Ascendance changes are very good… despite the awful visual update…
The pathing options are much much better… I can avoid stupid ice and fire almost completely and be a proper lightning shaman… almost anyway. lol
The big tough points are skyburners being deleted and no pet cd changes 2min base should be fine without skyburners, empowered pet talent kinda dead with skyburners being removed. pets recently being big nerfed with these changes make them feel real bad, fol being nerfed is fine but farseer is basically dead without it, needs some changes or buffs. dre proc chance is way too low being on a spender. consuming flame shock talent is overall a bad talent when flame shock is already terrible to manage, we shouldve gotten the flame shock talent enhance got. lmt should put up 6 flame shocks or turned into a smart apply. pathing to get pwave doesnt feel too great and it being as good as it is it being closer to middle could make pathing feel better.
Is this what we get for making fun of those hideous ascendance forms?
These changes are huge nerfs for a spec that got 2 weeks in the sun. It’s not like it was incredibly fun gameplay either. There is still a lot of mechanical clunk that was only propped up by good damage. Hopefully the mechanical changes improve the spec, but it’s not looking good.
Idk, have to look at talent tree to see if can be workable.
The bottom pvp changes were soley aimed at the one shot build which was difficult but fun to play.
Any person who had a head on their shoulders could counter it but it seems the person behind this idea didn’t have a clue so did the work for those he likewise were lost on how to deal with anyone using it.
I have used it and played against it. Very easy to counter especially with the hard casting. So I guess ele players will be stuck with these boring options. I can’t help but wonder which Dev got scorched by this build it makes me chuckle thinking about it.
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Depends on the CD. If for pve yeah I guess. CHoose one boring optionof jumping and pressing 3 buttons with lava burst to using 2 with lightning.
(shrug) idk, I stated this on another post but being a pet class (even temporary pet/ancestor) is just more of the same. I am fine with the standard ele’s (earth, storm, fire) but the other stuff is an attempt and trying to control proc’s and is rng at best.
May be great for others but not my cup of tea. I do agree the spec needs some freshening up.
On another note,I am liking the direction of enhancement and hopefully it will continue.
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This!
The new one shot will be the most telegraphed one on 2 min. CD. Every half decent player will know how to react to it.
Idk, the old one shot they just removed was easy enought to see yet they felt a need to remove the entirety of it.
I mean, players do have pay attention right?
The one in 11.0.5 will be even more transparent - cast Stormkeeper → Primordial + AS → Ascenadance → Lightning Bolt → Lava Burst → Lightning Bolt → Lava Burst → Earth Shock. There is no way someone won’t press the defensive CD in the middle of the sequence.
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Correct but with the removal of volcanic surge and the 50% pvp nerf to lava burst while in ascnedance as well as the nerf to lava burst while going into ascendance by 50%.
You wont hit hard. It will be in line with the way it hit in DF whihc with all the stamina now the damage wont be much of anything at first glance.
When anyone saw storm keeper and/or the spiritwalker’s grace (immunity) along with primordial wave. Oh yeah it was coming, time to stun, fear etc. could not kick that with the talent that gave immunity but there was always a way.
Now setting it up in 2/3rds of what you did for soft & hard burst approaches on a player who was hovering around 50% health was where the gamesmanship came into play.
Good points though. I want to see how they moved the tree around to see what is available then work from there.
Been messing around on PTR, my comments have nothing to do with pve but as far as pvp goes we are looking still pretty bursty.
Been trying a mastery build on the ptr and Stormkeeper with power of the maelstrom alone is pumping (does on live too, roughly 2.8M dmg with zero crits in honor gear, but you dont have the talents to take it on retail), It actually adds quite a bit of damage, including the lightning ele that it summons in addition to the damage from a primo wave/ancestor window.
Flame shocks out, fish for maelstrom procs (pretty much always up), stormkeeper > magma totem > primo wave lava burst > NS lava burst > bolt x2 > earth shock dump is doing a ton of damage, really doesn’t have much setup either as power of the maelstrom procs so often they are almost always up already, its just pre casting a stormkeeper and magma totem for max shocks which you already do then dumping.
Idk if its better to keep primo/NS macrod together now that you get a forced lava surge on primo wave, if you separate them you get two forced instant cast lava bursts instead of the one.
Damage/cleave in a full ascend go seems pretty wild too, you can literally just pre stormkeeper > ascend > primo wave + lava burst > NS + lava burst > 2x stormkeeper bolts then dump maelstrom in earth shocks with everything overloading for a ton of extra damage.
Will try to find a player to test on as all that is available is the pvp dummy but it doesn’t feel weak at all.
Really do dislike how low elemental uptime is, honestly feels not worth playing some of the elemental talents because of it. This is very minimal testing though so opinion can quickly change.
It will work till 2100 maybe where people don’t press def CDs but everyone above will press def CDs.
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Same can be said with any specs damage. considering you can do that every 1min if you’re not getting it off by setting up CC/stun on kill target that’s on you.
It’s looking like ele has 3 decent damage windows, 30sec with primo/NS - 1min with stormkeeper added, and 2min with ascend. Each of the windows looks to be adding a good bit of damage for a kill.
Sure this is more setup based play rather than just rotting them down like previous iterations of the spec, but it is what it is. Doesn’t look terrible unless you just play ele to pve people to death.
