Evokers should get a third spec and that third spec should be tank

[Tuto-malganis]

You know blizzard is too lazy in making a third spec… Just look at the demon hunter…

[Awkward-frostmourne (Awkward)]

Realistically every game that has roles beyond different flavours of DPS is always going to see a “shortage” of support roles (tank or otherwise) not because there’s a true shortage, but just because among the general population, DPS are way more popular skewing the role imbalance.

The problem isn’t a shortage of support roles. It’s a glut of DPS roles, because most games treat them as the default role, so people tend to not want to step out of their comfort zone and play them.

[Mournefall-lothar]

@Awkward-frostmourne

Realistically every game that has roles beyond different flavours of DPS is always going to see a “shortage” of support roles (tank or otherwise) not because there’s a true shortage, but just because among the general population, DPS are way more popular skewing the role imbalance.

The problem isn’t a shortage of support roles. It’s a glut of DPS roles, because most games treat them as the default role, so people tend to not want to step out of their comfort zone and play them.

Yes, I agree - that was my point. DPS is more popular for a variety of reasons and less stressful (i.e. within their comfort zone), which, as you say, skews the balance. I was not saying there are not enough tank/healer roles.

[Clayd-moon-guard]

Go back to your own planet and we’ll talk.

[Awkward-frostmourne (Awkward)]

@Mournefall-lothar

Yes, I agree - that was my point. DPS is more popular for a variety of reasons and less stressful (i.e. within their comfort zone), which, as you say, skews the balance. I was not saying there are not enough tank/healer roles.

Agreed. Just clarifying that this phenomenon isn’t really WoW, nor MMO exclusive.

I played a lot of Overwatch and there was always a Tank/Healer shortage and when people inevitably got auto-filled into those roles, they preferred to play the most DPS analog champs they could among the Tank/Healer roster (usually champs like Roadhog or Ana).

And while OW you can make the argument that DPS is the default role because people play FPS’ to you know, shoot stuff, it even applies in League with stuff like DPS supports, assassins/ADC’s in top lane, and so on.

[Mournefall-lothar]

@Awkward-frostmourne

Agreed. Just clarifying that this phenomenon isn’t really WoW, nor MMO exclusive.

That is fair.
It is certainly not WoW exclusive, but an online FPS with many players counts as an MMO(FPS), just to explain my usage of the term.

[Brewa-hyjal]

@Mournefall-lothar

@Dedaru-moon-guard

You guys do realize that adding more tanks doesn’t solve the (supposed) tank shortage problem.

Maybe, perhaps, the reason for the tank shortage is because this community is a hive of scum and villainy?

Every MMO with tank roles seems to be short of players to assume them. WoW’s issue is certainly worse (certainly worse), but I think people find DPS specs and classes more interesting, less stressful, and more fun to play. Speaking generally.
The latter part of your reply is not exactly incorrect, but I would not chalk it up to that as a lone cause.

There is no tank shortage, though, there hasn’t been in years. That’s why Dedaru referred to the “supposed” tank shortage.

Looking for a guild? They don’t need tanks.
Want to join a raid team? They don’t need tanks.
Want to arena? They don’t need tanks, if a tank spec is accidentally good in arena, Blizzard nerfs it.
Want to do rated battlegrounds? They need 1 tank tops, if that.
Want to do world content? It’s gonna take forever. Tanks not needed. The hunter/warlock pets will spam-taunt everything off you, which is super annoying.

WoW has the Unwelcome Mat out for tanks, across the board. There are far more people wanting to tank than there are places for them to fill.

The ONLY exception is 5-man random pugs.

So what is it that distinguishes 5-man random pugs from the entire rest of the game? Could it be the nasty attitudes and general idiocy of the DPS in 5-man pugs? Not sure what other explanation there would be.

[Mournefall-lothar]

@Brewa-hyjal

The ONLY exception is 5-man random pugs.

Which still proves there is a technical shortage, by one definition or another.
I definitely agree that it depends on where you look, but one exception is still an exception.

In my defence, I was truthfully thinking specifically in terms of LFR, as that is currently the only way I engage in group content.

[Brewa-hyjal]

The 5-man “shortage” is entirely player-driven, though. Adding 3 additional tanks has done NOTHING to “fix” it, nor would adding a 4th.

[Trapalicious-area-52]

uhuh uhuh
need i remind yall

@Trapalicious-area-52

Stick to the discussion, not looking for alternative classes, solutions, or discussing “tank shortage”; evoker tank yes or no and why

[Brewa-hyjal]

The discussion ended immediately, there are zero reasons to add a tanking spec to dracthyr, and many many many reasons against.

[Trapalicious-area-52]

@Brewa-hyjal

there are zero reasons to add a tanking spec to dracthyr, and many many many reasons against.

PLEASE LIST THEM

[Brewa-hyjal]

I have, and so have many others, you just have zero interest in reading.

[Trapalicious-area-52]

where? I must have missed it or was blizzard said so your only reason?

[Brewa-hyjal]

In this thread, and in another thread I remember you spamming in about this subject.

The answers are there.

Your issue is that you’re so busy shouting at people, that you never bother to listen to what they’re saying.

[Trapalicious-area-52]

yet when i ask you to list reasons you cant provide them…/rolls eyes

[Mournefall-lothar]

@Brewa-hyjal

The 5-man “shortage” is entirely player-driven, though. Adding 3 additional tanks has done NOTHING to “fix” it, nor would adding a 4th.

Which is fair to say, and I am not intending to be callous here, but I never said I was of the opinion that adding more tanks would somehow fix it, what I commented was a personal observation.

In short, I was somewhat off-topic.

[Trapalicious-area-52]

@Brewa-hyjal

Tanking Evokers is just a terrible idea, all around.

@Brewa-hyjal

Okay, let’s delete Vengeance and give all its mechanics to Evoker tanks. Except the parts they stole from Warlocks, those should go back to them.

@Brewa-hyjal

I understand the history of tank design through WoW’s history. That’s all you need to understand why adding more tanks is a bad idea - something that seems to have even occurred to the dev team (finally).

@Brewa-hyjal

It’s an opinion backed up by a long history of facts, as opposed to the “I want a pony!” of the OP.

@Brewa-hyjal

It’s not about “balanced” tanks, they ran out of ideas a while ago. There are only so many things you can do with tanks and Blizzard has exhausted the pool.

This last one is pretty much your only reason given and is completely false, you cant think of other ways to tank doesn’t mean blizzard cant. Heres one, a caster based tank that uses the 5 dragon aspects

[Purecynicism-frostwolf (Purecynicism)]

@Mournefall-lothar

In short, I was somewhat off-topic.

You were on-topic for one of the emergent discussions that arose due to the OP’s failures at the very beginning. Let’s also note that the person in question hasn’t stayed on-topic either but now ironically demands return to his failed topic (again).

[Trapalicious-area-52]

ahh Professor Masterdebater, lets hear your critique of all the other posts shall we? Did you finally come up with reasons for or against evoker tanks of your own?

Also please elaborate how a class is responsible for a “tank shortage” if there even is one and how that relates to evokers getting a tank spec. Short answer it doesnt because the so called shortage of tanks is an illusion based on the number of tanks needed to complete activities which is completely different from the claim that tanks have the least amount of spec options to play as in the game. In other words encounter design doesnt give room for tanks the way it does for heals and dps so therefore players actively tanking in said encounters have less spots if they want to play said role