I’d say the general WoW population roughly pugs 70-80% of the time in M+. Bnet would want to promote players to pug together with a combination of classes etc. It IS an MMO after all. But exactly the point that key owners suffer for someone doing a toxic act. And I guarantee you it’s the same people over and over again because there’s no repercussions. I don’t even wanna do my own key because of it sometimes.
The problem with people leaving a Mythic+ is really all about context.
On the one hand you may have people who do rage quit and leave because a single pull goes sideways or you have a wipe and they believe the key cannot be timed. These types of players are annoying and it is frustrating when this happens later in the dungeon and you feel like your time is wasted or your key is downgraded because of someone else.
But there is also the flip side of the argument where you get dropped into a really bad group of players and they’re pulling extremely slow, they’re wiping repeatedly, or you have a group that has undergeared players looking for a carry.
It’s not your or my job to carry people. Players either should be in a key equivalent to their gear and skill level. It isn’t my job nor anyone else to carry you. And if the key is not timed, loot will be lower ilvl in the end chest and perhaps I’m looking specifically for a given ilvl of loot or even IO; which is perfectly within my rights to do so. If the group is jeopardizing those things which is outside my control, why must I subject myself to that wasted time if the other players are bad or worse be penalized for it?
Look I get its frustrating when people leave for whatever reason, I’ve had it happen a few times over the most silly things. But what I’ve found is this behavior is most often self contained to the lower key levels so my advice is if you want to play with better players who understand that depletion is part of the process, get better and do higher keys.
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I’m gonna quit if we are not going to time the key.
If we wiped on first boss and we used lust, it’s basically over and I’m gonna leave the key. Period
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- You have 100% control over who you invite to keys.
- No deserter debuff until we can get BAD debuff for players who brick keys by doing sub-tank dps and standing in everything.
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this is an old topic, Devs already know about this kind of issues but it’s intended to be a premade group and a community issue, if they do any kind of repercussion, that could impact other players that left a group becuase a valid reason…etc, they should remove the key and just let us queue like Torghast if you beat a level you can move to next one.
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That’s a really piss poor attitude because that highly depends on the key level. I’ve timed dozens of high-level keys with a first-boss wipe without any issue, particularly places like Mists where Tyrannical Ingra Maloch can be problematic.
i’m sorry but if you start a M+ , it mean you are ready to play for the next 20-40 minutes + , if one guy has a problem and have to leave , he still should have a penality because he f others players
when i’m pugging , i’m playign with randoms players , i don’t know who they are , so valid reason or not , they should get a penality bcs they f my key
when i get a dc in a M+ i feel bad for others and wouldn’t care to get a penality
It’s at this time of tier where 15’s can be considered a “high key” or people just looking for gear. This isn’t about “Bro get better cus you’re playing low keys full of deserters.” Now if you’re talking about someone joining a group and it ends up being a carry, that either is something they should check themselves also.
I get your point about wanting to leave if the group wholly is either a carry or just bad. But then to me it becomes an issue when someone does it constantly back to back. If you’re talking about high end players wanting to leave because the “high key” won’t be timed, there is already that mutual understanding commonly practiced. But don’t you have to start back from the bottom if, say, you’re building an alt?
that’s really, really unusual. i don’t think i’ve seen it happen yet this season. what are you doing differently?
pugging a lot with constant +15-16 range
I think i’ve done nearly 60 dungeons this week (Avoiding my ele sham because the nerfs are insane and i’ve basically rerolled because of it) and… I’ve had what one? Maybe 2 deserters?
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I’m really not intending to be rude, but I run keys as my primary form of content in the game; I RARELY get a leaver. Usually, if I ever leave, it is because someone is not carrying their weight and this is going to drag on forever. If you are getting 2-3 leavers a DAY, something Idk if I even see in 2 or 3 WEEKS, there may be a reason for it.
If you are carrying your weight, make sure that you aren’t talking any trash in party chat, it makes people leave. If you are truly doing everything right and getting 2-3 leavers a day, you might have rolled bad RNG lol
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Probably the life of a Survival Hunter who knows. Could be terrible luck on my part.
- What’s the common denominator? Because I do hundreds of keys every season and I’ve had it happen only a handful of times.
- Don’t pug. Really, it’s not meant to be casual-bad friendly content. It’s supposed to have weight to it. It’s supposed to be hard.
May as well just remove key downgrades then lol…
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The problem is there isn’t any ‘solution’ that also won’t punish people justifiably leaving. Of course it’s debatable about what is justified, but I’ll give you an example from last night.
I’m healing a +11 streets and it’s pure pain. I’m only there to get more experience in the dungeon. I won’t get any valor or IO points whether we time it or not. Everyone is taking an absurd amount of damage, getting hit by everything, not doing mechanics, not interrupting, etc. I’m pretty much using all my big healing CDS on cooldown. We are wiping constantly and it took us over an hour to complete the dungeon. I didn’t leave, but I was so close to leaving many times even after the 1/2 way mark…but I wouldn’t have faulted someone for leaving in that spot. Everyone else doesn’t care because they are just hitting their buttons like usual while I’m having a miserable experience every pull.
I’ve done hundreds of keys and I probably have been the first to leave maybe 2-3 times…but sometimes a person is justified in leaving even if everyone else wants to continue.
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what about a group that’s not pug, someone has a dc and comes back and they decide to do another key but the game punished 1 player with a penalty 30mins-1H…so now is a penality for everyone on that group.
There’s scenarios to consider when implementing any kind of fix, the best solution is to remove the key component IMO and convert M+ like Torghast on which you select the level at the entrance and you can do any dungeon.
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The problem is if the game is to auto-penalize the player like you get when you desert a PvP battleground or a Normal/Heroic dungeon queue, how do you then differentiate between this “mutual understanding” versus the former?
The shower answer is you don’t.
Systems like what you’re asking isn’t easy to implement because there are considerations that have to be flushed out on all fronts to deal with the common practices by those who don’t care about depletion and those at lower key levels where people get their feelings hurt because someone left.
I stand by what I said, improve your skill, get better and you play with people who don’t just up and leave on the first wipe. If you can’t, then find 4 other people who have the same mindset as you do and stop pugging with people who only care about themselves.
People rage quit with DC’s too
Exactly, you don’t know if it was a technical issue or rage quit, but at least on a pre made group you know that because you’re playing with your guild or friends.
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