Now that the horde and us are at the bottom of the sea does the horde consider what Sylvanas did as an act of betrayal?
Yes Nathanos knew this would happen. Coincidence he vanished when you all went under? Nope. She knew Lorthermar and First Arcanist were on the edge of turning against her so she listened to dagger and told them to go to the sea.
But the “no” answer would be she didn’t betray the horde, as the horde died when she committed pointless genocide to kill hope. She raised a scourge army in it’s place of living and dead. She’s a dictator.
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Kills the own Horde in the Battle for Lordearon. Sylvanas fans: Nah, that’s fine. It’s war.
Baine does the same; OMG TRAITOR. incoherent screaming.
We all know Sylvanas is bad.
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And from what I am seeing, sinks Horde and Alliance into the sea, including the new race that decided to take a chance with the Horde’s leader.
Sylvanas fans- Nah she had reasons.
Meanwhile Thaylrssa has to be regretting this by now, watch her come crying and begging to Tyrande to let the Nightborne into the Alliance. Nope you knew she destroyed Teldrassil, you can now deal with the conquences. (Do Thay and Lore’thmar know Nathanos and Sylvanas attempted to kill them? They have portals so it’s not like they didn’t go back.).
Where is that cutscene? I am afraid I never saw the bit revealing they did this, just heard it for the second time. (FYI no matter what Sylvanas do, her fans are still going to defend her, right to the grave). Also if Nathanos knew this was going down, why did he make sure he was still on the boat? I know he would have likely survived but still, and you think he would have finished the job when he realised everyone survived.)
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The story is so ham-fisted at this point, I stopped caring a long time ago. It’s so full of plot holes and forced narratives that it makes zero sense.
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That’s not going to happen. Thalyssra pledged loyalty to the Horde. Not to Sylvanas.
The intention was never to kill Lor’themar and Thalyssra. Nathanos doesn’t even know they have turned yet. The intention was to destroy the Alliance’s fleet.
Because that wasn’t the goal.
They’re different situations. Sylvanas targeted Alliance forces and didn’t care about the Horde casualties. Baine targeted Horde forces to help the Alliance.
To put it another way, Sylvanas killed Horde forces to hurt the enemy. Baine killed Horde forces to help the enemy.
You can tell him about Lor’themar’s plan if you sided with Sylvanas instead of Saurfang. He says something along the lines that he’s disappointed but not that surprised that Lor’themar decided to oppose Sylvanas. He knew Lor’themar wasn’t her biggest fan but he didn’t consider him a traitor yet when they wen they started their yacht trip.
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Hmmm… but Thalyssra’s allegiance is still unkown?
He doesn’t specifically mention her either way. It could be that he doesn’t consider her a traitor yet, that he just lumps her in with Lor’themar, or that he just doesn’t care about her.
Nathanos didn’t vanish. He’s literally standing right outside camp half way on a hill. Got the fancy quest marker above his head when I was able to snitch on Lor’themar telling me about Thrall and Saurfangs little plan.
They know if your character chose to tell them, there’s a quest after which you can just go snitch it all out to Nathanos. I chose not to, but still, some people did hence why the storyline could go a bunch of different routes branching from the decision to side with either Sylvanas or Saurfang.
Ultimately, our choices aren’t going to matter. The most I can see happening is the people who chose the losing side getting a line of flavor text saying they’re on thin ice and it never being mentioned again.
Say what you will, but literally the first thing Nathanos says to you in Nazjatar is “Good, you’re on your feet. Your survival is integral to the Dark lady’s plan.” Seems like it doesn’t matter if you’re a loyalist or a traitor. If Sylvanas and Nate are trying to kill the Horde PC they’re not trying very hard.
Not inertly correct. Lor’Themar doesnt betray the Horde untill Nazjatar. When you tell on him to Nathanos, he says they knew he was weak hearted or something along those lines and it was just a matter of time to see him do this, but they didnt knew he jumped ship yet.
Victory for Sylvanas!
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They are definitely not trying to kill the Loyalist PC. During the rescue mission the Dark Ranger General you spar with has orders to ensure your safety and brings you to the alchemist/apothecary dude and he gives you a health potion to ensure your survival because the rest of the guards inside arent informed of your undercover plan.
Nathanos actually says “this isn’t his first betrayal” which… is a reference to Garrosh? Never took Nate for a member of the “Garrosh did nothing wrong” crowd especially considering Sylv “betrays” him too.
During Mists, Lor’themar was working on leaving the Horde for the Alliance until Jaina went on the warpath in Dalaran. I assumed that’s what he was referring to.
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This is what some don’t get, those of us, even Baine, pledged loyalty to the Horde, to the ideals and such that Thrall, Cairne, Vol’jin, etc instilled. Not to the Warchief/Sylvanas.
Sylvanas’ followers: you pledged loyalty to the warchief as the warchief is the Horde.
Me: Blackhand was the warchief, he was killed by Doomhammer, Garrosh was the warchief, members of the Horde rebelled and dethroned him.
They might not be as different as you think, Sylvanas is in a war with the alliance, to potentially end the faction conflict once and for all. Baine, and others, are in a war for the heart and soul of the Horde. To ones like Baine, the alliance is the honorable enemy but we also have to fight, and potentially kill, other horde that are blindly or fanatically loyal to Sylvanas.
The way it seems, the losing side is going to be Sylvanas and her followers
I am almost expecting it to be revealed that Sylvanas is testing all of the Horde to see which side is stronger, the ones that are willing to do anything to win or the ones that have their limits, I mean even she said “Honor means nothing to a corpse” which is what she is. However, Honor does mean something to those still living. In the end, it could be that Sylvans is just making sure the Horde is strong enough to stand up for itself and its beliefs.
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The Horde trusts in the Dark Lady’s plan.
It got tricked into doing so by a vision - but that’s sort of the Horde’s whole thing.
To begin with, Nerzhul lead the Horde into the Legion’s grasp because he had visions, where Kiljaeden appeared in a drag show as Nerzhul’s dead wife, Rulkan.
Bubble Woman can cram it.
Tyrande was right when she lambasted the Nightborne as feckless cowards who hid themselves away while the Kaldorei faced the Legion.
Thalyssra joined the Horde because they were less judgemental of her hypocrite rump. Now she has to deal with it.
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