Not really bro. Average spec just has to press 1-2 globals to go balls deep. Here just casting Stormkeeper will make every Weak Aura siren sound and everyone will know what’s cooking. It’s just too many globals. It might work in Legion or WoD but in era of everyone having 10 weak auras I doubt.
Also Elemental wasn’t rotting since BFA. DF was rather tempo based gameplay. Building momentum and advantage based on kicks landed etc. Average game was shorter than in SL.
Yikes. DO NOT go Spriest.
Guess windwalkers can’t kill anyone because weak auras tell everyone when images are used, or rets are worthless because they make a loud sound and brightly glow before doing big damage. War can’t ever kill anyone because weak auras tell you when warbreaker is used, Shadow blades on rogue ect ect. This is only a problem if you’re throwing your cooldowns into air, and its the same problem for every spec in the game.
Every spec has this issue, it isn’t ele related. The reality is current ele is strong, and ptr ele is current ele playstyle with some extra damage. Ascend is being made into a better cooldown, It’s now going to buff your other damage during your offensive window.
Can doom and gloom or just adapt, Do you think ele is currently weak in pvp? It’s not.
The only terrible changes that just feel awful is the removal of skybreaker and deeply rooted elements being changed to earth shock instead of lava bursts (needs its proc chance greatly increased or dead talent)
But the difference is that WW firstly stuns you and then then press 2 globals not 4 before even start doing damage. You get me?
No. I like it very much. It’s good balance of all magic schools. Lava Burst, Earth Shoch, Icefury, Elemental Blast procs and Frost Shocks.
For me the worst part is that you are forced into mastery that with the talents is basically the same Mastery we had in DF. So we are back to the entry point. Playing Stormkeeper like season 1 DF. My issue is also that due to damage profile change I’d most likely need to play with other partners. I don’t want to look for new ones. You feel me? I want to play with my Druid and Warlock friends. That’s why I consider SP as an alternative. I played SP before with decent success.
I couldn’t care less if it will be as strong as now. I played Ele in season 1 BFA when it was terrible so I’d play it if it was C Tier. It’s more about the gameplay and being forced into playing something else.
Ele is going to play pretty much exactly like it does right now, but it sounds to me you just want to play shadowplay rot style in which case just play that.
Flame shock wasn’t rotting down teams with skybreaker.
Whoops, edited post instead of making a new one.
Because the damage profile doesn’t match. Also if you play with Affliction Hex is useless as it will break from damage easily. SP will match it way better. Just spread sustain pressure with burst window on Halo. Before I just did spread pressure in 30 sec windows with Primordial + AS. As you mentioned Skybreaker’s is gone so Flame Shock will also do less. With this rework you will need to play something more setup based. Maybe Outlaw/Ele or Boomkin/Ele.
Icefury and Frostshock, “cleaving buffs clearly”
Frostshock’s base damage is increased significantly 57 → 104%. For all shaman this means that it’s something much more worthwhile to pick up and use as just a stand-alone talent.
The reduced damage multiplier expressed by Icefury probably presents a normalization to reflect the above change, 100% up meets >100% down. It looks like it’s only slightly down in single-target. Having the AoE is great, and means it’ll be useful in M+ for not just weaving and generating maelstrom, but because it’s doing work.
- Maelstrom Generation, “more sources more procs”
Speaking of maelstrom, the loss of Flow of Power depends on the length of the fight. Getting maelstrom from reapplying Flameshocks either directly (3) every ~15 or through LMT (8) every ~26 by itself should be a net gain for short fights. It’s an immediate infusion of 8-11 maelstrom in two GCDs.
The renewed emphasis upon Elemental Overloads from the rest of the kit largely indicates there’ll be more maelstrom during a fight.
Stormbringer,
Replacing Shocking Grasp with Mobility
Losing the slow from Shocking Grasp is good. It was redundant. I’m hoping that the two mobility talents available in the choice node are more useful. They both seem very enhancement focused. Tempest is a lot of damage, but it’s a hard cast that asks the spellcaster to follow it up to take advantage of lightning rod and everything else.
If one of the choice nodes was a mini Spirit Walker’s Grace 2-4 sec, I guess we’re stepping on Spirit Walker’s Momentum’s territory (no pun intended), but it’d be much more useful. A alternative would be a building charge, like Norgonnon’s that activates once the player starts moving. Think of it like a mobility capacitor, battery blitz.
Ascendance, “new star on deck”
Recentered and renewed focus. While a lot of the new talents look like they want to be must haves, the rework here demands it. Completely different, just straight opener that I’m actually happy to see considering things like Warrior’s Thunderous Roar.
It’s certainly more analogous to other classes cooldowns, where you do what you are already doing, but just doing it on another level. It plays into the strength of Elemental Overloads, dialing them into 11 immediately.
Flexibility in Builds
I think this going to be a greater question than ever. Still a bit of a bastion of build diversity, but it’s certainly seems to be in the wings more than ever.
CDR
I think the biggest casualty is the CDR. The absolute removal of it means that the long 3 min cooldowns are extra actually 3 minutes long.
Mastery
We’re back to the old mastery, depending on talents, and likely depending on gear availability. It’s like a winding journey back to rediscover that identity. Meaningful overloads are a part of what makes the spec fun. I don’t like how it’s attached to Ascendance as much as it looks like it’ll be, but it’s nice that it’ll be an interesting burst window.
Also ele/affliction is 100% going to be viable post changes, without a doubt. (granted affliction tuned so high atm its going to make anything viable for now)