Covenants and Your Spec -- A Survey

In this thread, please post your replies using the format below. If you’d like to discuss any of the Covenants or classes further, please take it to the appropriate Feedback thread on that Covenant or class in this forum.

Now that we’re moving into the tuning phase for all classes, we’d like to know your current opinion on Covenant choices for your class/spec, whether you’re finding that all Covenants are viable options, or you feel that some choices are much better than others.

If you’ve been testing out Covenants on your favorite classes and specs, please reply to this post with your answers to the questions below. You can actively test on the level 60 realm, Torghast, and details on what is available are in the developer update notes.

Please create a new reply using this form for each class or spec that you’ve tested:

Your Class

  • Are there Covenants that are the most useful for your class and spec? If yes, which Covenant(s), class and signature abilities and why?
    • Spec
      • Reasons
  • Are there Covenants that are the least useful for your class and spec? If yes, which Covenant(s), class and signature abilities, and why?
    • Spec
      • Reasons
  • If all Covenant choices feel viable for your spec, please let us know which spec(s):

Thank you!

21 Likes

Havoc DH.

TL;DR: Venthyr stands out as best for most situations for DH. The other covenants lag behind as interesting choices. Venthyr also has the strongest soulbinds (Thrill Seeker), especially with the recent nerfs to Night Fae (bye bye Shadowmeld) and Necrolord (no more CC immunity absorb shield).

Most useful: Venthyr. Sinful Brand is great, and the interaction with Meta makes it useful in AoE as well. Feels impactful with current tuning.

Least useful: All the others – Kyrian and Necrolord are basically unusable in PvP and much more situational (Kyrian is AoE only in terms of damage and its Signature ability is good for bleed removal but doesn’t shine outside that). Night Fae suffers from undertuning on the Hunt (as well as an awkward cast time) and lack of AoE utility. Necrolord requires you to stand still for an extended period of time to get maximum value. As a player who enjoys Raid, M+, and Arena, I’m going to be hard pressed to pick a covenant that is almost completely useless in at least one of those – all the covenants should at least bring something to the table in each of those three primary game modes.

Summary table of Sign(ature) and Class abilities:

Sign Sign Sign Class Class Class
Overall Raid M+ PvP Raid M+ PvP
Kyrian C- C C F C B D
Necrolord C- D B F B B F
Night Fae C D D D C C A
Venthyr B C B C A A B

Way more detail…

Covenants

Covenant Signature Abilities

Kyrian: Summon Steward

By default, Phial of Serenity only heals for 15% of your health. The heal feels pretty non-impactful, but the phial also does remove all curse, disease, poison, and bleeds, which makes it sort of a super-Stoneform that could be incredibly useful in certain situations, especially on a class, like DH, that doesn’t have a way to self-dispel. This utility will be contingent on fight and raid design that emphasizes the need to self-dispel – it really shines on some of the fights with significant bleeds in Castle Nathria.

The Phial itself is on a 1 minute cooldown of its own, independent from potions and healthstones.

The Steward itself also offers a set of useful amenities, such as repairing your gear, changing your talents, vendoring, telling your friends how awesome they are, and with Kyrian Sanctum research, accessing the Kyrian teleportation network. Each of these useful amenities is on a once per day cooldown, though, which feels a bit meh in terms of actual utility, and, apart from the travel network and telling your friend how awesome they are, none of them are something you can’t do by other means.

Slight rework: This Covenant ability needs some extra “oomph” to make it more attractive. Numbers tuning needed on the healing percentage as well; 15% is barely noticeable.

Raid

C Tier

Situational. This will be completely dependent on the specifics of given encounters. It may be incredible in certain fights, and may be completely worthless in many others. The heal component is not worth writing home about and perhaps should be strengthened to make this more compelling as a choice, especially for situations where there’s nothing to dispel.

It’s going to be tricky to craft encounters around this – make self-dispels too important for a specific fight and Kyrians may have a significant advantage. Don’t have any fights with self-dispels and Kyrians may wonder why their phial self-dispels anything at all.

Rating this as D tier since, as far as we know, most fights aren’t going to need self-dispels and the self-heal is insignificant. Will be amazing on the fights where it is useful, however.

M+

C Tier

I haven’t seen all the dungeon encounters yet, but it doesn’t appear that dispels are going to be particularly necessary. May have some situational utility.

Arena

F Tier

From my testing, it doesn’t appear the phial is usable in the arena at all. (Perhaps because it is a conjured item?) I summoned a Steward in the skirmish pre-game and he didn’t give me a phial. I haven’t been able to try to zone in with a phial to see if it doesn’t go away.

If phial is enabled in arena, the heal is not enough to matter. You can’t use phial while CC’d. This looks like it’ll be mostly useful against Assasination Rogues, as it gives you a way to clear their bleeds and poisons. Would probably upgrade this to C Tier if it were actually usable in the Arena, just because rogues are often encountered in arena. DHs aren’t usually kill targets, though.

Necrolord: Fleshcraft

This is a pretty long channel – 4 seconds – and 20% extra health (or 50% if over the corpse of a “powerful enemy.”) 50% extra health is a very significant absorb, especially on a 2 minute timer. Once again, this could be incredibly useful in certain situations – not dying when you would otherwise die, for example. It does last 2 minutes as well, which means, unless there’s pulsing damage, it can be pre-cast before a particularly deadly ability goes out.

