Class Set Feedback: Priest

In this thread, we’re gathering focused feedback on the Priest class set, coming in Eternity’s End.

Please note that initially in the PTR, class sets are a work in progress and will undergo substantial design changes in the near future. We’ll let you know the details of those changes as they are developed, both here in this thread and in our Development Notes thread.

Thank you for testing Eternity’s End with us!

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Please consider letting both the 2-set and 4-set disc bonuses stack to 2 charges.

For the 2 set, it’s not particularly fun to have a 15% chance that you have to change your next global immediately to shadow mend, or risk wasting a potential proc. Allowing it to stack to 2 would solve this, just like Surge of Light does for Holy.

For the 4 set, it feels terrible to “waste” a free proc while double casting radiance as part of a standard evangelism/spirit shell burst rotation. Putting a penance in between the two radiances in a burst rotation is obviously non-optimal and feels clunky and non-intuitive.

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The PTR server isn’t on yet. Is there a way to acquire the set bonuses for testing once it is?

edit: Nevermind I see an npc in Oribos will give it.

Without delving into any of the nitty-gritty, number stuff… Shadow’s set bonuses feel really weird and impractical.

Buffing a filler to this point, especially one like Mind Flay, will change our rotation in a very unpleasant manner, we’ll be constantly fishing for DT procs and delaying other spell casts, especially before/during cds.

Any sort of move away from a focus on mindflay/dark thoughts would be really neat.

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Really would prefer to see shadow’s 2 set move to buffing mind blast or devouring plague, rather than dark thoughts. The current design is incredibly awkward as far as how it impacts our DPS priority/rotation.

As far as the 4 set, besides moving it away from dark thoughts (perhaps put it on devouring plague?) also consider adding an AoE component. Shadow is already pretty middle of the pack as far as AoE goes, and many of the other DPS specs have an AoE component in their set bonus. Avoiding this for shadow would only compound shadow’s AoE weakness.

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Dark Thoughts is a broken and unfinished mechanic.

Why are you building a set around it.

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As a current gladiator shadow priest,

Please also consider this shadow priest set in a pvp stand point. If you look at the log of all high ranked shadow priest. We barely hard cast any mind blast or mind flay in arena. All high rated sp might cast 2 or 3 mind blast the whole arena game and maybe 1 or 2 mind flay…
So this set has almost no value in arena.

Please also be mindful that shadow priest has all its defensive in shadow school. If we get kick in shadow, we can’t use dispersion not greater fade, resulting in death in this fast meta. And a lot of decent high rated opponents are playing on this to shadow priest.
This set would make the rotation hard casting a lot mind flay to fish the proc, making it very likely to be kicked in shadow often and very immobile in general. In arena, there are not many moments after casting VT would you want to be kicked in shadow unless you know you are safe (enemy CD is not up or in a very safe position)… but this doesn’t happen at all against melee training sp.

I would propose to make the set bonus to somehow enable the void volley in certain situation, it’s both good in pvp , pve and mythic+. And make the projectile tunnel more in forward in raid encounter. Stay as it is in pvp. Void volley is such a cool design , enabling the fantasy and the lore of shadow, but it’s not in pve, I feel like it should.

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Greetings priests,

The Shadow bonuses, specifically the 2-piece bonus, are going to undergo some changes based off the feedback provided. To start, the 2-piece bonus will move its focus to Devouring Plague. As the only spender in the Shadow Priest rotation, and with the abundance of Insanity in the Shadow kit, it seems like a good hook to pivot to. The 4-piece will remain largely unchanged, however, Your Shadow will swap their current single target channel for one that favors AoE situations as well. Thank you for the feedback and we’re eager to hear your thoughts on the next iteration.

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Nice and quick response :star_struck:

Thanks for the update, and for considering the community feedback; looking forward to trying the new set on the PTR!

Thank you for the reply and update. These look like good changes <3

Hi!

For 2pc, the set bonus is rather underwhelming. It favours disc priests who have a disproportionate amount of innervates, due to the extra cpm of shadow mend/pw:s innervate stacking allows. However, because those disc priest happen to have a lot of innervates, the value of extra mana savings via shadow mend is somewhat irrelevant. Moreover, if you do not have an excess of innervates, you do not have enough cpm of shadow mend/pw:s for this set bonus to provide much value.

