are now 2 points (was 1):
Heart of the Crusader
Zealot’s Fervor
Vanguard of Justice has been removed.
Empyrean Legacy moved to where Vanguard of Justice was on the talent tree.
Holy Flames is now in a choice node with Blade of Vengeance.
Yes my champion, tomorrow our class comback to the hole
I don’t think any nerfs or buffs matter much now, what matters is how good the hero talent stuff is, which we’ll see at max lvl, when compared to the other classes/specs when they get their hero talents.
Exactly, we won’t have final tuning until like 2 month into the expac.
We know all these numbers moving around are meaningless ATM.
My point was more that, tuning is irrelevant and is gonna be all over the place for all specs and classes for a while and even if someone was to argue it was relevant, it was justified by the list of straight up buffs we got.
And where do you get those “benefits” from? I’m talking to you about the facts and the fact is that they nerfed the paladin. What you mention, I don’t see it in the blue notes, so yes, it’s completely obscured because what you say is not officially in place, the ret paladin was nerfed and that’s it. It is a fact and you have no way to debate it with me. The information is there, yes, from a copy paste, but it is from an official one. What you say is not official
Yes, as always in the past, it starts very well until some developer says “oh, we’re not getting out of hand, people are complaining that the paladin does dps, nerf” like it happened in Legion, like it happened in BFA, like it happened in Shadowlands, As always happens, in the end it ends up in the trash, really, if so many people hate the class, my suggestion is to eliminate the ret from the game and that’s it, I’m getting out of this game, because it’s always the same, and Don’t tell me that it wasn’t a nerf, when the numbers are there, look at the other changes to the other classes for God’s sake, classes that are already over broken increase their dps more but who the f… runs the classes, Is it that the developers don’t play? What’s wrong, they are blind, and this is the worst thing that we will have to depend on borrowed powers again, don’t expect much from the hero talents, sincerely what I tried in the beta does not convince me and it is not very strong, let’s say, I just I know that the ret is not going to be good
Yes, and not only did they nerf Crusader Strike, whether in talent or not, the passive was very good, so it has already lost strength, because I imagine there will be fewer procs and it directly affects the art of war if the passive talent is taken, another, justicar’s sword, I don’t see the point of nerfing this talent when most if not almost all of us paladins don’t have that talent, in any case they did nerf the final verdict and the templar’s verdict, well the most logical thing is that it should be taken sword of justicar, but no, nerf is also leaving, hammer of anger nerf, sword of justice nerf, but it does not affect expurgation, does this make no sense or are they forcing me to take that talent, can I explain? What you are not realizing is that they took away all your basic dps, and they are forcing you to take talents that are not even fun and are not as strong as these were, reducing the main source of damage of the ret, is a tremendous sh… it wasn’t just 5 nerfs, understand all those nerfs affect the other talents and the way in which you are going to have to configure the talent tree to be able to do “damage” consolation prize 44% wog, wow, I’m not surprised that later people say that we healed too much, and listen carefully to my words because just as they buffed wog right now, they are going to end up nerfing it when people cry again that we healed because that is what we are going to need because We are no longer going to kill a murloc and we will need to survive, next nerf, wog, deyabu I already experienced this in shadowlands…
We’re supposed to be positive.