Note that you don’t need a corpse to get at least a 20% shield; the shield becomes stronger if there is a corpse. Certain soulbinds also enhance the shield in various ways.

Raid

D Tier

Situational. Once again, this will come down to fight mechanics, which we haven’t seen yet, since Castle Nathria isn’t open for testing. There are not that many corpses around in raid, but that can be mitigated by the Necrolord class ability which enables you to kill a demon to obtain what is, in effect, a “corpse on demand.” It might be incredibly valuable on some fights, or, then again, it might not.

Rating this as D Tier because most fights won’t need this shield, but it might come in handy in some specific circumstances.

M+

B Tier

Situational. This ability looks like it might single-handedly enable pushing higher keys, particularly on Tyrannical weeks (assuming we’ll once again see one-shot mechanics emerge at very high key levels). Since it’s an absorb and thus preventative damage, this can be pre-planned. Mythic+ also has lots of corpses around, which makes it easier to use.

Apart from high Tyrannical keys, however, this is going to be somewhat useless given how M+ dungeons tend to be designed. Probably much stronger on Vengeance (with its very large health pools, particularly during meta) than on Havoc.

Arena

F Tier

I haven’t been able to test this in Arena, but first, there are no corpses at the start of games (though Fleshcraft doesn’t need a corpse to be cast – it will still give a 20% shield without one), apart from the Necrolord class ability – but I doubt the shield will persist after the pre-game, which means a Necrolord DH would need to start the game, summon the demon, kill the demon, channel a 4 second cast to get a shield. That… is a lot of pre-work and enemy teams are not going to let Necrolords DH do that undisturbed. That means this’ll likely, at best, be a 20% shield if you channel right at the start of the match. It’s not hard to get rid of 20% of your health in arena, and once that’s done, the shield is gone. DH also doesn’t tend to play in double dps comps in 2s, which means this is also pretty limited in utility.

Hard to see this being useful in arena, especially as a 4 second channel.

Night Fae: Soulshape

The mini-blinks while in the Soulshape go about 10-15 yards. You immediately exit Soulshape if you use class ability. Soulshape is handy as extra mobility in a wide variety of situations, particularly if we’re playing Momentum and use our actual mobility skills for damage before some sort of random call that requires us to move unexpectedly.

Raid

D Tier

Situational. This will come down, once again, to fight design. That said, Havoc DH already has a lot of mobility, so this is piling onto an existing strength of the spec. It’s hard to imagine a fight where we’d need two fel rushes, vengeful retreat, double jump, and Soulshape – other classes would be long dead by then.

M+

D Tier

Situational, though since this no longer has the Soulbind trait that enables skips, it’s just extra mobility.

Arena

D Tier

Since you (or at least DHs can’t, as I hear some other classes can) can’t use abilities while in Soulshape, it’s only really useful for running away or chasing once you’ve used up your existing movement abilities. Perhaps handy in situations where you’re getting kited by a druid or monk healer around a pillar, but that seems to be about it…

Venthyr: Door of Shadows

A 35 yard blink with a cast-time. Unlike Soulshape, this is a targeted blink which means you can blink across gaps as long as there’s a path available. Likely enables many creative uses.

Raid

C Tier

Situational. Probably not needed on most fights, but likely incredibly useful on fights where it is handy. Since it’s a 35 yard blink, this is a bit faster movement than anything in the DH kit, though there is cast time on the ability.

M+

B Tier

Situational, where skips are needed. Unlikely this will be important in M+ boss fights, but could be valuable for enabling skips though the 35 yard range might not enough for some skips. Remains to be seen whether skips and how skips are needed depending on mob counts and routing.

Arena

C Tier

Situational, map-dependent. This lets you get from the bottom to the top of Blade’s Edge Arena after you’ve been knocked off the bridge. Apart from that, and other similar use cases, it doesn’t look like it’s going to be particularly game changing.

Covenant Class Abilities

Kyrian: Elysian Decree

This ability reminds me most of the Umbral Moonglaives trinket from Legion, except that this ability has an activation time and does much less damage. With the changes to Demonic Appetite, the Lesser Soul Fragments are only useful as a heal, not as an Eye Beam cooldown reduction. This is an uncapped AoE, but the damage on this ability feels undertuned, especially if it’s to be useful outside of mass AoE situations (which will likely be less common with AoE target capping…)

Numbers tuning needed: This just doesn’t hit hard enough. Slight rework: It’d feel more impactful without the 2 second activation time, which is just enough time for a tank to move a pack out of the Decree circle.

Raid

C Tier

Situational. Only useful on AoE boss fights, a la Hivemind.

M+

B Tier

Lots of AoE in M+, and this finds good use when you’ve pulled a large pack. Needs more damage though to be particularly impactful. The Conduit that makes this hit again is valuable.

Arena

D Tier

The two second activation makes this hard to use. Maybe useful when you’re landing a mana burn on a healer? But it isn’t very much damage, and the AoE doesn’t really matter in arena, so…

Necrolord: Fodder to the Flame

On the premade level 60 I tested on, this demon had about 7k health (to my 20k health). Not a particularly challenging fight, but not a one-shot either. Did not hit particularly hard either. The pool is relatively large (I think this got adjusted recently, as it used to be much smaller in beta) – think slightly larger than Sigil of Flame’s radius. This, along with the Necrolord covenant in general, feels like it’s geared much more toward Vengeance, since as a tank, they care about the 10% damage decrease and also choose where the fight takes place, making them more likely to get full value of out of the pool of blood.

