Death Knight (Lore-ish) Questions (Building DK RP Backstory)

To start, I can only post in retail server forums for some reason (sorry).

Q1: When DKs are raised, is it possible they have no memory of their former lives?
(If yes) Q2: How would a Death Knight go about receiving a new name?

Q3: If a DK (who was raised by the Ebon Blade) dies and is raised by Sylvanas in Cata as Forsaken, do they retain their DK power(s)?

I don’t actually know whether there have been canon DKs who were this way, but I have seen a lot of DK (and other undead) player characters who had mostly or completely lost their living memories. Even if you can’t point to a specific lore source to support it, I suspect people will generally just roll with this.

But if anybody else does know a lore source that can be pointed to, that would be great to know for the future!

I don’t think I’ve seen any lore sources that talk about a DK being given a new name (by the Scourge or otherwise), but it seems perfectly plausible that they could just choose one themselves – and we have seen examples of undead who (probably) had new, post-undeath names, even when they did still have their living memories. For example, I think it’s pretty safe to assume that when he was a living elf, Koltira’s last name was not Deathweaver.

(I’m going to go check my copy of the Death Knight manga to see if it says anything about Koltira’s name.)

This is hard to say. It depends on whether Val’kyr are able to raise Death Knights, or if that would be beyond them. Different sorts of undead are raised in different ways. I think a “re-risen” DK would essentially be starting over, and would be re-raised as whatever kind of undead the necromancer intended them to become.

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All undead have the capacity to lose their memory, either partially or fully. The intro quests for DKs even imply that, at least under Scourge control, you’ve lost some degree of your memory (when you kill your former Argent Dawn friend). Most Death Knights do remember though, but they sometimes come back twisted and amoral, according to Before the Storm. So another angle is remembering but not caring lol.

There’s no evidence that I’m aware of of a Death Knight being granted a new name, but there are some really cringey DK surnames out there “Koltira DEATHWEAVER”, “Orbaz BLOODBANE”, etc. Maybe they were just unlucky enough to have those names in life but maybe they actually changed them to seem deathy :stuck_out_tongue:

That’s a tricky one. On one hand, maybe? Val’kyr resurrect Scourge Death Knights in the DK starting experience. But personally I doubt it. Death Knights are made of strong stuff, so to speak, necromantically. They don’t decay like normal undead, and certain races, like Worgen, actually cannot be raised by Sylvanas’ Val’kyr, whilst Arthas had no trouble raising Worgen DKs. So while there’s no specific definitive answer, if you were to ask me my analysis of the evidence we do have, I’d say no.

It works the other way around though. Canonically Forsaken Death Knights died, became Forsaken, then died again and became a Death Knight.

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Q1: When Death Knights were raised by the Scourge, their old lives weren’t necessarily forgotten but the memories were…muted. Foggy. The DK starting area fleshes it out a bit, but basically it’s not that they have no memory of their former lives, it’s just those were memories of their former life. There’s no sentimentality in the memory for them.

Q2: Choosing one themselves, or possibly being given the name by their peers.

Q3: Death Knights and Forsaken are mutually exclusive forms of undeath. Especially since Forsaken can be re-raised as Death Knights.

Also important to note Sylvanas and the Ebon Blade cannot raise new Death Knights themselves. Death Knight “production” wasn’t fired back up until the Ebon Blade started working with Bolvar’s version of the Lich King during the Legion Invasion. Beyond that, only a handful were created via intensive and costly rituals performed by the Cult of the Damned and the remnants of the Scourge.

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I appreciate the replies. I want to play a Human DK in WotLK Classic and continue that same DK as a Forsaken in retail during DF, but only if that can be possible. Is there a way for that to happen?

Regarding question 1, I don’t recall any lore evidence of a death knight losing their memories after being raised. Outside of what Sarestha said, that is, about the starter zone. Though that lack of memory might be more on part of them being brainwashed intentionally and controlled by the Lich King.

