For BM this doesn’t fix the tree bloat at the top still. Moving stuff and making choice nodes helps with some of the points but the top is still very very bloated.
1 Like
Agreed
There are 19 points that can be spent at the top of the BM tree. One could spend about 15 points before progressing to the center of the tree. This doesn’t leave much to select at the bottom of the tree.
Blizzard: There are too many multi-point talents at the top of each of the Hunter spec trees!
Here’s an idea: Please, do NOT require multi-point predecessor talent requirements to unlock a successor. Have the successor talent unlock with a single point. This allows the player flexibility in where the put the extra points at high character levels. During leveling, a player will need to be very selective as they progress. At max level, the player should have options at how they adjust their play style for the type of content.
1 Like
really want to see lonewolf become baseline, and a ranged survival type (mop/wod) dot(black arrow)/instacast arcane magic type shot spell added into MM tree, shoehorn that in somewhere, make it 4 main branches down the trees and everyone would be happy, would have aoe, trueshot type mid, wailing arrow to the right, then next to that branch the ranged survival type dot/insta cast style of game play.
again, lonewolf should be baseline like how it is now
also when dual wield survival hunters? transmog or otherwise
3 Likes
I logged on to play around with the changes and was disappointed. The marks tree is still pretty boring. The lack of options is so much less than some of the other classes. In 20 minutes I was basically done and had 2 builds, 1 for st and 1 for multi, that will probably never be changed for the entirety of the expac. There just wasn’t enough diversity in the tree to make more unique playstyle altering choices. The biggest decision i see is do we take rapid fire or not? They’re just not very exciting.
I think a big part of the problem is the amount of points that are pretty much required in the top gate of the tree. Taking rapid fire has me putting 15/30 available points in just the top tier. With Lone Wolf being moved to the top that could be 16/30. The amount of throughput nodes that while not very exciting, +crit chance or +damage, they will likely be mandatory. The focus nodes will definitely be mandatory to avoid being completely starved.
Then you move down just 1 more row and there’s more exciting damage increases. These too will probably be mandatory because like it or not, when the balance passes come through, they will be adjusted with these talent nodes in mind and the base numbers will be adjusted accordingly.
This leaves us in a scenario where marks hunters have to spend 20/30 points in the top half of the tree, with the most interesting ability we’ve picked up is Rapid Fire, a current baseline ability. The ability to branch out toward the bottom of the tree and make interesting build combinations is completely negated by the bloat and point requirements required at the top.
Talents like Improved Steady Shot are just required and shouldn’t exist. 2 points for Improved Arcane Shot is in this same catagory. It could easily be baked into Precise Shots. These 2 changes alone would turn 5 mandatory points into 2 and be a good start.
Talents like Steamline, Careful Aim, Killing Blow, Hunter’s Knowledge, and Focused Aim all being 2 point talents is also unnecessary. They’re just crit/damage increases that are boring talents and don’t justify the amount of points they require.
There’s also not a lot of interesting talents throughout the tree. In the 17 years of Hunter development there are a ton of interesting options that would go great in today’s iteration. Things like Readiness and the old version of Rapid Fire, resetting cd’s and big haste buffs would be nice. Effects like Expose Weakness from the old Dragonstalker set would make for a nice raid buff. Those are a few I would like to see make come backs.
I do love the communication and effort being shown by the devs thus far. Gives me a dangerous level of hope that some of these issues get hammered out.
2 Likes
If you have alpha as you state, then I’d not recommend posting in here as most likely devs rarely, if at all, looks here. I would 100% post in the actual alpha feedback forums. Where the developers are much more likely to read and possibly even take in your feedback.
1 Like
Agreed. If they remove Loaded Quiver, and add that extra charge back into Barbed Shot by default, it would free up one point in the top section at least.
Yep, pretty much. I would vastly prefer more 1-point nodes, and that they add more nodes to the existing ones instead.
I def agree on Lone Wolf going back to a baseline passive for any hunter spec that doesn’t have mandatory interactions baked into their core gameplay, with that of pets.
Having said that, I do not agree that they should bake the old RSV mechanics into MM. It will require many nodes in the MM tree to be replaced/removed to allow for adequate space for these new talents/effects. Not to mention how it will affect/impact the core structure of MM itself, and its intended playstyle.
If anything, I would want them to add old SV in as its own option, something like: [Updated for Dragonflight] Munitions - If RSV was to return (my thoughts on what it should/could look like)
Sure, why not.
You make some good points. But like Rythgar said, if you have access to the alpha forums, it would be best to make a post there with your feedback for the spec. Especially as this topic is mostly focused on the class tree + Beast Mastery. Not Marksmanship.
1 Like
Ask for a choice node between chakrams and bomb for survival tree, that would be dope
2 Likes
I would love to rather be throwing chakrams than bombs, I would say it was a huge improvement. But would chakrams also benefit from the other bomb talents? Or get its own supporting talents?
