Deadmines or Diremaul?

i’ve never heard Deadmines called ‘VC’ until the Classic Beta started.

it was always called DM on my server and when anyone wanted a Dire Maul run, we said, “LFG DM North/East/West/Tribute”.


Yeah I only ever heard DM as deadmines, but I was exclusively horde until like, cata.

I’m unable to provide or locate frequency of use of term either way haha. I do remember when Dire Maul first coming out that people would often, on my server, refer to it just as DM or Dire Maul and not indicate the wing. . . You would have to message them hoping they wanted the same wing. I’m unsure of why players were like that. I usually used pretty descriptive language in mine. For example. LFG - DM:N - Healer or LF3M - DM:W - Tank, DPS x2.

I didn’t indicate frequency of usage for VC or DM at any point other than when responding later to indicate that it could be considered common. Common is ill defined, and there is no evidence indicating frequency of usage of DM vs VC in reference to The Deadmines for any time period from November 23, 2004 to January 15, 2007. Additionally, your wording choice here is different than your wording choice at


I haven’t suggested that people did use wings to refer to Dire Maul’s three separate instances. I would disagree that everyone referred to Dire Maul by wings, however. Everyone, in your response, implies that everyone at every point in time, referred to Dire Maul by their separate wings. This is factually untrue and would not be able to be proven.

You can assume that, but that doesn’t make the assumption correct. It’s not something I would immediately jump to or claim without having specific knowledge of that person.

Literally no evidence to suggest it was or was not a ‘commonly’ used term.

Wow. I’ve also played vanilla since open beta (read: prior to release). My account creation date for retail is November 23, 2004. I’ve provided links with evidence appropriate for the time period in question as to whether or not DM or VC could be used to refer to The Deadmines.

Word choice matters. Generally, it is advisable to avoid the usage of extreme terms like “everyone” or “no one” or “all the time”. There are rare or infrequent situations in which you can use extreme terms and maintain veracity of your statement.

Edit: "Literally no evidence to suggest it was or was not a ‘commonly’ used term. " When I said this, I meant to refer to quantitative data as opposed to qualitative data. The qualitative data regarding prevailing frequency of term usage in reference to Dire Maul is subject to significant bias and cannot be used to reach an accurate conclusion.

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It was originally DM for alliance only until Dire Maul came out and then it became VC. By then most LFG’s were for the (now new) DM as majority had levelled past the level 20ish dungeon. After a month or so naturally morphed into DM = Dire Maul + wing, and VC = VanCleef.

Later it also became VC for horde if you rerolled to play on the new wave of vanilla servers or made an alliance alt. By then for them DM had always meant Dire Maul. Not many ran over to the alliance side to do VC so it wasn’t in common horde vocab, we were obsessed with doing WC around that time.

I never played a private server.

Deadmines can be called DM or VC.
But i renember back in the day that there could be a confusion for new players when they wrote VC because some thought it was WC.
But if we are talking about Dire Maul then its DM east, north or west.
but you could do DM tribute run also.

The earliest known, within this thread, instance of VC referring to The Deadmines is presented above. Dire Maul was released March, 2005 (March 7th, I believe). Your claim is rejected evidence shows existence of the term “VC” referring to The Deadmines prior to release of Dire Maul.

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All I remember clearly is plenty of LFG VCs levelling as alliance post-DM’s release.

My post was purely anecdotal based on what I personally remember from 2 different servers. Who knows what else other players called it at other points in time. For plenty of vanilla players, especially horde, DM will always be Dire Maul and Deadmines will always be VC.

Ah! That wasn’t stated within your post.

When you did Dire Maul you always said which wing or tribute run.
Regarding Deadmines then people used both terms DM and VC.
For newer players it was confusing when you said VC as horde because many thought about WC.

It has always been DM for deadmines.

DM wouldn’t really work for diremaul since it is broken into more then one instance.


No. Not at all.

Wowhead deadmines page. Quoted 2006.

This instance is often called VC too, for Van Cleef, the dude (boss) at the end.

A word of caution. As you move through the Deadmines be careful of when you kill an elite mob before a door. Shortly after the kill a group of 2 or 3 casters will come in from behind you. If you’re not prepared they can wreak havoc as adds.

People have always said DM for Dire Maul. Sure, when people are referring to a specific wing, they say that wing, but even DM:E is using DM for Dire Maul.

When does DM release? Phase 2?

OMG I used DM for Dire Maul without a wing!

it really seemed to depend on a lot of factors honestly, the launch servers that had people from beta who had ran DM during called it that pretty much primarily , but that was still only not everyone, more new people kind of seemed to go either way.

EU launched with Dire Maul open , so it really became an oddity with being referred to as DM or VC, and unless I am mistaken is the only dungeon in all of WoW ,who used the end bosses name as its shorthand.

Dude this is legit not true. When I started deadmines was DM, yes. After a while I 100% saw a slight transition and saw both DM and VC. I have never played a private server. You may not have seen VC but that doesn’t mean it never happened on live servers. I remember this because as a newer player it was slightly confusing for me until someone cleared it up

That being said… I prefer DM.

Edit: Alliance Frostmane US in vanilla. Since I’m guessing this was a realm to realm thing.

Edit 2: just scrolled up and realized that my post was pointless and this had been said. My apologies

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stop with this already

Dire Maul

I’m over it.

Not to reignite the issue, I was looking up a separate function and found an in-game support webpage from Blizzard for WoW: What are some common terms and acronyms in the World of Warcraft?

DM: Is short for “Dire Maul”.

VC: Stands for Van Cleff and is used to refer to “The Deadmines”.

When I read through and found that I thought it was amusing considering the strong feelings had from both sides in this thread. It points to VC being a common, if not preferred, acronym for The Deadmines. The first instance I found of either being described in this support page was the capture point November 27, 2005. It’s kind of an interesting thing to look at the changes over time. For example, the December 6, 2004 capture point has AV as meaning Ashenvale (which I had forgotten it being used for this purpose in moderate frequency prior to the addition of Alterac Valley).

AV: Is short for “Ashenvale”.

I just thought I would share since it was interesting to me. I don’t remember some of the listed acronyms being used, though. Con (short for consider apparently), GZ (apparently stands for Gadgetzan instead of grats or gratz), LS (apparently for Lakeshire instead of line of sight or LoS), OG (verus Org), Temple (versus ST) don’t ring much of a bell. I think many, early on, believed Orgrimmar was spelled Ogrimmar. :sunglasses:

From the viewpoint of blizzard this would make sense, as they don’t have the linear leveling point-of-view of playing the game, they see all of it at once.

If you’re an employee at blizz, using VC makes sense as it’s easier to tell things apart when you are looking at the game as a whole. Players don’t have this look-down spreadsheet perspective.

So it’s easy to see how acronyms evolved through patch’s for players.

I’ve never heard of “AV” for Ashenvale. In fact, I’ve never seen anyone use acronyms for zones, only raids and dungeons. When chatting with players, we usually used shorthand like “Ash” or just spelled it out.

If someone was asking for help, you’d just click them and it would tell you where they were in the chat window.

intentionally necros a worthless thread

Of all the threads you could necro why choose a stupid thread like this LOL?