Changes to Combat Potions

I really like the “two charges that recover over 5 minutes with a 1 minute CD” idea a lot.

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But it’s not one potion a raid night. It’s several potions over the course of years, because of an unintuitive system. Its a collective pain point that just about everyone has suffered from.

Not necessarily true. I’m personally comfortable with my gold amount, and consumables haven’t been an issue for me since MoP. But people on various servers (especially low population ones), can have goods that are far more expensive than on a big server like mine. There are other ways as others have mentioned (just make potions super easy to make for example), but this also solves the pre-pot issues of unintentional pre-pulls.

Potions are essential for progression, even in lower tier guilds. Its not something like split-farming that only top 100 guilds, and that can be imperative to raid encounters.

In Nighthold that played out and balanced itself out once people got both legendaries. A bigger more important issues was getting the bonus 15% damage done from your Artifact Weapon in Mythic Nighthold. That was a bigger barrier than two legendaries.

Fights will most likely be balanced around two to three potions still, or on fights that are shorter than 5 minutes (assuming the potion CD sees no additional changes) they’ll probably plan for only one specific part of the fight where you need a potion, or it would be beneficial to have a potion.

I don’t think this is about character expression or any type of slippery slope like you commented here. This is a change thats aimed at doing two things.

1.) Remove pre-potting on pull as a concept so that people don’t waste pulls when they need both potions.

2.) Reduce the overall amount of combat potions needed in Raids and Mythic +.

This isn’t some slippery slope of removing everything under the sun. This is a solution to an inconvenience and makes it just a bit easier to play the game at a higher level. You’ll still have to invest in potions. You’ll still have to use them at optimal times.

Like I said in previous posts, this is the first iteration of this potion change, I’m sure it can be re-iterated on.

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I’d also point out that I’m on a high-pop server and there are periods of time each expansion when there are not enough potions for sale to satisfy the needs of all the active raid guilds.

So “just buy it” isn’t even an option on some servers.

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When you need to level up an alt and raise their alchemy/herbalism just to remain gold NEUTRAL when raiding? Then yea, the amount of potions required weekly is kinda silly.

Their solution isn’t that great currently. But with a few tweaks I think it’ll be a lot better. We shouldn’t need 20+ potions a night just to raid. If they could tweak it so that we would only need 7-15 a night? That’s much more manageable.

I think the number of potions is less important than the recipe requirements per potion.

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Youre not wrong. But Im working under the assumption that recipe requirements arent going to change much from BFA requirements.

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BFA stat potions started out at 18 herbs per pot, then dropped down to 12 with the superior pots. ATM shadowlands stat pots require 5 herbs per pot.

I feel like the intended change here is to reign in Alchemy compared to other professions, right? You want people to need to spend less money on professions / being ready for raids, which is also an economic hit to Alchemy. I think that’s a worthwhile goal, to be honest. Maybe instead of a 5 minute cooldown, you can make potions have a duration of 1 hour and involve procs instead of an immediate effect. That would make them something more akin to craftable Vantus Runes then chuggable consumables.

And we still have 3-5 months left of alpha/beta. Im hopeful they stay that cheap but wont expect it.

Overall, I like the idea of the change, and has a decent bit of potential. I am interested in knowing if there is any desired to change health potions and in/out of combat usage. Personally I would not mind something similar, but I could also see the harm of them being a 5 minute “raid defensive cooldown”.

The consequences/thoughts as I see them:

  1. Picking where you use your first potions

Take N’zoth (heroic) as an example. There isn’t much point in using a pre-potion. It would be neat to use your first during the initial “burn” phase, and then again during heroism. This this type of optimization becomes easier to manage and make available during progression. For many classes, this means you can always align them with every other cooldown or so, which you simply don’t necessarily want at the start of a pull. This could also bring about more dynamic raid encounters where you don’t want to burst on opening, but still have those dps checkpoints.

  1. No more “oops” pulling early.

This happens a fair amount in our raid, and provides a minor frustration that can carry your mental state into the fight. I’m looking forward to this benefit.

  1. Utility potions: ever? (speed, invis, etc.)

Personally i would like to see these on a completely separate timer. Keep the 5 minutes, but put mana, utility, and damage on their own 5 minute timers. Or perhaps utility could even be on a separate 10 minute as to not diminish class abilities. I think this would assist the overall economy as well in bringing variety into what people would buy. I’d love to use speed potions more, I just don’t because, well, damage.

  1. M+ Mid encounter potions

When going form encounter to encounter so quickly, I think this provides that much more benefit of lining things up with cool downs rather than with pulls. Will be interesting to see it play out.

  1. 2.5 or 5 Minute cooldown classes get larger benefits.

I could see this being a balance problem with the standard way stats scale. Any class which by default aligns up nicely with potions will get larger benefit than those that don’t. This will of course vary by fight length as well, so it might balance out, but I could see it being a slightly larger problem in M+s where you may try and define those “5 minute big/boss pull routes” which line up specifically for those classes.

Overall, from a casual perspective (heroic raid, M+ 15s), I don’t think it really changes much (if it’s up, you use it, if not, don’t). I can’t speak to mythic raid. Looking forward to seeing what happens!

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I feel like 3 minutes would be a better cooldown for it. Combat Potions feel about as powerful as a big cooldown. 5 minutes feels like a really long time to wait to use one.

You sound like a padboy that only cares about your big epeen number and not a game with well tuned mechanics. AKA- A terrible dps

This change isn’t meant for casuals. It is meant to reduce the ability to express skill. Dedication to raiding is a skill that casuals by-and-large do not possess and easing potion requirements to a section of the playerbase that doesn’t even use potions to begin with isn’t a well-tuned mechanic.

IMO the player base did this to themselves. Pots are for a crucial spot bursting an add down, ect. They shouldn’t be part of pre this or that and 3+ times in a fight.

It is called management, shouldn’t be just used whenever.

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