2 Likes
I looked at the talents and i think it could work 
2 Likes
there were a lot of things that they could’ve added like the current tier set, or something like flaying arrow that causes ks to proc more
1 Like
I know this might be just me, although I’ve seen the same be said by some others at least. But man am i sick and tired of fishing for WFB procs by spamming KC…
It seems like we’ll be going into a similar but toned down version in DF both for WFB builds and the MB build. Single target sure will be fun when its all about spamming MB till you are out of focus to then spam a few KC to fish for procs/gain focus so you can go back to spamming MB. /sarcasm
At least the bomb build leaves KC out of it a little bit. There we have the old 2 Button rotation of bombs and then butchery for CDR to be able to bomb some more.
2 Likes
and that is exactly why these new talent trees are going to be a colossal failure beyond measure.
if blizzard really truly wanted to up the ante they would of left all the baseline class and spec abilities alone and created enhancement talents. here let me show you.
so lets say for example a hunter with multishot. there could of been multiple talents for this ability that would enhance it depending on player preference and or scenario.
- multishot grants trick shots
- multishot applies serpent sting to each target hit
- multishot causes a volley over each target hit
- up to 2 targets hit by multishot will also apply explosive shot
these are just 4 off the top of my head examples for 1 ability. but this is the route that blizzard should of taken with the new talent trees. nobody should have to spec into main rotational abilities and or even interrupts. its getting out of hand. its almost as if the person making these decisions dont even play the game or they are just firing darts.
the new trees should almost have a diablo 3 rune system feel to it. each class main rotational ability should have at least 3-4 affixes that a player can choose. everything from single target, aoe, dots, slows, roots, interupts and so on. we should not have to choose a talent for a baseline ability.
3 Likes
ur spamming KC until Carve is off CD which lowers CD on bombs
1 Like
I have not seen anything about KC reseting carve… Have i missed something? Either way, its hardly a good build.
1 Like
With how bad surv"s capstones are, this is a legit build.
https://www.wowhead.com/beta/talent-calc/hunter/survival/BAAKWlUEUloqQgBQ
1 Like
as i noticed on the BM tree u cant get to 1 capstone , 2 is an impossibility…but yes Surv capstones are really bad compared to other specs
1 Like
I do agree that it feels a bit strange. Atm, I think we need to spend something like 24 points in the BM tree, just to get what we have baseline on live atm. Incl points spent on other talents in order to unlock the last section.
I’d be more okay with this if they at least wouldn’t pick apart certain baseline abilities, and then take those individual parts and put them in as separate talent nodes.
Example: BM having a separate node just to get that second charge of Barbed Shot. Or having to put 2/2 points in Barbed Wrath in order to get the default CDR for Bestial Wrath, via Barbed Shots.
- Return that second charge back to Barbed Shot, remove the node from the tree(freeing up a talent point).
- Put the CDR for Bestial Wrath back into the ability itself. Have Barbed Wrath focus solely on Aspect of the Wild. Example(inspired by the old Azerite Trait):
Primal Instincts - Barbed Shot now also reduces the cooldown of Aspect of the Wild by 4/8 sec, and Aspect of the Wild increases your Mastery by -/- for the duration.
And again, they really should move Wailing Arrow to the class tree.
My personal preferences about some other stuff aside, this I would say, is the bare minimum of what I want them to do with BM.
They’re probably gonna change SV a lot more before release. All we can do is test(if we’re able to), and provide feedback.
You can get 2 capstones, just not if one of them is Dire Pack. If I recall correctly.
1 Like
They really need to make these changes.
Wailing arrow could be an either or choice node with Nessingwarys T/A.
One thing I did not want is the reduction from 8 to 5 as a target cap for Multi Shot Really Blizz! it does bugger all for damage overall at its current 12.6% of AP. 3 extra targets at full damage is no big deal.
Also we need MD to Transfer pet damage as well. Otherwise we will spend half of our time in raid encounters resurrecting our pets.
1 Like
Multi-Shot has got to be the worst ability in the class by a mile. I only press it to activate the buff I actually want, there’s zero interaction otherwise. You could get rid of it and just put in an activatable button for those buffs and it would be a massive improvement.
4 Likes
However they decide to put it in there really.
You mean Multi-Shot specifically? I mean, it’s an odd change indeed, but it’s not going to affect our throughput in any meaningful way.
The change to Beast Cleave’s target cap tho…
Previously it dealt reduced damage beyond 8 targets. Now the tooltip reads, for the first rank, that it deals reduced damage beyond 3 targets, and the second ranks says that it deals reduced damage beyond 6 targets.
Not a massive thing ofc, but still…it’s not like BM AoE is that good anyway, to warrant such a change.
Threat hasn’t been a thing for me or my pet for quite a while, in group-based content. But our tanks are usually on top of it, handling any adds, to keep them(mobs) focused on themselves.
I assume that it’s because they want you to spend Focus on your AoE abilities as well, but at the same time, they don’t want Beast Cleave-activation to be tied into your normal rotation. I assume Multi-Shot is the way they chose for this.