Which pretty much explains how this “End the War on Solo Gameplay” thread came about, ne?
1 Like
Especially since what some are asking for is end game for their style of play. End game can be different for different people.
If one wants to make Torghast their end game, give them what it takes and design it to enable such.
If one wants to push challenging content they can do solo, provide such
If people feel like grouping and pushing M+ and/or Raid? fine
If people want to do PvP, all well and good
6 Likes
Ya. Like The recommended ilvl to do a 16 is 280.
There are mounts and stuff for 16 flawless runs.
I find it weird to have to do group content to have the recommended ilvl to do the solo content.
Visions of N’zoth was a better solo experience. I got gear as I progressed through that mode. I didn’t need to do much other modes. Torgast feels way better and easier to do after I started pugging mythics.
Which is dissapointing since I mostly had wanted to play solo. Mythic runs can be fun but it would be nice to get good gear playing by myself.
It is a game after all. We don’t all enjoy the same game modes. Mythics can be fun but sometimes you just want to gear a character by yourself. BFA visions was nice in that regard. And it was something you can choose to do as a group too like torgast.
3 Likes
Hell, I got the achievement for 5 mask SOLO runs on those, partly because I got sick and tired of others causing the group to wipe on them because they had to “go go go” or could not hold their AoE/let me pull to an area they could go hog wild with it. I am a more tactical fighter, I try to set things up so in coming damage is low, we can dodge most, if not all, AoE without pulling, etc.
Group content may be harder, but from my experience it is sometimes harder because the group is a bunch of window licking, mouth breathing, DPS focused rushing retards. If the group is the main form of challenge, and not the content itself, maybe the rewards for higher content are too much.
3 Likes
RN group content gets easier as you get more gear. Arguably that gear is the best solo gear they expect you to do torgast with.
Which is silly to me. Its a design that makes torgast enjoyable if you both enjoy group content and solo content.
This expansion suffered a bunch of that weird design. You are good at torgast if you grind venari rep. You are good in random bgs only if you grind rated. You can only use valor in mythic plus runs and have to unlock it with rating on each character.
Very limiting unfun ways to progress if you don’t enjoy the full game. Making you do content you may not want to do.
3 Likes
This, on its own, is backwards, it should be you grind random to get what you need for rated and then you build up your rating to get what you need to keep pushing.
2 Likes
IGN had an interesting article along these lines a couple days ago called Accessibility Isn’t Easy: What ‘Easy Mode’ Debates Miss About Bringing Games to Everyone.
It is backward. But that is what happens when you gate progression through a rating system.
3 Likes
That whole Mage Tower boost banwave situation is surprising… and disturbing.
Blizzard refused to tune the challenges to more reasonable levels despite the majority of players (even the ones who were able to complete their challenges) saying that the new ones were overtuned and more difficult than the Legion ones.
Then apparently a significant number of players were willing to pay gold or real world money and risk having their accounts hacked or banned just for cosmetic rewards.
Then Blizzard banned those players the day before a new patch launched, even though the rewards were cosmetic and did not affect other players, while PvP boosting goes unbanned despite affecting other players?!
It is obvious that Blizzard is trying its best to appease the top-end players by giving them the prestige that they are clamoring for, even at the cost of the forcing other players out.
4 Likes
Sorry man, but cheating is cheating. Impossible to get a “boost” for Mage Tower unless you hand over your account to a 3rd party person/stranger
3 Likes
Of course.
I just find it strange that people would cheat when the reward isn’t even player power, and when they could do it on their own without a team. The challenge itself is the content and the real reward is the satisfaction of beating it, so it seems odd to pay to skip it!
But I also find it strange that Blizzard banned paying customers the day before a new patch released for “skipping” solo content for cosmetic rewards, just to protect the prestige of top end players.
The whole situation is bad. Both players and devs are treating WoW like a sport rather than a game.
I think there is a fomo element that pressured people into wanting to get it. Since its only available to even try two-three weeks a year. So there obviously was a demand for it. And boosting was being advertised in the game. Blizzard created an artificial demand for it by making it a limited time event.