It’s something I’ve seen RPed often and honestly it’s one of those fanon lore tidbits that just feels really right and at home in the setting. I think perhaps maybe there’s evidence of non-death knights being raised without memories but I’m drawing a blank atm. There’s the Rotbrain from Deathknell, but I think they were just opposing the idea of being on Team Sylvanas. But I still say go for it.

For question 2, if one did lose their memory, I feel like they’d receive a new name based on their talents and accomplishments. Wrathplague for instance might be known for their aura of disgusting plague magic around them, or Icebane might freeze everything to the touch.

Death knights are like WoW’s evil, dark version of Jedi. They’re elite knights who all seem to have their own special spin on things and deep backstories. So that might be a fun way to contemplate a name.

As for question 3, I’m inclined to agree with the above posts. Raising the dead seems to scale in cost with the power of the individual. A death knight has been given extra power from their first resurrection, and was already a powerful hero before then. Sylvanas’ Val’kyr are already very limited in the scope of their necromancy, as they cannot even raise worgen from the dead.

Now if the Lich King was the one trying to raise them, I think the death knight would just spring up ready to go another round with little trouble. It would probably take a very expensive ritual, and I don’t think the death knight powers would go away after that.

If that’s the route you wanted to go, I think you’d need to put a lot of weight onto how his resurrection happens. Perhaps treat it less like he’s being resurrected as a Forsaken and more like he’s been awakened from a dormant state then recruited by the Forsaken. The Forsaken, after all, aren’t any specific type of undead. They’re a coalition of undead races that cooperate for survival.

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Note on having looked through the manga – no, unfortunately, it doesn’t seem to say anything about Koltira’s last name at all. But I’m still inclined to think he chose (or was given) the name Deathweaver after he died.

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I can’t find the source unfortunately but there was a post years ago about the Forsaken saying that they accept pretty much all undead who are prepared to give their allegiance. Hence why we have evidence of at least undead night elves, high elves and humans, with some leper gnomes hanging out too.

Anyway, with that in mind, I’d suggest that you do it from a character point of view. Rather than having your Death Knight be literally risen as a Forsaken, have them switch allegiances. Like, from a lore perspective in my own headcanon, Sarestha here is in fact a “human” death knight. She was killed once, as a Scarlet Crusader, not as a Forsaken. So she can’t claim the Forsaken origin, as such. But my angle with her was that she was from Lordaeron. When she realised that free willed undeath was indeed possible, and that not all undead were mindless Scourge as she’d previously surmised, her allegiances went to the nation of other free willed undead (mainly) from Lordaeron. That’s her backstory. It felt wrong to have her go to Stormwind and hang out with the living - she’s a Lordaeronian, and stayed with her Lordaeron pals. I didn’t see an issue with it myself, as fundamentally an undead human is an undead human - they exist on both factions nowadays.

So look I’m clearly biased with my own headcanon in mind, but is there a reason your character might decide to join the Forsaken voluntarily, after the events of WotLK? Was he Alliance then because he was more concerned with taking down the Lich King, instead of politics? Did his views change, to become Forsaken? If he’s got memory loss, did he simply feel out of place among the living? There’s lots of Forsaken with memory loss… maybe he just felt more at home?

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Hmmm, so could it make sense that my character is a forsaken DK (risen by the Ebon Blade) who is aligned with the Alliance because he hasn’t accepted undeath and what the horde stand for (accepts undeath and the horde later when he is discovered: when I play retail)?

Could he fight beside them, and walk amongst them and still go unnoticed? Perhaps the living couldn’t tell the different between a forsaken DK and a human DK because his corpse is fresh enough and not bony yet that they appear the same (I’d just play a human DK that I RP as forsaken)?

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Yeah exactly, just an undead death knight! When you get right to the bottom of it, the difference between human and forsaken death knights is similar to the difference between high elves and blood elves - purely political.

I think so. I mean from his general appearance he could presumably go either way. Forsaken themselves have varied levels of decomposition.

Anyway that’s my opinion. I think that sounds like a very good idea, character-wise.