Additionally, for the major cd based ramps, this set bonus either provides no value or has ‘feels bad’ moments to gain its value. Starting with Evangelism, Evangelism currently relies on Clarity of Mind to gain max value out of its cd (this is partly to due with other disc priest legendaries are underpowered, but also due to the fact Boon of the Ascended heavily benefits from very long atonements). In this case, you are not going to stop casting rapture atonements to cast a free shadow mend. the 21 second duration atonements on top of the large absorb shields are too significant to ignore.

Same thing for spirit shell, you are ramping before damage goes out meaning it is likely you would feel forced to use the 2pc procs on targets with 100% hp. I would argue this is a significant feels bad moment because I either spend my time applying absorb shields, or choose to significant gain value out of my 2pc and cast shadow mends on targets with 100% hp.

I believe all of this can be fixed if the set bonus is simply more powerful in a universally appreciable fashion. Perhaps instead of a flat proc, the proc could use RPPM. This would fix the issue where innervate stacking disc priests gain extra value (which they do not need) out of the set bonus, and would be more beneficial to disc priests who really need the extra mana value. Also, perhaps consider some kind of buff this set bonus could apply so it is more useful in environments where you do not cast as many atonements (see M+ and PvP). Perhaps the shadow mend could buff atonement healing on the target for a set duration? This would make targeted atonement healing feel more relevant and increase the relevance of this proc.

Regarding disc priest 4pc. The wowhead datamining implies the 4pc allows power of the darkside stacks to 2. Could this be confirmed? If it does, perhaps an added line of text on the 4pc to confirm this if stacking to 2 is an intended interaction.

Other than that, the disc 4pc seems fine maybe even underpowered numerically. Penance is quite underwhelming power wise in comparison to boon of the ascended or shadowfiend. This set bonus (and the holy paladin set bonus) also seemingly doubles down on the problem in the healer meta. Disc priest gains extra dps from the 4pc so their ‘utility’ of extra free healer dps is worth more, making it harder to justify playing shamans or druids.

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Thankyou for the update, and acknowledgement of Shadow’s resource issue as a pain point for the future. Looking forward to seeing what you’ve got in store.

Curious about how the 2piece will play with Searing Nightmare, as in pretty much all AoE situations that’s our insanity spender and has the same resource issue mentioned, but I’ll save any feedback until I’ve had a chance to play around with it.

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Hi!

The Tier set for the disc priest is almost nonsense to solve the problem the disc priest is terrible in M+. And in the meantime, compare with Tier set bonus and buff from 2-legends for other healers, Disc priest one is disastrous. For healing, most of disc priest will use Penance and shadow mend as less as possible for directly healing, so if the Tier set is build upon these 2 spells, it is definitely nonsense. I hope if it is possible, the Tier sets can be build upon the atonement itself and increase the damage for several sec after some spells, which will be very cool and full of operability for all the disc priests. Priest is the most traditional class in MMO RPG but nowadays it has already been a rare class in WOW which make us disappointed. Please don’t just focus on the highest level player in the world.

Thx

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This feedback concerns disc priest in raiding content only:

2 Piece - this piece is extremely underwhelming unfortunately, for a couple of reasons. One, it rewards getting your hands on as much external mana as possible and playing into a style of applying atonements outside of ramp windows (which is not a style that disc can currently support with its long radiance CD, high mana costs, and weak damage). Two, and related to the first point, it’s counterintuitive in the sense that you DON’T want to use your proc during a ramp window because you won’t have the extra atonement duration that you would get from your legendary.

My recommendation - give it extra atonement duration and probably allow the proc to stack up to 2 times.

4 Piece - the design behind it is good, unfortunately penance is so weak right now that this isn’t going to pack the punch that you’d like from a 4 piece tier set.

My recommendation - Also make this stack up to 2 times and allow both stacks to be consumed by 1 penance cast.

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Love you homie.

so much love in priest community xxx

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The biggest problem with the spriest tier set is that it provides literally no benefit in multi target scenarios. And this is a flaw in design of the spriest. Spriest is one of the only if not the only builder/spender class that doesn’t have a baseline way to spend resource in AoE. Which in turn means that a 2 or 4 pc set bonus cannot buff said ability.