Importantly, our passive class ability Shattered Souls interacts with this ability. After the demon is killed and we walk over its soul to consume it, we gain 20% damage done for 15 seconds. If you can line this up with cooldowns and make sure the pool of blood is in the right spot, this can be pretty powerful. For fights where we lust off the bat, this will be a bit of a scramble to get in position, summon the demon, kill the demon, absorb the soul and stand in the pool – but might be worth the payoff.

The 3 minute cooldown also doesn’t line up well with Meta, which is 4 minutes (since we don’t have Vision of Perfection).

Slight rework: The ability would probably “flow” better if the demon died as you summoned it, perhaps thanks to the power of your Necrolord friends (the Primus himself strikes the demon down as a demonstration of his power). It’s a bit awkward to have to fight it and then stand in a pool of its blood in one spot for 30 seconds. Making it so that your character is splattered by and thus empowered by demon blood, without having to stand still, would help. Reducing this to a 2 minute cooldown would also make it line up with every other Meta.

Raid

B Tier

Situational. 20% attack speed for 30 seconds every 3 minutes isn’t bad, but it isn’t that great either, and apart from Patchwerk fights where you don’t move, it may be hard to find 30 second where you can stand relatively in the same spot. Also, it’s a bit awkward to summon and kill a demon first, but it does proc our Shattered Souls class trait for 20% damage for 15 seconds, which is pretty powerful if lined up with cooldowns.

M+

B Tier

Useful on M+ boss fights if you can stand still for 30 seconds. Again, fighting the demon is a bit awkward, but it can get cleaved down. Useful if you can line it up with cooldowns for the 20% damage buff for 15 seconds.

Arena

F Tier

No one is going to just stand there for 30 seconds. Oh, and you need to kill the demon first. The 20% damage for 15 seconds is much less impactful for PvP, especially since you telegraph it by having to kill the demon first, so opponents can kite to negate it entirely.

Night Fae: The Hunt

Purely a single target ability, this doesn’t feel impactful – there are no flashy visuals apart from the initial charge and the damage is “hidden” in the extra fury income. The teleport is handy for staying on a target and provides yet another way for a DH to reconnect in melee. Ignoring LoS seems largely confined to arena unless there are some raid or M+ encounters that make significant use of LoS.

I don’t have a good feel for where numbers tuning is for this ability – it’s hard to evaluate fury income right now with limited addon / logging analysis and how much of a difference 50% more makes.

Once again, just like the Necrolord class ability, the 3 minute cooldown doesn’t line up well with Meta, which is 4 minutes (since we don’t have Vision of Perfection).

Slight rework: Reduce this to a 2 minute cooldown and perhaps even make this instant cast. Numbers tuning needed on the Fury income to ensure it is competitive with other covenant abilities.

Raid

C Tier

This looks like it’ll provide solid single, unflashy target throughput, assuming the numbers are appropriately tuned.

M+

C Tier

Same as raid; solid single target throughput, assuming the tuning’s done right. A bit lackluster in AoE situations, so this is likely something that’ll be saved for boss fights or particularly tough trash.

Arena

A Tier

This ability is going to make many players complain even more about DHs in arena. DHs are already incredibly difficult to peel off a target; this ability is going to make it even worse, and ignoring LoS is just icing on the cake. Healer hiding behind a pillar? Doesn’t matter, every 30 seconds the DH can blink behind them, even if they’re not in LoS. The initial cast time does make this a bit awkward to use, and potentially counterable, though the 50 yard range makes that hard to do.

Venthyr: Sinful Brand

What’s not to like about this ability? It does a lot of damage, is instant cast on a minute cooldown, slows melee and casting speeds, and isn’t just a single target ability if used via Meta. It doesn’t stack with itself (so you can’t meta and sinful brand to get 2x sinful brand stacks), but on the whole feels very satisfying to use, particularly if you can meta in a large pack of mobs and watch them all take damage over time.

Raid

A Tier

Impactful single target damage, though might get nerfed via tuning.

M+

A Tier

Impactful single target damage and incredibly powerful AoE when used with Meta.

Arena

B Tier

Impactful single target damage and a debuff to enemy casting/melee speeds. It is dispellable, however, but can line up with cross-CC or use after a dispel for maximum impact.

143 Likes

Death Knight

  • Are there Covenants that are the most useful for your class and spec? If yes, which Covenant(s), class and signature abilities and why?
    • Unholy/Frost - Necrolord and/or Night Fae
      • Right now the issue I am most having is I enjoy playing all aspects of the game. This includes Rated PVP, M+, and Raiding. Necrolord currently feels like the only choice for rated PVP specifically arena. The grip will be a must have and if you don’t I feel like it will greatly limit your ability against classes with mobility or casters. Where as Night Fae ability feels very strong in other aspects with maybe Venthyr a close second. I really dislike that we are locked into the choice and essentially have to decide on what type of content we want to be the best at. This system should be more of a talent system let the choice of covenant stay the same but the actual abilities should be talents that we can swap between based on what content we are doing.
  • Are there Covenants that are the least useful for your class and spec? If yes, which Covenant(s), class and signature abilities, and why?
    • Death Knight (all specs) Kyrian
      • I feel like this ability is the weakest of all. It’s a single target ability which could potentially be useful for PVP but for M+ and Raiding there doesn’t seem to be a place this would do better then potentially 1 raid boss currently.
31 Likes

Death Knight Most Useful Covenants (Raid/M+ focus):
Night Fae:
Because both Soulshape and Death’s Due are insanely good for DKs. DKs have almost no mobility…so Soulshape is like 700% more mobility by itself. That’s obviously hyperbolic…but not as much as youd think! Death’s Due is also particularly insane because its basically just 10-15% more Strength. All the time. And I believe that Strength is multiplicative with Rune of the Fallen Crusader, which makes it even crazier. Both of the Night Fae abilities are just crazy good for DKs.

