A lot of ebgs are boring because players always do the same things, which are running straight to the end of the map with no conflict with the enemy and hoping we’re faster, or saying we have to get the same base at the start of every match and players leaving the game if we don’t get it. The most fun I have had is when the team decides to do something different and we have a new conflict with the enemy team. Maybe a map that changes bases locations or having more options to defend our main base would help to stop players from defaulting to the same plan every match.
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Strat repetition is fine, especially with the disparity between popular ones (Hangar turtle vs glaive “is the enemy team afk” lottery)
But yeah the people leaving bgs the moment the first team fight looks like anything but a faceroll are the real fun killers.
6 Likes
Like Seething Shore?
Bases pop up randomly at pre-determined locations?
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Kinda, but I mean more like changing bases locations once at the start of the game, nothing to game changing, just to make the players try something new.
To be fair, in pugs-vs-pugs if the big teamfight happens at X location (hangar, SR, ROC, etc) - and some of your pugs decide to deviate from the strat/run off to do their own thing - you will probably lose that big teamfight
It’s simple math really, let’s use hangar as an example…
- team A sends 39 players to hangar, maybe 1 to mid
- team B send 30-32 players to hangar, and the other 8-10 run off to “do their own thing” at the other bases
- team A wins because 39 players > 30 players, even if the 30 players are a little better geared
Splitting up at the start of an epic BG is basically a death sentence in a pugs-vs-pugs matchup. And because most major cooldowns are blown in that very first engagement/first teamfight it’s more efficient to just leave rather than try to (unsuccessfully) rally your now-demoralized pug player teammates to have another go at base X
Premade can recover from a rough start, but it rarely happens with pug player teammates. Yes, it does get boring “defaulting” to base X every match, but the alternative is splitting up the team and (indirectly) causing a loss that way
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How is leaving a losing BG not fun?
Losing a BG especially one that last 30 minutes isnt fun.
The deserter is faster in every case for epics.
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people ruin everything.
ban people.
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If you think pug bg teams are incapable of doing some world class NBA throws, you’re out of your mind.
The current state of the game where half the team afks or leaves after losing one team fight you are right, but that wouldn’t be the case if people just buckled down and pressed their buttons past the 45 second mark.
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Most of the BGs are poorly designed to begin with.
Wintergrasp’s silly mechanic of you have to kill before you build is stupid. This makes you have to go to the same place and if the offense wins the defense still has a chance, but if the offense loses you’re screwed most of the time. It could be designed so much better. Imagine offense starting with vehicles and defense having to actually defend the base. Too often defense turns into offense when they win the first fight, taking towers and workshops in one big mass of unstoppable vehicles.
AV the same, why on Earth is it designed for both sides to just bypass each other and go straight to their bases? I know this is fantasy…but no battleground would ever happen that way, even in fiction.
Ashran needs more metas than just summoning for the win. Horrible design, could be so much better.
Isle of Conquest is the only one that can truly be won multiple ways, but right now it sucks because glaives are too squishy.
I do agree that players are at fault at times too, but the design could be better at promoting pvp play.
3 Likes
99% of every epic I been in where the team loses the initial team fight ends up a loss so leaving gets you to re que faster because the deserter is over before the losing epic BG is.
Horde loses hangar at start? 99% loss in my experience. Horde cannot defend glaives at all
Ashran? ROC fight ends in a horde loss then 99% of time its a loss. Horde cannot organize to back door Trem.
AV? First team to burn 2 and all in wins.
Wintergrasp? If offense loses SR its 99% loss rate for me. On defense its different because the walls are ridiculously OP…
Ive done enough epics to know when to bail out and the deserter is over faster.
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If you think losing unlosable games is a horde exclusive ability I implore you to try alliance haha.
Both sides are equally bad and capable of throwing free wins away, people like you just give up before the match even starts…
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Ive did alliance too. I got like 8 toons or so over there.
Alliance ALWAYS gets to hangar first at IOC. ALWAYS, and if horde doesnt protect glaives its an easy win for alliance.
WIntergrasp is a toss up when I did alliance. Offense was a coin flip but defense was usually a win. It all depended on who won the initial team fight at SR
Ashran for me on alliance was usually a win. We most always won ROC team fight or were able to organize a back door. Horde cant organize anything at ashran. Its bad.
So the alliance thing means nothing. I won way more when I went alliance. I just cant stand alliance races. None of them have the cool factor to me
Horde is exceptionally bad right now. Has been this entire patch.
welcome to pugs . there are communities for both factions . Other then that idk what to tell you . Its nothing exclusive to epics either . Same thing happens in random bgs , rbgs , LFR, and dungeons .
no how about they just give us tol and strands into epics to have more maps . Also every epic is different already because every team will do things different already .
Players do the same thing because the Devs won’t fix Epic BGs. It’s 1000% the Devs fault for the bosses to be killable by players. It’s 1000% the Devs fault for not requiring you summon the Forest lord in AV to win. It’s 1000% the Devs fault for allowing siege/cannon damage to be broken and do more damage than players (when it shouldn’t damage players at all)
Epic BGs should be long hard fought battles over objectives. Players should be getting 200-300 HKs an Epic BG in order to secure a victory. They should be about 45 mins long.
Epic BGs should just be removed if the Devs can’t fix them and put the little time required into actually making them Epic. This is a game design problem.
The ONLY time Epics were fun was at the launch of DF when NO ONE could kill the end bosses in Isle and AV. You then were forced to PvP. You had to summon the NPCs in AV because you couldn’t even take towers. It was amazing fun and battles were fought almost entirely in the field of strife down to the last resource.
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Working as intended.™
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Yep. Defintiely the direction that is wanted for better or worse according to what faction a player is on.
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Like what? “Different” does not equal useful.
The reason meta strats exist is because they’re generally the easiest/most straightforward way to win an eBG, BUT they do not in themselves guarantee a win. That’s where strategy comes in, but many pugs are too lazy or defeatist to use counters, even against other pugs.
2 Likes
sir, why is your profile “hidden”?
You seem to know what’s up, would love to read more of your takes lol
Yes, that’s the real problem
Leaving these 40-man maps imbalanced for years will obviously cause pug players to “default” to using the same strat or rushing the same base at the start of every match - if the maps were better designed/better balanced maybe there would be a bit more variety in how these BGs play out
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o god no no more remove seething