I want to share some feedback on how the Deserter debuff and the “Vote to Abandon” system currently function in high-level Mythic+ keys (19+, 20+). While I understand these systems are intended to reduce toxicity in groups, they end up punishing high-end key pushers who are just trying to strategize and reset.
Here are the specific pain points the current system creates for high-end M+ groups:
Unfair Deserter Debuffs When Resetting: In a high key, a single group wipe on the very first pull often bricks the key. If one member of the group steps outside the dungeon to discuss what went wrong and coordinate for the next attempt, they end up getting an automatic kick and a Deserter debuff when they key is already bricked.
The “Vote to Abandon” Cooldown: Currently, there is a 2-to-3-minute wait before a group can initiate a Vote to Abandon. In a +20 key, if you wipe 10 seconds in, you know instantly that the run is over or the run needs to be reset. Forcing a group to stand around for several minutes just to use the official UI is not helpful at all.
The Flawed Manual Workaround: Because nobody wants to wait for that 2-3 min cooldown to vote to abandon, groups naturally run out and reset the dungeon manually. The problem is that doing this bypasseses the official Vote to Abandon system. If the next attempt also bricks, we still can’t vote to abandon properly AND if someone leaves at that point, they risk getting hit with the Deserter debuff.
The Requested Solution
Please remove the wait period to initiate a “Vote to Abandon” in Mythic+ dungeons.
If a group unanimously agrees to abandon a key, even if we have only been inside for 10 seconds, we should be able to do so immediately from the start without facing system penalties.
I know that high-end key pushers represent a minority of the overall player base, but the current implementation creates heavy, unnecessary friction for groups trying to practice and push rating. Removing or adjusting this timer would be a massive quality-of-life improvement.
7 Likes
The entire system is stupid in the first place, the waiting timer is just the cherry on top.
4 Likes
You do know you can pop out, reset, then go back in right? It does not punish you the moment you step out, you have a grace period.
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Just had a tank alt+f4 on the second pull of a pos+12 and we had to wait to /abandon and he got to do that with no reprocussions and he’s probably doing it again right now as I’m posting this.
Well, yes if the group disbands nobody gets the flag. If you let them stay offline long enough, they are automatically removed from the group which will contribute to it (and allow everyone else to leave without penalty).
This goes back to the core failure of the system: One person has decided to leave and is checked out of the dungeon, why are you still running it?
Do we know the threshold for that?
The timer to be removed? A few minutes, maybe 2? Whenever they are removed from the party.
The flag? No we don’t know how many dungeons you need to leave. Multiple, without the vote to abandon being done, someone else leaving first, or the timer expiring.
V2a has only been abused to hold people hostage I’ve never seen it really used in any good capacity. In higher keys most people know a key is bricked and it becomes a waste of time for everyone
2 Likes
that’s a separate issue and it circles around the point that Gneusch just made.
The whole system doesn’t belong in the game at all. the OP was at least gracious about acknowledging it has a purpose but the whole feature was lampooned and decried before it ever went live and predictably it’s being used exactly the way we’d feared it would be – to try and force people to stay in keys that are gong-shows.
As far as I’m concerned, if only one person is DONE, then that’s it. I have no right to expect them to stay and to try and force it and I don’t think the game should be punishing them for it either.
I’d argue that it needs to be removed in keys above 10 or that there should be a category in which it doesn’t apply.
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and resil should be n+1 instead of n so you can reliably push rating with your key?
If your In a dead key and forced to be there I’ll turn on obr if I’m on a dps or pull double or less than normal to bleed the timer as tank if it’s cooked it’s cooked. I view the timer as a contract once it hits 0 I don’t have to be there and you can’t stop me from leaving
Meh, that’s a whole other argument and surprisingly, one in which I agree with the way they system is currently working – you prove you can do a key by timing it, awarding the “next up” level seems like to much of a gimme and it creates a whole set of scarcity/carrying issues with it.
Meg. I hear ya, but I just think the whole system itself was a garbage idea and again, I’m going to argue it needs to only be in “learning” or “relaxed” keys instead of in competitive ones.
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Until then it’s silent sandbag until timer hits 0. It’s not against the rules to not give 100% and I’m not wiping or griefing the group I’m being cautious. It’s within blizzards rules you can’t get banned for playing badly
Alright but I’m still going to say players obtaining a new key should get a torghast toaster popup to choose one until they choose to turn that off at lindormi.
The vote to abandon can’t possibly be used to hold people hostage. Everyone is able to right click their portrait and leave the group at any time. People don’t because they don’t want to be labeled as a deserter. If the group votes to continue but you’d rather quit, just man up and take the L. There’s literally nothing anyone can do to keep you from leaving.
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I just leave. It’s rare that I join groups that are that terrible in the first place because I vet the members, but if I do, I’m not wasting my time pretending to play if they’re refusing to abandon. The system only punishes you if you do it often, and timing keys removes it.
3 Likes
Then you’re problem with the system
Before I’d just leave when the key goes south I’m forced to stay now