Venthyr:
Same exact reasons as above. Night Fae are just above Venthyr because Soulshape is probably a little more consistently stronger than Door of Shadows (after the Soulshape buff). And Death’s Due is significantly stronger than Swarming Mist for single target. For AoE theyre probably close-ish.

Way Less Useful:
Necrolord:
Fleshcraft is extremely weak. EXTREMELY weak. The shield is weak, the 4 second channel is way too long and the cooldown is 2 minutes. If it were a 50% shield with a 1-2 second channel? Sure, ok. But 20%? A 20% shield isnt worth the risk, mid encounter, to channel for 4 seconds.

Abomination Limb is just a worse Swarming Mist. Which is already a worse Death’s Due. The ability is super fun and looks amazing. But comparatively? It just isnt as good as Swarming Mist or Death’s Due.

Least Useful:
Kyrian:
The Kyrian attendant (or whatever its called, I cant remember) just isnt that good. The fact that the potion you receive takes up a health potion slot is just not good. Overall, the ability is only SLIGHTLY more useful than Fleshcraft. But I might even be wrong about that.

Shackle the Unworthy is just…not good. Its purely single target. That’s really it. Its too niche. All of the other abilities are usable in all content baseline. Baseline Shackle the Unworthy just isnt that great for single target. Its strong damage but its Arcane damage. So it doesnt interact with Frost or Unholy Mastery. And for AoE? Theres no reason to waste the GCD on it when you could hit an AoE ability.

30 Likes

Affliction Warlock

Most Useful: Necrolord. Decimating Bolt is incredibly strong for single target, so much so that it just overshadows every other choice. This is compounded by how bad the other choices are in most situations since Decimating Bolt + Drain Soul is incredibly good priority damage and one of the best executes in the game.

Least Useful: Night Fae is just awful. It’s only niche is for 3-4 target stacked cleave when combined with Inevitable Demise, but Drain Soul is so powerful right now that taking ID just feels like a huge loss. ID itself is always quite weak relatively, which makes Night Fae feel really unrewarding for such a niche use.

Kyrian is also quite bad, as it’s only really usable on single target, but is just strictly worse than Necrolord. There is no situation where it is better, it feels terrible thematically, and just feels like a boring upkeep spell rather than something I’m excited to press (like Decimating Bolt). Nothing more to say here, both Night Fae and Kyrian feel really bad to use and are very lackluster. It does interact with Malefic Rupture and Dark Glare at least, but feels bad to use still. I would expect more from my covenant ability than just a mediocre DoT I’m forced to upkeep.

28 Likes

Destruction Warlock

Most Useful: Necrolord. Decimating Bolt is strong for single target, but when combined with Fire and Brimstone, becomes an AoE powerhouse. This is a great ability that feels good to use, has room for skilled play (sniping lower health targets), and is rewarding.

Least Useful: Similar to Affliction, Kyrian and Night Fae are just utterly useless. They are boring to use, have no spec synergy, and you don’t even have the benefit of ID as Destruction, which makes the subsequent Drain Life cleave just miserable. If you are Night Fae, Soul Rot isn’t even worth using because of how poor the damage it.

23 Likes

Warlock

  • Are there Covenants that are the most useful for your class and spec? If yes, which Covenant(s), class and signature abilities and why?

  • Almost all Covenants, Affliction

    • 3 of the 4 Covenants have dot components, which offers synergy with Malefic Rupture; The one doesn’t (Decimation Bolt) has potential to enable extremely high execute potential when combined with Drain Soul
  • Are there Covenants that are the least useful for your class and spec? If yes, which Covenant(s), class and signature abilities, and why?

  • Night Fae / All Spec; All Covenant / Demo

    • Compared to the other 3, Nightfae feels weaker, the aoe drain is actually a potential dps loss;
    • Demo gains the least from any and all Covenant abilities compared to Affliction and Destro, I have shared detailed breakdown in the Warlock feedback
  • If all Covenant choices feel viable for your spec, please let us know which spec(s):

    • Definitely not the case, Night Fae and Demo are shafted. (And it just so happens thematically I’m a Demo lock interested in Night Fae… sucks to be me)
16 Likes

Demonology Warlock

Most Useful: Venthyr. Venthyr is possible the best designed ability for Warlocks in general, and feels cool to use both because of its interaction with the class and thematically. The AOE damage and curses fills a very real need for Warlocks, which is great. Awesome ability.

Least Useful: Kyrian, Night Fae, and Necrolord are all miserable as Demonology. Kyrian technically is your strongest single target spec, but just feels awful to use. Why would I want to keep an arcane DoT up as Demonology that does 6% of my damage, and does not interact with my spec at all? It’s boring. Night Fae is just as useless as it is for Destruction, and Necrolord only buffs Shadowbolt, which is just an incredibly weak spell. Decimating Bolt really needs to buff Demonbolt instead.

18 Likes

Rogue

  • Are there Covenants that are the most useful for your class and spec? If yes, which Covenant(s), class and signature abilities and why?

