Feedback: Dark Ranger in The War Within

yeah smokescreen blows embrace the shadows out of the water unfortunately. the latter definitely needs to change OR black arrow needs to make AiS/barbed shot do shadow damage


I can talk from MM perspective.

The whole spec does not seem to bring any change to the spec but rather (as previously mentioned) it feels like “another button to press on cooldown” which will allow me to press the other buttons more often. At this point im not sure what the perspective for the spec is, but surely this just feels like a new “DoT” ability that requires extra abilities to unlock the full potential.

As mentioned “Dark Chains” will have zero use at all in PvE, not even solo hunters will benefit from a single target slow when we already have Tar Trap, nor is useful for PvP as it will brake almost instantly from the disengage and run.

The only ability that looks interesting is “Shadow Surge” as it creates an interaction that will change the order of rotation or not (depending on how much damage it does). And you better pool Focus for the Multishot cause you only have two chances to do it in the 16secs the DoT last.

Overall it seems another click on Cooldown and forget ability that also fix a problem that the spec does not have. More charges of Aimed Shot (or Kill shot with Death Shade) is not something that will change the spec at all as currently the spec is not suffering from it due to the focus cost and long cast time (unless they are similar to Lock and Load instant free casts). All the extra abilities are just extra damage to the main cast, not event interactions or things that can be planned on, just + dmg (from dogs) and + dmg from rain of arrows.

I rather have an option for the ability to be part of AoE (in example expanding shadow surge with other talents), a more reliable slow (ie Darkchains is a proc on Multishot), and a more reliable damage reduction (ie enemy affected by Blackarrow do -Xdmg to hunter)


yeah big agree. If black arrow either replaced AS/BS (gave aimed shot the DF S1 dot effect?) making them both shadow damage, or just made both them deal shadow damage it’d be more relevant.

we’re like pure phys damage so this shadow damage leech and shadow damage buffing is just really meh looking.


Thats a really cool idea actually, wouldnt mind having Black Arrow replace as or bs.


As we need to combine GCD’s to open up room in the spec, here are some ideas for designs that try to thematically solve to the problems:

Casting Black Arrow grants you Steady Focus/ In the Rhythm for X seconds

Casting Black Arrow makes Aimed Shot free (and instant, pretty please?) for the next X Seconds

Your next Kill shot after Death Shade activates will consumes all precise shots stacks to fire up to 2 additional Withering Fire’s at the target.

  • I like the intention behind of Smoke Screen; however, everyone is going to take it. It doesn’t matter how much leech you get from the other choice, access to more defensives is something Hunter’s desperately need in higher content. This node is basically locked in.
    • On that note, it does seem weird that in most cases the secondary effects of Smoke Screen, and how I see Hunter’s using them, will end up negating the associated abilities primary effect. That is, I can see using Exhilaration right before a big hit just for the free Survival of the Fittest, even when at full HP, wasting the heal. Same with using Survival of the Fittest; the free Exhilaration will almost always be wasted as you will want to use Survival of the Fittest before getting hit, not after. Maybe this is OK, or we could consider converting the Exhilaration effect into a HoT.
  • While I am not against the “generate a charge of <Barbed Shot|Aimed Shot>” in these talents, these effects seem to be ending up everywhere, both in other class talents and in tier bonuses.
    • For MM, I can see the spec ending up being focus starved. Consider making the procs closer to what Lock and Load provides or you are going to force all MM players into Dark Empowerment making that particular choice node essentially dead.
    • BM is going to have way more Barbed Shot procs than it can use. Especially considering Intense Darkness is forcing Call of the Wild. It is invariably going to feel clunky, especially with higher haste values.
  • These talents offer nothing in the way of group utility / CC, which is something Hunter’s still lack. Consider something along the lines of Black Arrow: Replaces Wailing Arrow. If you already know Wailing Arrow, gain an additional charge.
    • Black Arrow could do everything Wailing Arrow does (tune the damage appropriately), plus this new DoT mechanic.
    • Both specs already have access to Wailing Arrow (even though it is not taken in any situation right now).
    • An on-demand AoE silence would be a welcome addition to a Hunter’s kit, and give Hunter’s a reason to utilize the talents associated with Wailing Arrow.
  • Things have been fairly good about summoned pet’s not being completely unless in terms of pathing. Let’s keep on eye on these Dark Hounds to make sure they work at least as well as the current Dire Beast summons.
  • Shadow Surge looks great, but will be clunky during cooldown windows.
    • For MM, Volley windows become a concern. Consider letting Volley ticks also trigger this effect.
    • For BM, you never want to hit Multi-Shot during Call of the Wild. I’m not sure how to solve this directly, other than letting Beast Cleave trigger the effect as well.
  • Not sure if Black Arrow will be considered a Magic effect, Bleed effect, or otherwise, but Dispell protection would be nice, otherwise this will be a dead spec in PvP.

