I mean, I do preemptively throw hots out, but usually I start with my damage rotation (dots—> moonfire/sunfire (spreads)/ Feral-> aoe dot, rake all targets—> efflorence, wildgrowth —> lifebloom tank + who ever else takes a lot of damage—> rejuvs—> swift mend if needed—> regrowth if needed (usually not 13 casts on my last run in total). Then back to damage rotation to maximize output. If group wide/raid wide dmg —> wild regrowth—> tranquility. But yeah not too bad. Also decursing etc in between heal rotations. Plus speed buffs for massive aoe on the ground (stampeding roar). Idk just never had issues, and I think I hit more buttons than some healing classes do in any given engagement.
1 Like
I mean…yeah. The only hit point that matters is the last one. If you aren’t dying then the healer is doing their job
If you do die then you have every right to be angry at the healer. But if you aren’t then…what’s the problem?
2 Likes
This is all just grandstanding.
I wouldn’t be surprised if it came mostly from people who don’t actually do many dungeons but they’ve “heard stories” or they want to get into running m+ but “worry others might be mean”
Here’s how it actually works:
You apply to groups and if they want you, you get in. They have no idea if you’re going to dps or not. Keeping little black books with names of “bad players” is not a widespread issue enough to cause problems. It’s probably done by like <1%.
You do the dungeon.
The group disbands.
If someone thinks you under performed they might care enough to not invite you to their groups in the future.
It’s unlikely you’ll ever see them again and as long as you’re completing the dungeon in time you’re getting score that will get you into more dungeons.
The only time I see you being denied groups due to being an known non-dpser would be well past the point where it would matter as when you reach the point where everyone knows each other it’s long since passed the point of being above average.
Tl;dr
Non issue, hand wringing, https://youtu.be/3jFqhjaGh30
1 Like
Is one thing to wait 2 seconds when you know a big hit is coming and just not do anything for no real reason.
The problem isn’t with your logic, which is correct. Always stay active as long as it doesn’t impact your role in a way that prevents you being successful at your assigned role.
The problem is that a lot of healers don’t enjoy the dps role and or the expectation of it in order to be a successful healer. Also, a lot of the mechanics around how a healer damages is often a clunky GCD heavy portion of their damage specs tookit that can overall feel bad.
It isn’t as simple as hitting a damage c/d every now and then.
It plays out more like being a full blown gimped damage role, but with a healer role ontop of that which is your priority. You don’t stop healing to do some damage, you stop damage to keep everyone alive. You don’t get to focus on healing, you focus on trying to be the best damage you can avoiding GCD lockout for when you need to heal.
It adds an extra level of complexity / upkeep / resource management, GCD management on top of the healing aspect that isn’t cleanly baked into the healing role as part of it.
Healing classes can already feel starved for GCD and having to do something like clunky cat weaving in and out of forms can feel horrible for example.
So the question is, what could healer do during those down periods? It definitely needs to be something, but I don’t think baking in a portion of their damage specs toolkit into their healing kit that often just feels bad is sometimes not very fun for every player.
At the very least, the damage part of a healing spec should be as fun / well designed as the healing side of things and never feel like you are balancing conflicting elements.
8 Likes
Good god. It’s THIS EASY. Ready? I’m gonna explain why people want healers to DPS.
If a DPS can contribute 10,000 damage each, and a Tank deals 2,500 damage, and you can reasonably contribute 2,500 as well, and this is assuming everyone’s performing mechanics correctly…
Which group is killing bosses faster? Getting through trash faster? Getting loot faster? Is it the group with 2,500 LESS damage output?
No. It’s the one with the extra damage.
All that’s being asked is that you don’t just sit on your hands and actually touch buttons during downtime between heals.
3 Likes
- in PVP they always go after healers and healers wear light armor with only some limited survival abilities.
- if they made healers that Good that they wouldn’t need to use damage for survivability I believe it is doable but what if you are mobbed or a solo situation which convenant armor has made difficult.
Talent trees affect healers too because raids want specific abilities either super healing groups like holy or debuffing / cc with healing so it limits down the degree of other things like damage.
Personally I don’t tell other people how to play their class, so I don’t like but I listen to comments within reason. Some things we have no control over and it is simply a game.
What will Disc priest do then, or MW monks with ATOM talent? oh noes!!!