The Necrolord Bone Spike is far and away the best and only viable choice for covenant abilities for all three specs of rogue, the other abilities can’t begin to compare.

  • Spec: All of them.
    • Reasons: it’s a dot that never expires, allowing you to maintain damage on a target even if mechanics force you to lose melee uptime. It also provides a huge amount of combo points for a very minimal energy cost, that gets amplified with multiple targets and can fit into any point of your rotation thanks to the low energy cost. It does everything you could ever want to do as a rogue and it will always be up when you need it to be because it has 3 charges on a relatively short cooldown.
  • Are there Covenants that are the least useful for your class and spec? If yes, which Covenant(s), class and signature abilities, and why?

Sepsis

  • Spec: All of them
    • Reasons: It doesn’t provide combo points, and while the damage burst at the end is high the delayed vanish effect is pretty awkward when all it really amounts to is some free damage and an extra shadowstrike/ambush every 90 seconds. In addition it’s terrible for solo/open world content since if you don’t finish combat by the time the vanish happens everything you’re fighting will evade. PVPers might want this but from a raiding standpoint it’s pretty terrible.
  • If all Covenant choices feel viable for your spec, please let us know which spec(s): LOL
29 Likes

Priest

  • Are there Covenants that are the most useful for your class and spec? If yes, which Covenant(s), class and signature abilities and why?
    • Discipline
      • As of the latest build (35598), Kyrian is the only viable Covenant for this spec. The other options are too weak to compete.
  • Are there Covenants that are the least useful for your class and spec? If yes, which Covenant(s), class and signature abilities, and why?
    • Discipline
      • This latest build included nerfs to Necrolord and Night Fae. Hence making them non-options against Kyrian. The buff to Venthyr is really a tiny step in comparison to what is actually needed to make this option competitive for Discipline Priest. Consider either making Mindgames AoE or giving it absurd numbers.

Monk

  • Are there Covenants that are the most useful for your class and spec? If yes, which Covenant(s), class and signature abilities and why?
    • Mistweaver
      • As of this last build, Necrolord is the only option. It simply has better numbers to fit all situations in comparison to Kyrian, Venthyr and Night Fae. Note that Bonedust Brew has an the unintended interaction for Mistweaver to act as a Renewing Mist for Vivify, therefore giving the possibility for huge Vivifies. I implore you to consider keeping this interaction in, perhaps replacing the current Gust of Mists interaction with a weaker version of this bug. Raid-wide Uplift bursts windows are the core of what made a Mistweaver so iconic in the past. I believe this interaction is honestly the saving grace to keep Mistweaver an interesting and fun spec for this expansion.
  • Are there Covenants that are the least useful for your class and spec? If yes, which Covenant(s), class and signature abilities, and why?
    • Mistweaver
      • This build’s nerfs to Fallen Order (Venthyr) and Faeline Stomp (Night Fae) are very unexpected. The spells are by far the weakest class spells among all healers’ covenants class abilities. The numbers are extremely low, and specifically for Faeline Stomp, it needs to stand on its own. Give it a base healing in addition to the Mistweaver interaction.
21 Likes

Shaman

  • Are there Covenants that are the most useful for your class and spec? If yes, which Covenant(s), class and signature abilities and why?

Resto Shaman:
Necrolord - Primordial Wave synergizes very well with one of the new shaman legendaries and allows for great cleave healing. Unfortunately none of the other class covenant abilities compare, even while considering soulbinds and legendaries.

  • Are there Covenants that are the least useful for your class and spec? If yes, which Covenant(s), class and signature abilities, and why?

Resto Shaman:
Nightfae (Fae Transfusion) is particularly weak (and also received nerfs today for some reason). Venthyr is also pretty weak: Chain Harvest is little more than a slightly more efficient chain heal and the soulbinds for Venthyr don’t offer the bonus healing advantages that Kyrian or Nightfae do for healers (Resonant Accolades/Valiant Strikes and Empowered Chrysalis).

Monk

  • Are there Covenants that are the most useful for your class and spec? If yes, which Covenant(s), class and signature abilities and why?

Mistweaver:
Currently the only viable option is Necrolord for Bone Dust Brew. This class ability currently has some novel interactions and works well with its potency conduit.

  • Are there Covenants that are the least useful for your class and spec? If yes, which Covenant(s), class and signature abilities, and why?

Mistweaver:
Unfortunately the remaining 3 Covenant choices offer very little besides a few useful soulbinds. All of their class abilities are either very random or bugged (Fallen Order), difficult to effectively use (Faeline Stomp), or undertuned (Faeline Stomp, Weapons of Order). Kyrian Weapons of Order was rendered useless with the previous tuning patch and is currently a button you would never press in really any circumstance - a stark difference in contrast to it’s prior iteration.

