Borrowed Power and Ability Bloat

Not talking specs, people do play specs because they like them, but when it comes to talents, many MANY go to outside sources.

That’s 98% will use one talent.

I question anyone that brings up statistics without sources, especially one as bold as 98%. I also question the methodology of gathering this statistic. Is this in reference to assassination rogues that are parsing and competetive? If so I’d think them all going for the FoTM build would be obvious, this also only points to one talent out of 3 choices on a row which might be filled with complete garbage on the other 2 slots. This is essentially useless information being thrown in here, at least without more detail.

It’s pulled from the external API, blizzard shows Talents on the armory.

It might not be perfect, but it’s as close as you’re going to get on active characters

Any source perhaps?

Ah, nm, it is players with at least 1 mythic kill, so they throw out other things.

Have to go yell at whoever told me worldofgraphs pulled from the whole api. Raiders are more likely to look at icy-veins than a flower picker.

I really hate how it has caused Blizz to design classes and specs half-***ed then use these systems to fill in the gaps, rather than making fully realized classes and specs then using said systems to enhance and compliment those designs. Would control ability bloat and have good possibly even great class design.

So it’s basically because it allows them to be lazy with their class and spec design. Again, you could design fully realized classes and specs and control ability bloat by have the rental power systems to enhance and compliment those classes and specs but they go away at the end of the expansion, and your class still feels complete.

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They’ve always done that though, many specs felt like butt without a 4 piece, sometimes you would even trade one 4 piece for another and feel like butt again.

But did those four sets actually have abilities that the class use to have and were taken away only to be added back as the set bonus. No those bonuses enhanced and complimented the class, and classes tbh never felt like they were as half-***ed as they are now. You didn’t get parts of your toolkit from bonuses, again they enhanced you toolkit.

We must be remembering two different games, because many times my specs played like absolute trash before decent gear and 4 sets.

It doesn’t have to be an ability to be night and day differences, look at traits, some of them make classes playable. So important in fact that some traits (like the 5 shards for the commander dude on demo lock) are being rolled into classes.

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They dont have to give you new buttons, they can just add teirs to the talent trees that buff your abilities.

Eh, i’d argue you do need at least one new button an expansion to spice it up. If all they added were traits and tiers people would get bored eventually with unchanging classes.

We must be, there were times when I played, never raided, so never had set bonuses, and my class never felt like it was missing something. Until these current rental power systems at least.

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Yeah, but it doesnt need to be a combat ability. Or, it could be new animations for the ability. Or something out of combat, or a movement ability for classes where movement sucks blah blah blah. There is a myriad of things they could do without adding stuff to your combat rotation.

Granted if you never had those things, you wouldn’t know. Just like if we never had these borrowed powers, people are more made about them being taken away then existing.

Nah, that might work for an expansion or so, but you need new buttons to press eventually.

Point I am making is, we didn’t have half-***ed classes with half their toolkit taken away only to be added back in before power rental systems. Set bonuses enhanced the class, but were they designed as an integral part of the class, no, they merely were that, bonuses that enhanced the class.

They could also have talents that change the way the class plays altogether. But if they did add new combat abilities it doesnt mean that the old ones need to be used at all. So they could do that as well. I really dont see a problem with ability bloat, there is always going to be a rotation that is the best if the other abilities clutter up your spell book oh well.

I like the way FF does it, they have a set amount of abilities they want to have around, and they add new ones while adjusting old ones to change up your rotation ENOUGH without bloating you or doing something like… changing ranged survival to melee.

But they could stand to add a lot more combat abilities to wow before they hit rotation bloat.

You could say the same thing about traits then, since traits are basically set bonuses

Difference is, the classes now are so stripped down, they need the traits to even play somewhat right, before these rental power systems, classes had everything they needed and again, set bonuses were exactly that, bonuses. But let’s just agree to disagree since you seem to have a different view on this than I do, and I don’t think we will ever convince the other to see from each other’s point of view.