…why there are Shadowlands dungeons on TWW Heroic dungeon schedule?
I was extremely unamused to get Necrotic Wake. I do not like Necrotic Wake. I do not like any Shadowlands dungeons by this time, and since this is not Shadowlands, why am I getting them?
Yes, yes, I get it, they put odd things on the Mythic schedule…but this isn’t Mythic+!.
It’s just to torture me, isn’t it. They have it in for me, they don’t want me in their Heroic dungeons. Pouts, a lot.
And another question: Since half the Heroics aren’t on the LFG list, how the hell are you supposed to do them on heroic? Form a manual queue and walk through the door? What is this, Classic?
This is a necessity because of the M+ key squish from DF S4. M0 dungeons have some teeth now, and players who are anywhere near appropriately geared who ignore mechanics are unlikely to do well in those dungeons. Heroic is supposed to be part of the progression path to M+, providing a dungeon where players can learn and practice 80% of the mechanics before they reach the point of M0. Not including half the dungeons that are in the M+ pool would make for those half of dungeons being very frustrating when players do reach M0 and M+.
To make sure it’s clear, I’m not saying there aren’t potential solutions. It seems like it would be pretty easy to have a random TWW Heroic queue and a random TWW seasonal dungeon queue so players can choose which set they want to play. But in the absence of something, M0 and M+ for the dungeons that aren’t in the heroic pool would be even rougher than they appear to be for many already.
I dunno why you’d say its a necessity. M+ and Heroics are two entirely different playstyles. They are no affixes. There is no timer. It is queued content. How is it connected to M+ other than being the same basic dungeon layout and bosses?
With the number of ways people can get gear nowadays, is anyone who wants to do any sort of serious M+ going to bother doing Heroics? About the only reason to do it is if there is a regular quest that its part of, or for the Vault.
And you can learn the mechanics in a Follower or Normal dungeon.
All I am suggesting is that, if they don’t want to include it in the queued content, just have it in the Specific list, so people can pick one of the non-Mythics to do if they want to. It just seems stupid to me to remove a slab of this part of the expansion’s instanced content for no meaningful reason.
80% of the mechanics are the same. For most players, M0 mechanics are going to be threatening enough until you overgear it that failure is very possible. Having that be the difficulty many players first see certain dungeons would create a bad experience for a lot of players. Personally I think the jump from heroic to M0 is too large, and would love for a difficulty between them. But if this is the level M0 is going to sit with heroic as the next step down, heroic needs to serve as an initial spot for players to learn mechanics.
It has nothing to do with gear. It has to do with mechanics. Unless someone doesn’t even attempt an M0 until they’ve gotten a good chunk of max level through delves or raid, the important mechanics in the dungeons are still likely to cause problems if players have never seen them before.
Even fewer mechanics exist in normal than exist in heroic.
Among the mechanics that do exist, fewer of them will do enough damage to threaten the group to warrant learning.
You can run manually queue for TWW dungeons or run heroic dungeons including the 4 non-TWW dungeons. I agree you shouldn’t have to, but ultimately you’re trying to place your preferred playstyle above those who want to progress through heroic into M0.
Like I said, this kind of solution should exist in the game so players can choose either to run TWW dungeons or prepare for M0/M+. I am not saying the current solution is perfect.
But there is a meaningful reason. You disagreeing with that reason doesn’t make it not meaningless. There is already enough contention from the current difficulty of M0 dungeons with the same dungeons being in heroic. Cutting half the dungeons out of heroic entirely would make it even worse.
I certainly wasn’t amused the first time. Now I select specific heroic dungeons of this expansion only. Shadowlands should never have happened and I don’t want to be reminded about it.
I understand all of what you are saying. I simply don’t think its reason enough not to have part of the expansion’s content available to play.
If people want to learn M+, then they can do a M0. Mythic 0 has no timer which makes it a decent method of learning Mythic at a less frantic pace. It also has no affixes so again, its got the mechanics without the extra pressure of M+.
However, all that aside my initial complaint stands. Im not really concerned about the differences in difficulty as I am them removing part of the content from the queue. I continue to think its a dumb move.
Yeah I m with you conceptually. Which is why I think the solution is to create a queue for TWW dungeons and a queue for seasonal dungeons. That way you can play the new dungeons on heroic while players who want to practice seasonal content also get what they want.