11 Likes

Class Mage:

Most Useful:

  • Necrolord:

    • Spec: Arcane

      • Due to Arcane Blast being the largest portion of Arcane’s damage, the 10% bonus and cleave from the skeletal mage makes it almost a requirement to go Necrolord if you want to be a good Arcane mage. The other specs use of Fireball and Frostbolt as a builder makes the cleave mean a whole lot less due the proportion of damage these deal in the kit (maybe could cause the 2 extra targets for Pyroblast damage). This becomes hard to fix for frost due to Splitting Ice and how damage changes bases on talents.
  • Kyrian

    • Spec: Frost and Fire

      • It is just a flat damage increase and I feel like it is what most mages will end up going. This has to do with it just being a damage amp and works well with the kits most of the time (easy to fit in with rotation). The one problem I have is that you want your last damage amp to be used by your most damaging ability but it feels super clunky/ impossible to get it down right. Frost as an example you want to use that 4th stack for your Glacial Spike but your flurry consumes all of the stacks before Glacial Spike can hit. The other thing too is that I feel the amp should not automatically end when the DoT falls off. My experience is that sometimes I don’t have time to fit everything into that small 8 sec window. As an example as fire, if I am using Pyroclasm and want the last amp stack to be used by it I am unable to because it just falls off after the 8 sec is up. Arcane has the same problem with not being able to Arcane blast 4 times before the amp falls off. I would say to have the amp stay on until consumed or until and new instance of radiant spark is used.

Least Useful:

  • Night Fae

    • Spec All

      • I think the problem with this one is the fact that I would rather be pressing buttons from my class to do damage. Meaning that playing my class would give me more damage and feels better when I would ideally use this. Also the CD reduction is too small and in some cases is counter productive. Take fire for example, if you are not running kindling then you want to stack CDs in the combustion window by using this you de-sync your Combustion from trinkets. Maybe a fix is to reduce CDs of trinkets by the same amount?
  • Venthyr

    • Spec All

      • This one seems good for dungeons and maybe for raid encounters with interrupts on a specific add. The main problem is that adds die too fast or don’t cast often enough for this to get full use.
11 Likes

Death Knight

  • Are there Covenants that are the most useful for your class and spec? If yes, which Covenant(s), class and signature abilities and why?
    • Blood
      • Because you have tied literally any character power or utility to a lore decision, yes, of course one is best. What is best depends on tuning, which you say you haven’t done yet. At the moment, I think the sheer utility of the Venthyr signature ability Door of Shadows outweighs the DPS of the class combat abilities for me personally, but it’s still not a compelling choice, it’s still one I feel boxed into, and will resent if it’s not DPS competitive. Also, if I pick Venthyr for tank utility I will literally need to play a different character to DPS things.
  • Are there Covenants that are the least useful for your class and spec? If yes, which Covenant(s), class and signature abilities, and why?
    • Blood
      • Everything but Necrolord is focused on damage mitigation, and that’s all well and good, maybe the mini-cooldowns will be competitive, but in all likelihood we’ll go with the utility or DPS choice anyway, because if the mob dies faster, they do less damage to us, and the healers don’t go oom, and because damage reduction won’t save us most of the time if we can’t get out of fire because DA/WW are not strong enough and my nitro boost is on CD.
3 Likes

Death Knight

  • Are there Covenants that are the most useful for your class and spec? If yes, which Covenant(s), class and signature abilities and why?

    • Blood

      • Night Fae - Death and Decay has a short baseline cooldown, which means you can keep nearly 100% uptime on Death’s Due. This sort of uptime is especially true for the strength buff, but not true for the damage reduction debuff applied to enemies, unless you get more than one cast of Death and Decay off on said enemy, aka m+ bosses and raiding. Soulshape is also nice to use as blood as Blood DK is pretty slow unless you talent wraith walk, or use some other form of movement such as goblin jump.
      • Venthyr - It deals a solid amount of damage, and gives some runic power based on targets hit, up to 120 runic power. This feels fantastic to get in dungeons as it allows you to death strike more frequently while its active, or allows you to easily build up runic power to use for bonestorm. This covenant ability interacts with our toolkit, mostly in aoe but it feels great because of this reason. Venthyr teleport is also nice for movement reasons.
    • Frost and Unholy

      • Night Fae - Similar to blood, it allows you to get a stacking strength buff when you want it. For frost this can be ramping up along with pillar, or used with breath, etc. and it feels nice to use. Unholy is similar, though it currently does not work with Defile which would otherwise make this ability feel quite strong on single target, as you could keep the 15% strength buff similar to blood. Same reasons as soulshape above, more movement is nice for DK.
      • Venthyr - Extra runic power is very nice to have as dps dk specs. Frost it can be paired with breath to help extend its duration, and for unholy you can use it in a m+ pack to easily spam out epidemic. It would feel a lot better not having to talent into your aoe runic power spenders, as that is what this covenant requires you to do. Venthyr teleport is also nice for movement.
  • Are there Covenants that are the least useful for your class and spec? If yes, which Covenant(s), class and signature abilities, and why?

    • All 3 (blood, frost, unholy)
      • Kyrian - It quite litearlly is just a button to press. It does nothing meaningful outside of damage, does not interact with your kit in any way and just does not feel good to press. All of the other 3 have cases where you definitely want to pick them, kyrian does not. Even if it were to be tuned best in pure single target, you would pick another covenant just due to how rare pure single target fights are. Please consider changing this ability.
11 Likes

Hunter

  • Are there Covenants that are the most useful for your class and spec? If yes, which Covenant(s), class and signature abilities and why? YES

    • Marksmanship - Venthyr
      • Flayed Shot interacts with one of our baseline abilities (Kill Shot) that ONLY Marksmanship can enhance.
  • Are there Covenants that are the least useful for your class and spec? If yes, which Covenant(s), class and signature abilities, and why? YES

    • Marksmanship - Night Fae
      • Wild Spirits is not working well with MM because MM has frequent periods where it does not cast abilities due to the cast time of Aimed Shot and Rapid Fire. You end up wasting some of the duration on Marksmanship compared to SV and BM.
7 Likes

Retribution Paladin:

  • Most Useful Signature Ability: Door of Shadows and Soulshape, because they shore up the spec’s weak mobility.