Holy Tier Set

Hopefully this feedback collates a number of perspectives as well as my own opinion.

Functionally the Holy 2 piece and 4 piece bonuses work: they are essentially reworded versions of Conduits: Holy Oration and Resonant Words respectively, with a slight tweak on the 4pc such that it affects more spells. It is a throughput increase, absolutely, but… I feel it’s quite disappointing—in the absence of any other changes that perhaps may exist but are not yet seen.

Light of the Naaru

The 2pc bonus feels very familiar to Light of the Naaru (Talent) and Holy Oration (Conduit). More Holy Word CDR is, of course, a good thing: Holy’s filler spells are rather lackluster without the legendary Flash Concentration propping up Heal. I’m certainly not going to turn down 15 seconds of CDR on a Holy Word… but…

Prayer of Healing

… I’m also not going to cast Prayer of Healing (unless there’s some tuning pending). Renew is also not going to feel fantastic with the 4pc bonus, but at least when in a Divine Conversation, if I really need Holy Word: Sanctify back quickly, I’m going to choose Renew… but it will still feel bad. If there’s a situation where I want Holy Word: Sanctify back quickly, it’s likely because damage across multiple targets is occurring. In theory I should want to cast Prayer of Healing in that situation, but more likely (without any unknown tuning) I’m going to cast Heal (with Flash Concentration) and play whack-a-mole. Amping Prayer of Healing sounds great—but only in a scenario where Prayer of Healing isn’t the wrong spell to cast. It currently is the wrong spell to cast.

Harmonius Apparatus

Divine Conversation sounds fantastic with a varied core kit. Unfortunately a large number of our spells do not interact with our kit baseline. Expansion of our Holy Words repertoire requires a legendary. We have a number of spells that have interactions with the other specs (Mind Blast has an interaction for Disc and for Shadow, but when it becomes Holy Fire it does not have a “kit” interaction (one could argue it’s the DoT… but DPS isn’t really our ‘kit’ considering we have fewer DPS spells…), requiring Harmonious Apparatus). Empowering a Holy Fire sounds great for DPS. But for more challenging content it’s unlikely that Harmonious Apparatus would be used over Flash Concentration—not that Harmonious Apparatus is particularly interesting, it’s mostly getting mentioned as a lament that its effects were/are not baseline.

Niche

Ultimately the bonuses undoubtedly increase our throughout (without any unknown tuning), but that may not particularly ‘mean’ anything. What is our niche? It’s not throughput—that’s currently Mistweavers (and ~Resto Druids). I’ve heard utility and that Symbol of Hope was supposed to be the start of heading us in that direction but the spell still leaves much to be desired. It’s more useful in M+ now, absolutely, but the spell still contradicts itself (% missing mana vs. defensives).

If utility is our niche, could our tier set perhaps be more of an experiment towards that end? I certainly like bigger numbers, but in higher M+ it’s not really about bigger numbers because a crit Holy Word: Serenity is going to do the job anyway. One thing that is often brought up is that we need a Damage Reduction or more damage (yes, practically we do more damage in terms of raw numbers on a spell-by-spell basis than Disc, but damaging while healing and damage reduction are still “always” better). I personally do not want just a raw DR spell. I will cling to this until something better comes along but we have a unique spell that could provide us utility and “damage reduction” (by healing): Ray of Hope. It is currently an Honor talent. I think if our 4pc was “gain spell: Ray of Hope” it’d be interesting and an experiment in a potential niche for us.

TL;DR

Our tier set does not inspire. Perhaps there’s some way to make it so that we do inspire (in a support-y sort of way). It does increase our healing throughput and while more Holy Words is nice… one thing that (presumably) is supposed to make Holy attractive is having a spell for every situation, and right now I’ve got a spell I’ve only cast this expansion because I like to see the animation from time to time and even the 4pc won’t change that.

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Would really like to see something different for Holy priest.
More CDR as our bonus set is underwhelming, yes it’s effective but lacks fun.

I’d rather have something to make us interact with Prayer of Healing. Make our Symbol of Hope an interesting spell. Making PoM procs have a chance to do something big.
Holy priest is full of spells for many situations there’s a lot to try

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