This is the main challenge with healers DPSing that is rarely talked about but goes even deeper than you touched on here. Over the past 2 expansions, healing in keys with groups that mostly avoid unnecessary damage has become a small set of moments where you need to put a hyper focus on keeping the group alive, but the rest of the time you have a ton of free globals to put toward damage.
This has warped the dungeon healing meta into a situation where your value to the group is nearly exclusively how much damage you can deal. It feels bad knowing that queuing as a healer is really queuing as a gimped 4th DPS but I have to bring a healing specialization for the five cases in the key where a DPS hybrid healing toolkit simply doesn’t cut it. Thankfully the dungeon design in DF is pushing much more value back to healers on their ability to heal.
4 Likes
Not to be that sort OP, but…
Reading over the entire quote (the 3 paragraphs, not just the one you picked out), it seems like to me that while they do think healers should spend their time healing and should remind us it’s not the priority of the role, they also consider that healer damage is a part of their (minor) strengths. Especially when it comes to M+.
So i can’t say for certain this is Blizzard saying “We want Healers to be Healers”.
With that said…
What do you think?
…Wasn’t it you guys (Healer DPS crowd) who complained about “healbotting” being boring? I mean since their making the content difficult enough, it should make it interesting, because you guys want difficulty it seems…
Or is it not the right kind of difficulty now? 
Fun is subjective. And personally, just doing the same things i already do on my Rogue when i’m on my healer, that idea to me is just pretty boring.
Fun isn’t always following what everybody else does or require you to do. It’s why i don’t follow hype trains to video games anymore. Infact, i find hype to be cringe.
I will never not be amazed that the general consensus isn’t, “Mind your own damn business and don’t worry about what I’m doing.”
It’s a multiplayer game and the actions of one person directly affect the entire party/raid. Your actions are my business because they affect my chances of success.
But as I said in later posts, I will be polite about it. If you decide to minimally contribute to the team’s success, I won’t say mean things or kick you from the group…But I will avoid you in the future.
I don’t understand you not understanding, so I’ll go straight to the root cause.
We disagree on the purpose of effort.
You seem to think effort allows you to do more things and you seem to think that’s a good thing.
I have always viewed effort as a means to accomplish things that allow you to stop expending effort.
For me, an ideal scenario is when I’ve made myself 100% effective at whatever I’m doing without having to expend any effort.
Standing around doing nothing is literally the goal for me.
That’s why I wanted to get rich, so I never had to do anything again - and that’s precisely what I did with my wealth. No crazy purchases. I just escaped obligations forever.
1 Like
1 Like
I wouldn’t bother trying to follow his mental gymnastics lol.
Also:
I’m not sure if this is supposed to be an underhanded comment or not. It’s fun to me because pushing buttons > standing there with my fingers crossed, not because someone tells me it’s “meta.”
It means they will need to probably retune the DPS requirements to time higher level keys. People are not asking healers to help DPS because they think it will be fun, they are doing so because the window gets smaller and smaller the higher you go.
That would imply that his gymnastics were ever easy to follow though to begin with.
I actually do find hype for video games to be cringe. I much rather wait and see if it appeals to me or not.
I’m sure Cookie Clicker is right up your alley for the amount of button pressing you will definitionally love. 
/j
Jokes aside, i can understand that… somewhat…, though me personally, when i’m switching to a different role, i’m switching to it because… it’s a different role. You get to do something different. Healing is the opposite of doing Damage. It breaks the monotony of doing the same thing throughout the game by trying something new or different every now and then. Especially since DPS doesn’t have as many active responsibilities as the Healer of Tank does.
And for me, the fun doesn’t come (or sometimes, doesn’t at all) from just pushing buttons constantly. Personally, i don’t think anybody should limit themselves to that mindset, but if they find it fun, then they do they i suppose. After all, fun is subjective. 
I think for me it depends on the content. If I’m healing a heroic dungeon, I’m going to be pretty lax; if everyone is alive and we make it through, that’s basically the bar.
If it’s a M+ 20 or raid or something, now the game face is on and everything I can heal, interrupt, punch or otherwise is being used. I think context is important for this discussion; if you’re sweating your healer not dpsing in your leveling dungeon, you might need a Valium.
6 Likes
Considering how the entire point is to dps when nobody needs healing, nothing changes.
I don’t get what’s so hard to grasp about that.
1 Like