  • Most Useful Class Ability: Completely honest opinion, I don’t find any of them “useful”. None of them do anything particularly exciting or new for the spec. To put it another way, the spec would be totally fine without them.

  • Least Useful Signature Ability: Kyrian phial. Paladins just don’t need a small heal and debuff cleanse.

  • Least Useful Class Ability: Vanquisher’s Hammer. The holy power cost that was added to it makes it clash terribly with the rotation. I had more fun completely ignoring it from the rotation than trying to fit it in. As for functionality, I don’t like that it’s a single target and small cleave bonus disguised as an AoE proc. Because of the way it works, you either get a free Divine Storm in single target, or free Templar’s Verdict in AoE. Why would I want something completely opposite to what I’m trying to do?

56 Likes

Restoration Shaman

  • Are there Covenants that are the most useful for your class and spec? If yes, which Covenant(s), class and signature abilities and why?

Necrolord, Venthyr, and Kyrian abilities are all fine choices in all PvE scenarios.

  • Restoration
    • They all do decent healing, and both Chain Harvest (Venthyr) and Vesper Totem (Kyrian) are very easy to get good value from for both damage and healing. Necrolord utilizes the actual toolkit that Restoration shaman has, which makes it feel far better than abilities that feel separate / borrowed.
  • Are there Covenants that are the least useful for your class and spec? If yes, which Covenant(s), class and signature abilities, and why?
    Fae Transfusion (Night Fae)
    • Restoration
      • It requires you to hit 4 targets (not always possible) to achieve the max amount of healing. Hitting less targets substantially hurts your healing output.
      • The damage the ability does is okay but the healing is nerfed by 85% (which gets worse and worse the less targets you hit).
      • The range on the heal is 8 yards around the shaman. Restoration is not a healer (like Mistweaver Monk and Holy Paladin) that benefits from being in melee. This often requires you to run to the clump of players you are trying to heal - instead of just healing them with your class spells.
      • This is on a longer (2 minute) cooldown compared to all of the other Covenant abilities, and the numbers should warrant it being on a long CD, however it is quite the opposite currently.

For reference, on a Single Target boss encounter, you are better off casting Healing Rain (10sec CD) than you are casting Fae Transfusion (2min CD).

12 Likes

Rogue

  • Are there Covenants that are the most useful for your class and spec? If yes, which Covenant(s), class and signature abilities and why?

    • Bone Spike - Necrolords - All Specs
      • In its current state, Bone Spike is horrendously overpowered. It provides 2 Combo Points for 10 Energy in Single Target, and then scales its damage insanely exponentially in multi-target. Allowing Rogues to generate 5CP for 10 Energy at 4 enemies that live longer than 30s while also having you deal 4*2k damage to a single mob and also having four infinite duration DoTs is just bad design.
  • Are there Covenants that are the least useful for your class and spec? If yes, which Covenant(s), class and signature abilities, and why?

    • Slaughter - Venthyr - All Specs
      • Slaughter’s poison is simply Deadly Poison + Ambush and nothing more. As it stands, it provides zero DPS gain for Assassination Rogue and only single digits DPS gain for the other two specs (and only because they don’t have access to Deadly Poison). It is extremely clunky for Subtlety because you have to open with Shadowstrike for the bonus 15% damage out of Stealth, meaning Slaughter always results in less damage than Shadowstrike during opener / Vanish which forces you to waste a GCD during Dance on it (and with certain Legendary effects like Akaari’s is a big dps loss). Outlaw is the only spec in which they simply use it instead of Ambush during Vanish, but otherwise is nothing special.

In order for Slaughter to be viable, the damage of the Poison needs to be increased substantially OR it needs to replace Ambush a la Condemn with some kind of extra effect that makes it even more powerful so it has synergy with Outlaw (who has a naturally low Vanish CD), Subtlety (who can use Slaughter during Dance), and Assassination (as Slaughter can be used during Blindside procs).

  • Echoing Reprimand - Kyrian - All Specs
    • ER’s base damage is way too low compared to Sepsis and Bone Spike. Even at max Potency Conduit, it is only 132% AP. The 3CP is generates is worth 52.8% AP (using Eviscerate) and the additional ‘2’ from the Anima charged is worth 50.12% AP (using Rupture). So the most you’ll get out of this Covenant is 234.92% AP. For comparison, Sepsis (assuming the tooltip its had since Beta is right and not the in-game effect) deals 438.55% AP on just the ability and then you get a free Vanish, giving you a free Ambush/Shadowstrike and any Vanish-synergizing effects/legendaries.

In order for ER to ever be competitive, the active damage needs to be increased considerably OR after “completing the mini-game” you get an additional damage increase buff to actually incentivize the Rogue to potentially mess their rotation up to land on the Animacharge CP.

As it is right now, no one will take anything but Bone Spike if it drops live as it is now. And that is a shame because Slaughter has an amazing animation and Echoing Reprimand spices up the rotation. These are two Covenant Abilities many want to be good, but it is up to you to fix them.

