I never questioned that the Forsaken have free will.
Now, those Dark Rangers on the other hand, specially the Night-elf kind are rly suspicious.
1 Like
The forsaken always had free will
it is what made them different from the mindless scourge controlled by arthas - the lich king.
From the Sylvanas âloyalistâ side, all we know for sure is that the loyalists kept their identities secret and played along. So that means that no actions taken by any Forsaken, including âbanner baeâ mean anything for certain.
Kind of. Then they turn around and raise some Night Elves who immediately abandon their families to join the people who killed them.
1 Like
Forsaken have the pecularity of having âchangedâ from their previous state, but this change can come in many levels. A freshly dead corpse can create an individual quite close to the one s/he was in life, while one that was dead some time probably has a rotten brain, however much. Time is not even the only factor.
Most forsaken have a very limited range of emotions. Some are straightforward incapable of empathy. Some are pretty close to their previous human-selves.
Add to this the sense of purpose. Theyâre not alive anymore so basic instincts are dumbed or just gone. From the most basic survival instinct to things such as reproduction, growing, creating a legacy, etc.
Basically they were brought by their âladyâ and are like âso what now?â , and ready to stick togheter and do whatever theyâre âsupposed to doâ.
With time and social interaction, asuming theyâre âwholeâ or âfreshâ enough, some might be able to create a sense of self that was likely gone, and have their own individual point of view and decisions. SomeâŚwont.
Actually creates a contradiction for the night elves that Sylvanas converted immediately being on her side. Plot holes and all that cause ya knowâŚbad writingâŚ/shrug
Anyone who thinks Forsaken are mind controlled, just havenât paid close attention to the lore.
In game it may seem rather erratic how quickly one becomes a Forsaken but thereâs two reasons for that.
- Death and Shadow magics amplify negative emotions. Where light fills you with hope, love and serenity, Shadow fills you with doubt, anger and hatred.
- The game is just an old engine.
Correction, that cinematic proves that the average forsaken citizen has free will.
It does not prove that the Dark Wardens, Rangers, or much of sylvanasâ loyalists have free will.
She even states in the ghostlands cutscene that she pities them, but abandoned them anyways, clearly they werenât integral to her plan.
Pretty sure OP made this thread because ever since 8.1 some people have been claiming that all of a sudden Forsaken donât have free will because theyâre mad that those dead night elves joined the winning faction.
Including the night elven forsaken.
I mean Iâd debate it. Some Forsaken drastically change their views upon being raised which is highly suspicious.
Theres also the flavor text on https://www.wowhead.com/item=166678/brynjas-beacon
I wouldnt be surprised if some Forsaken, especially ones more recently raised, dont have free will.
The Dark Wardens and Rangers seemingly turning on The Night Elves moments after their resurrection is easily explainable through The Chronicles description of magics.
It is likely they had the doubts, thoughts and angers before they died and were resurrected, just like any person does.
When they were resurrected and infused with Death and Shadow Magics those thoughts became stronger, they no longer held them back.
You can debate if thatâs mind control or not.
However we also knew that if Sylvanas wants to she can control their minds to force them to do her will, which is why itâs hard to completely assume every single one of them is loyal to her or are being forced into loyalty.
Like Sira, she was already angry and when she was raised by Sylvannas that just intensified and amplified it.
It definitely is. Mind control doesnt have to be brute forcing your way into making someone a puppet. Subtle changes work just as well. Sometimes they work even better.
1 Like
Not all Forsaken are made equal as Brynjaâs Beacon suggests.
1 Like
That side eyeâŚ
3 Likes
they certainly would have some feelings of doubt and anguish from feeling abandoned by their people. However i can also argue that they would have MUCH MORE feelings of hatred to the Same people that murdered them, burned their home, and slaughtered their people.
Itâs not ridiculous for me to believe undead Sentinels and Wardens would rebel against Tyrande, But it is impossible to stomach the idea that they would work with Sylvanas to do so.
1 Like
We know that. On my realm there are forsaken gatherings called sermons of the forgotten shadow and free will and control over oneâs own destiny are discussed at length.
I agree.
The Darkshore Storyline overall seemed rather rushed. It would have been nice to see these Dark Wardens and Rangers struggle at least a little bit with how they felt.