I think blizz is partly to blame for that, for the fomo tactics. That even boosters used to boost there sales.
3 Likes
This can be summed up with more challenging content giving stronger rewards.
Which is the most logical way to develop an RPG I’m amazed at how much trouble people have with it.
But candy crush does make more money than WoW, so I guess I shouldn’t be surprised.
Hmm rn I am about the same ilvl I would be if I just did ZM. Doing a flawless 16 is very diffiucult rn. But soon as the season starts and I start getting gear from mythics it will be an easier time. Group content getting better gear makes doing group content easier over time. Why shouldn’t this work with solo content?
I doubt many people would want to do group content if gear didn’t drop for example. So why does solo content have to be like that?
4 Likes
It’s funny reading this while I’m simultaneously playing TBC classic and anyone that is a solo player there has their progression basically end after hit 70.
Legion → Shadowlands have massively rewarded the solo casual world content player way more than the expansions before it. With maybe the exception of WoD for PvP gear only.
If it’s overtuned then how did the person playing your account do the challenge?
1 Like
Yes, which does make sense, the issue comes when people do the higher content then go into LESSER content and dominate when the ones who are trying to do it the standard way (build up in randoms to enter rated, then build rating to keep pushing rating) and as such want a way, or a systme, they can use to build up without being dominated.
Here in the thing, quite a few would likley be happy if the content they were doing allowed them to push harder in same content. Using Torghast as an example, The ilvl rec for a layer 16 is: 280, this is only achievable in raid/M+/Rated PvP, yet Torghast is made to do solo or as a group. Why can’t the solo player grind lower layers and get gear to do the higher ones?
This is the attitude I am seeing from those defending group content as the only way to get high gear: you have to do our content to enjoy yours, but we don’t want to do your content to do ours.
4 Likes
Torghast becomes more and more challenging with each layer, but none of it makes my character more powerful, so Shadowlands already breaks that rule.
In a traditional RPG, defeating more powerful enemies makes your character stronger, but again in Torghast my character becomes no stronger despite each layer requiring higher power levels. Do you not see how Shadowlands is breaking the rule you just established?
For a solo player, your “game” does not include any way to earn the gear that you need to surmount the highest challenges presented to you.
Yes, the demand for raid-or-die games is actually pretty low in the gaming industry overall. Maybe WoW should make more money, too, by expanding its gameplay options beyond raiding?
Yes, as much as the elitists like to say that Torghast is mind-numbingly easy, achieving a Flawless on Layer 16 right now in lower iLvl gear requires skill and/or luck.
This flaw in Shadowlands system design is the crux of the issue. The war on solo gameplay is killing the game’s population and leading to a huge amount of waste in developing content like Torghast, which managed to please neither group content players nor solo players.
Legion and BfA, maybe, but not Shadowlands. Shadowlands is actually worse than WoD for rewarding world content, if you compare Zereth Mortis with Tanaan Jungle.
Even if you can earn Torghast gear that only has a high iLvl in Torghast, the option should be there to progress through Torghast solely.
There is simply no logical way to defend Shadowlands systems design. No, group content players should not have had to grind world content for conduits and sockets in 9.0 and 9.1, but solo content should not be nearly impossible without group content gear, either.
What if Torghast and raid rewards were reversed, and in 9.0 and 9.1 you had to raid just for legendary mats, and get your gear from Torghast? Then in 9.2, raid rewards were made to be cosmetic only and still did not include gear drops? I can only imagine the raider outrage.
Raiders are honestly at the center of Shadowlands game design, even though less than half of the playerbase raids at Normal or higher. In Legion and BfA, on the other hand, you could still feel like you were playing the base game even without raiding.
1 Like
What is the source for this dubious statistic? Blizzard has never published it and Armory aggregation is woefully inaccurate.
1 Like
I am a solo player and I am having a great time. Shadowlands was/is awesome for solo players, from Torghast to the maw invasion things to multiple covenant campaigns to soloable zones, its been a lot of fun.
1 Like