25 Likes

Mistweaver Monk most useful covenants
Necrolord:
This is due to the major spec specific ability it gives us. It allows us to have short windows of a increase in power, 12% which isn’t amazing but in comparison it is the top dog. It also currently allows vivify to cleave freely onto anyone that has the buff even if they don’t have renewing mist on them which isn’t stated on the tooltip but is a nice addition. This bug puts it far above 12% increase in power that I stated but even without it Bonedust Brew is still top dog.
The secondary power on necrolords is not very impressive to a mistweaver as a 4 second channel time for a defensive is lackluster from a healing pov as we could save countless other lives during this window an as a mistweaver we also have 2 short cooldown defensives that are more than enough to cover all spots in the fight.
Less useful covenants
Sadly for mistweaver this is where the road ends are the remaining covenants are not worth their weight in salt.
Night fae:
Faeline stomp is a long cooldown essence font that costs an absurd amount of mana for anything that isn’t a stacked fight. As it comes from you and goes in a line (the only predictable, non rng, aspect of the tree it makes) in front of you, you can’t expect to hit the enough people unless your raid is tightly stacked, nothing unheard of but not requirement enough to be worth while. It also has the issue of not starting on you so you have to reposition to cast it if you want to use the reset ability it has. If we assume 6 targets hit per cast this is about half as mana efficient as a vivify with 3 renewing mists which isn’t hard to do. To drive it home a bit more vivify already isn’t a great spell when looking at a mana efficiency stand point. How it currently works the bolt are not 100% guaranteed to hit people you hit with faeline stomp making this ability even more unpredictable which isn’t good for healing.
The ability soulshape falls back into another one of those great categories of well mistweaver is already great at that as we have two roll charges baseline, a teleport we have to setup which again isn’t hard to do, and a whole talent role dedicated to increasing our mobility. We do not lack mobility meaning this is basically a do nothing ability and if it comes to use needing more mobility then on other class besides MAYBE druid or dh could keep up.

Kyrian:
Weapons of Order currently has a 2 minute cooldown and a 7% mana cost which from an outside pov knowing those two parameters means it should really do something special when it does maybe 2% of your hps if that, 0 damage, and has 0 utility. The ability makes it so at the start and end of you essence font channel you do a pulse of aoe healing to 6 nearby targets in a shortish range. This aoe healing pulse hits for about 3/10 of a vivify cleave which is already prorated from normal vivify main target healing. This ability also has a mastery boost which is our least desired stat by a few country miles one factor for this is that the stat provides 0 healing for anything that isn’t the MAIN target of your target spells which is only 4 spells which only 2 you regularly cast in raid.
The generic ability this provides is also falls into the great tier of underwhelming as 2 of our talents combined with the bests part of 1 of them removed. So this does 15% of your hp which Healing elixir does, and it removes some debuffs which Diffuse Magic does ( i should note the generic ability removes more debuff types) but Diffuse Magic also comes with a 60% magic dr for 6 seconds and a debuff REFLECT which is a very strong aspect.

Venthyr:
Fallen order current has 3 minute cooldown and a 2% mana which again looks like it should do something major but doesn’t. It gives you 11 spawns of monk which 6 are of your spec and the other 5 are a random combination of the other two specs. If we look at mistweaver clones they say they should cast enveloping mist and the clones themselves last 4 seconds. With current testing they do not cast enveloping mist at ALL but rather a weaker version soothing mist, will not target people who are not the caster of the spell and can be feared in pve content and pull mobs (rip my key). If it is intended for them to cast soothing mist this means their rotation would be spawn -> soothing mist -> enveloping mist -> despawn meaning your 3 minute cooldown is only 6 enveloping mists and some combo of 5 brewmaster and windwalker monks. This is not only almost no healing unless this is smart targeting it will do lots of overhealing.
The generic ability doorway of shadows is another movement ability but this one is a bit different as you can directly cast it no matter the terrain but unless we need to used it to skip in m+ or a boss mechanic in an area we haven’t been yet this ability just gets put into the why do we need more movement bin? Monk already has 2 rolls, a teleport, and a whole talent row dedicated to movement.

18 Likes

Shaman

  • Are there Covenants that are the most useful for your class and spec? If yes, which Covenant(s), class and signature abilities and why?

    • Kyrian-Enhancement/Elemental
      • Vesper Totem is great, does a good amount of damage and healing, is very versatile, and very easy to use.
  • Are there Covenants that are the least useful for your class and spec? If yes, which Covenant(s), class and signature abilities, and why?

    • Necrolords-Enhancement

      • Primordial Wave is incredibly frustrating to use as Enhancement, it requires multiple seconds of prep to get maximum value, in order to get 3 lightning bolts used with a single Primordial Wave you need the following: 2 Flame Shocks out already (10-12 seconds set-up due to CD of Shocks), 5 Maelstrom Weapon stacks for casting Primordial Wave, and another 5 Maelstrom Weapon stacks for casting the Lightning Bolt.
    • Necrolords-Enhancement/Elemental

      • Another huge downside to Primordial Wave compared to the other covenant choices is the fact that Primordial Wave does ZERO healing, where every other Covenant ability for Shaman does pretty substantial healing while doing similar damage.
  • Night Fae-Enhancement

    • Channeling as a Melee feels awful, especially for a spec like Enhance that is reliant on getting auto attacks to generate our main resource. It would be great if we could use Maelstrom Weapon stacks to empower Fae Transfusion.
  • If all Covenant choices feel viable for your spec, please let us know which spec(s):

    • Right Now the only Covenant Choices that feel viable for my Specs are Kyrian and Venthyr, Night Fae feels incredibly out of place while playing Enhancement, and Necrolords is just objectively worse because it does no healing and is insanely hard to use properly as Enhancement.
18 Likes