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Thanks for sharing your sentiment, and I appreciate you and all the people who have contributed to this post. I finally feel like I could play my DK now without sitting around just wondering lol. <3

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Nero “Necrosis” Doseki here. If I may offer a few words.

First off, its RP it doesn’t have to make sense to anyone but you. Kind of surprised nobody has even eluted to this.

Now for your first question about memory.
Yes, the second generation of Death Knights raised by Arthas has their memories suppressed to make them more agreeable. It’s why your “target” during the starting zone asks you to remember. Not so much them, but that you were a great hero.

To answer your second question: The Litch King gave you your name, or rather he allowed you to keep your living name. Upon your freedom after the Battle at Lights Hope you’re given the option to return to the faction capital of the race you picked at character creation. We do this because it’s required for Gameplay but the truth is… you’re undead through and through. The only reason you are not “Forsaken” is because your trustworthiness is vouched for.

To answer your 3rd question. Yes. Assuming Sylvanas could raise you with her limited powers, as with any other class you would retain the abilities you had prior. The question is, if it were possible for her to re-raise a Death Knight.

Another route you could go is right there in the DK starting zone. There are books, or pamphlets scattered about that describe how a Dk is supposed to take care of their new undead bodies. So, let’s say somewhere down the line you get into a large battle. We’ve had several between Wrath and Dragonflight to choose from. During the fight you’re Human looking body gets irreparably damaged and unrecognizable. You’re still “alive” sort-of-speak but get taken to a horde camp instead of an alliance one.

Things happen and suddenly you’re working with the Horde instead of the Alliance. Though you’re still a DK, you don’t look like yourself anymore.

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For your RP and characters to make sense to you is what’s first and, overall, most important. You’ll never have your best fun playing a character or storyline that doesn’t make sense to you, no matter how lore-abiding it may be or how much other people may like it. Whether it’s the only thing that matters, though, depends on whether you approach RP as a solitary activity or a collaborative one.

There are a lot of experiences and ways of approaching them that fall under the term “RP.” If you’re focused on the ones that only require your own investment, that involve other people only as passing encounters – or that can happen without other people even being there – then yes; your character and their story only needs to make sense to you. However, if what you want from RP involves deep and/or long-term engagement with other people, then your RP needs to make sense to and be compelling for at least one other person.

That doesn’t mean it needs to make sense to or be compelling for a lot of people, much less everyone. RP, in my experience, gets better when you focus down on what really works for a few people than when you stick to what mostly works for a lot of people – and creating something that works for all people is impossible. But while RP can be either solitary or collaborative, it can’t be both at the same time.

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I’m not an expert on Death Knight lore , but as far as memory goes I think I agree that the lack of memory came largely from the Lich King’s control, and it’s possible that it could totally just block that persons memory.

It’s also good to remember that no two people are going to be alike, and no two brains are going to be identical. How something works on one person, may be less severe on another. Just like the varying levels of decay and lucidity by the regular Forsaken we have, I imagine the Death Knights have their own levels.

Which probably range from living vessel of war who has the potential to at least pay attention and communicate but might seem vacant other times. To completely aware, if a bit distant at times. Or they might just pretend to be vacant in the head and it will make people think they can say what ever you want.

Theres a lot you can do with how a Death Knight carries themselves, despite me not really knowing it fully.

I’d say…figure out what race you’re playing as (to know what the culture might think of undeath), when generation they are, what they went through to die in the first place and then. Then you can sort of play around with memory.

I mean hey, no memory is a great starting point and something you can build with by role playing with friends and uncovering the mystery as you go along!

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Even if your character doesn’t lose their memories from the process of becoming a Death Knight, there are all kinds of other contrivances that could cause them to lose their memories before/after that fact.

Maybe they were purposely stolen later by some malevolent third party. Or they did something so terrible as a Death Knight, or even before, that they intentionally had their memories expunged -or even just buried everything away as a psychological defense mechanism. They could be suffering from some sort of undead malady like brain rot. Or a curse. That they just happen to be a Death Knight is an added wrinkle.

Of course, I’m a big fan of amnesia as a plot device.

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