Behold the power of Zug, and “FaCtIoN cOnFlIcT.”
Stupid argumentative thread derailments like this are another example of why the factions need to die.
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Sylvanas does not ever state that the War of the Thorns was retaliation for Stormheim. In fact, neither Sylvanas or Saurfang ever mentions Stormheim to any of the Horde soldiers before, during, or after the War of the Thorns.
Stormheim is just a thing some Horde fan posters cling onto that no one in the Horde within the setting actually ever publicly brings up. To the point where the Horde even works side by side with Genn Greymane himself to bring Azshara and Sylvanas down.
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In the novella, Sylvanas uses Genn actions, and the lack of any apparent repercussions to Genn, as evidence that the Alliance will attack anytime they want and that war is only a matter of time.
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I will agree that conflict between the factions is very good for Wow. The problem is like others have said is that Blizzard drop the ball each time they have the Horde and Alliance go to all out War. Blizzard should of just kept it a cold war with minor battles happening over lands that are not under the control of Alliance or Horde.
While they did a better job in MOP it was still a bad time for Horde Players overall the only real Difference is a lot of Horde Players did not like Garrosh at least that was my take on it, Also that war did not damage the Horde long term.
In BFA at first we do not know what started the war we know the Tree burns and the Alliance is launching an all out attack on Undercity. I remember when i saw the first picture of the tree burning and i though there was no way Blizzard would have the Horde do it cause of the damage it would cause but i was wrong that what Blizzard did.
Regardless if you like or hate Sylvanas besides Thrall she is one of the most important characters for the Horde given her history. Blizzard took the path they took with her and i think they went to far. Sylvanas will she do mess up things yes and i am sure alot of people might of done the same if they were in her place and had live her life and others would not it just depends on the person. They wasted her for a pointless war story that has no pay off in that story and i really doubt the payoff in Shadowlands will be worth it but only time will tell there.
Blizzard Damage the Horde and i doubt there anyway to fix that minus going back in time to right after Legion.
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Well if they continue implementing faction war storylines at this point then it will completely trash the last half of BfA. If the expansion after Shadowlands is another case of “PuT tHe WaR bAcK iN WaRcRaFt” then what was the point of Baine and Saurfang’s rebellion and the whole “What’s different this time?”/“Where is our home?” thing?
I know that wouldn’t be the first time, but c’mon. It stretched the point of belief this time. If it happens again without an extremely good reason then it will be beyond stupid.
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It hasn’t worked well for pvp. It’s filler for pve. It’s garbage for storytelling.
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Sylvanas offhand mentions Genn to Saurfang. And Saurfang buys into a false fear that Genn could get Anduin to attack them at any time in his own mind. But Saurfang never vocalizes that to any Horde soldier, and Sylvanas never brings Stormheim up herself ever or even Genn ever again after that. Thus, the War of the Thorns was not done out of retaliation for Stormheim, but at best out of fear of the Alliance.
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Yeah, this doesn’t follow. It was a central point that changes Saurfang’s mind and sways the leadership she needs. The fact that they use it as slogans to the troops has to be, IMO, one of the least significant reasons.
And the fear was very real. The Alliance had a long history of feeling justified in anything they do to the horde and a significant faction of their leadership would never shut up about the need to “eliminate” the Horde.
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Hah. Sylvanas blames the Horde just as much as she blames the Alliance for that tension. Sylvanas was spitting anything out she could to play Saurfang. Because that was the central point, getting Saurfang to agree to the war so she could get as many people killed as possible, not because she wanted to stand up for the sanctity of the Horde’s position of Warchief.
The Hords alleged fear that has zero real justification since the only faction that is a serious constant source of psychotic aggression and unjustified malice is the Horde, and this even goes for Thralls Horde. Hell, the fact that they kept the symbols of the 2nd War era Horde and the name “HORDE” is proof that the Orcs especially are too pig headed to comprehend how that actually looks or simply don’t care.
Which absolutely sucks because you are right, this shouldn’t be how the story reads. The internment camps should be this awful thing that creates shades of grey, but given the first two games and how Orcs have been written since, it actually does make the Humans into Jesus levels of merciful towards their enemies, and Orcs into psychotic narcissistic children with zero capacity for morality.
I love PvP, and WPvP in particular. Sneaking a group into Stormwind and taking over a defensible position in the Blue Recluse is tons of fun.
And I loved the Invasions - when they worked properly. In my experience it was a curb stomp for one side about 7 out of 10 times. But they were fantastic when there was a fair number of players. Hell now with flight I love going on to the Horde warship to throw players to their death off it with Shining Force or MC.
Suffice to say I love PVP and in particular love attacking Alliance city’s. There just more fun to rampage through then the Horde ones.
But I still think the main story ought to leave the Alliance and Horde conflict as a cold war.
I’ve had so much more fun attacking Darnassus on my own then I ever did watching it burn in a cutscene. And likewise I’m having a lot more fun doing an RPPVP campaign with the Alliance through Duskwood, SoS and the Blasted Lands.
Blizzard just seems to make things worse when they try to make the faction conflict the main story. One of us are red, the other are blue, we look different and don’t sound the same. That’s all you need to get people to attack eachother. Just add in some BGs and maybe some PvP hotspots like Wintergrasp or those towers in Hellfire that’d give the side who took them a buff. That’s all we need.
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I must disapprove of you here, Benedikt, only because WrA is sometimes subject to Alliance raids from off-server that do the same thing, only they spam Starfall and banners and lag out the capital like hell.
Rallying people for PvP on WrA is a depressing exercise at best. e_e
Had that happen in our portal room a few times but the Blue Devils were routed fairly quickly.
Personally I’m still envious of the Alliance portal room. It’s much more defensible and is in the middle of the city, as opposed to the front door.
Pretty much everything the Alliance has is much more defensible and laid out better. It also feels like their PvE guards are of better quality as well. I sometimes wonder if Blizzard deliberately sneaks these small edges in for Alliance side because they have historically gotten rolled in WPvP or something.
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I literally never once saw them win the Nazjatar PvP thing so - quite possible.
WrA is the exact 100% opposite of that.
https://i.imgur.com/Nm3ysOz.jpg
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Darn near every developed nation on our planet has committed an atrocity or two(or more) all for a flag or an idea or some sort of narrative, and afterwards they didn’t rewrite their entire history and change everything about themselves(I realize some nations have), they just spun said event off as a good thing to their citizens and those citizens believed it, so this isn’t really out of the ordinary at all…
Thrall was doing a pretty good job at redeeming in most people’s mind but to many inconsistencies and poor writing and the “NEED” for faction conflict tarnished that a bit. There was no need for them to ruin all the potential that Garrosh could have had and send The Horde down in a spiral, only to bring them back to Thrall like times with Vol’Jin only to throw his great story off to the side(hopefully we see more of him in Shadowlands) to promote another warmongering idiot to the for front of the story all for MoP 2.0 to happen.
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I could write an essay on how warmode’s new rewards screwed over the formerly balanced wpvp circuits on RP servers.
If you want to win on Horde, you have to bail on the RP server cluster and get easy rewards on a different shard. If you want to win on Alliance, you have to bail on any other kind of server and go to the RP servers.
Their inability to balance shards has just made both sides flee for the servers imbalanced in their favor.
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Yep.
The issue is that warmode doesn’t connect all of NA’s players – normal and RP – but all of NA’s servers are rewarded the same. There are more Horde on normal servers, so RP servers get the same rewards that Normal ones do.
We were obscenely balanced before the change, but that first week let Alliance complete their WPVP quests in raids, so that one week sealed the deal and pounded the final nail in the coffin for RP server WPVP balance.