Wish List:

  • Please add a way for MM to play with a pet that doesn’t involved a significant damage loss. Here’s hoping that Sentinel provides that option.

precise shots really needs some sort of way to not compete for GCDs so much whether it be autoprocing AS like SV does or something else


Agreed. I’m a big fan of flavorful things like this. The game needs more of them.

I also agree with this.

Maybe MM could focus more on things like Wailing Arrow or traps, and the Dark Hounds could be a BM only thing?

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Ill be real here, after re-reading this ability I hope that they rather recreate this Hero spec using Wailing Arrow

  • Separated Silence and both Windrunner’s barrage and Readiness as options for it.
  • Give it an extra DoT as an option (Dog spawn and bleed for X/Xsecs).
  • Make it or Disengage chain enemies together or to the point of impact (similar to Igira lances) X seconds (like old Binding shot).
  • Give it a chance to grant Steady Focus or other buff to Hunter.
  • Keep Whitering Fire but make that is controllable (ie if Aimed Shot/Barbed Shot is cast within X seconds of Wailing Arrow, the Hunter does extra damage.

I would think this tree would benefit much more when creating an ability that you want to save to click when is critical than other click on cooldown ability. a minicooldown that turn you into this killing machine for a short while to have this as a miniburst mechanic


Yeah, I’m surprised this tree doesn’t interact with Wailing Arrow at all. Kinda figured that would be a no-brainer.


I feel any hero talents will make us say “ok… but is this getting fixed?” We can’t look at these trees and think they’ll work with current marksman… there’s no way. No scaling with lone wolf, pet issues, multi shot not allowing 2 target cleave, well once every 6 seconds with black arrow.
Steady shot almost not being worth casting is ridiculous.
Dark Ranger honestly reads so well as a survival hero tree it’s wild this is for marksmanship.
However you can’t have black arrow up at 100% of the time so 15% health back from shadow damage doesn’t fix hunters defensive issue. However exhilaration granting survival of the fittest for 3 seconds is at least something but still doesn’t seem like the best solution for their issues. 3 seconds of 15% dr every minute absolutely pales in comparison to demon hunter’s blur, 20% dr and 50% dodge for 10 seconds.
Maybe this tree looks better for marksman after a rework but as it stands the tree looks much better for beast mastery.


huh? it doesn’t need specific lone wolf scaling

  • Would really like to see some interaction with Wailing Arrow here; missed an obvious one
  • Tree seems like it gels better with MM; Barbed Shot resetting is already a very frequent thing so this doesn’t seem particularly strong. I get that they want the effects to be similar, but maybe a different or additional effect needs to be considered for BM
  • I already feel like I won’t be a fan of juggling the 30 second CD with the 45 second Volley/Chakram but this is pretty minor

This would almost certainly exceed the amount of power they’ve indicated they want Hero Talents to account for.

I really like this. Some other way to use up Precise Shots is a lovely idea.

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Imagine if they made a choice node with LnL and Wailing Arrow. Reworking Wailing Arrow to an instant cast and replacing Aimed Shot. A choice between heavy dmg aimed shots or lower instant casts Wailing Arrows. This way we would have old survival back fully with the dark ranger black arrow reset.

Edit; and ontop of making it instant, you might actually use arcane arrow procs


The tree really captures the Dark Ranger theme from Warcraft 3, so I’m personally happy. I will leave comments on mechanics to others, as they just seem agreeable to me. If anything the amount of flavour in the tree makes some of the other hero trees look bad. All the other hero trees should be this good. I’d also agree that there needs to be more cosmetic glyphs to make things more ‘dark’.


Amen to this finally someone said it. That gameplay loop is so boring and unsatisfying


I would love for them to just remove the marksman spec and change it to Dark Ranger.

The class fantasy around MM is just “I shoot bow”

I would love for a Gloom Hunter type of spec.

No stealth timer, Poisons, Shadow damage etc.

That being said, I’m extremely excited for Dark ranger!


Black arrow should be replacing aimed shot not just adding another button that then makes us have to aimed shot more.


Just don’t really like any of it at all. This feels more like what a Surv/MM should have been, not BM/MM. Completely dropped the ball IMO.

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Not a fan of all this emphasis on aimedshot and esp not one that just gives you back charges randomly, in current MM aimedshot charges are not an issue and inside trueshot this will become even worst, Precise shots will either need to become a passive that is fired after every aimedshot or not compete with a GCD if this goes live, trueshot will only be aimedshot spam with some rapidfire thrown in, i highly suggest bringing the current mm tier effect over in some way over to the spec (its improvements on gameplay an functionality of the spec is crucial to a fun experience) we really need less stuff empowering aimedshot and really focus on the rest of the rotational kit of mm, killshot, rapidfire, arcane shot have all been forgotten, also we desperately need a solution to lonewolf and pet utility, along with the massive issue with limited trickshots to 3 targets (why does BM get to multishot to get beastcleave, but MM needs 3 targets???) if you want some inspiration on what MM truely needs then go read the wishlist by azorthorian on wowhead.