#VanillaInNorthrend is not what we asked for. TBC was the Wrath Waiting Room, not the Vanilla waiting room for extra continents.
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The timing is so bizarre. The height of WoWâs popularity. The expansion with the most players. Thatâs where they choose to radically change the game.
Thereâs something else going on here. Iâm becoming more convinced there are technical problems getting these systems to work in the Retail clientâŠso Blizz just pulls this. Lazy, incompetent design.
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Are they gonna purposefully break half the speccs and make them completely worthless in the game and make itemization absolutely awful to preserve the âVanillaâ feeling of wrath too? 
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These guys are nuts. So are they taking out flying mounts next?
âWeâre going to do what Ion didnât have the guts to do- remove Cataclysm flying!â
Eh, you can get into AV before you are done leveling.
Wrong. You are adding things. That isnât what Mythic+ is at its core. Mythic+ can be MYthic+ without infinite scaling. In fact, it isnât infinite at all. Mythic+ just goes to a level where you couldnât possibly due anymore. It just increases in difficulty per level. Adding random affixes to attempt to keep them challenging. What was it they said they wanted to doâŠ
They should also remain an interesting challenge throughout the entire expansion, rather than becoming excessively easy as your gear improves. We are exploring plans to add challenges to Heroic dungeons as the expansion proceeds.
Oh, they want to add challenges⊠and they donât want your gear to out-scale the dungeon. There will also have to be different levels. As there is no way they are going to have dungeons that are challenging for a ToGC character, that they expect a freshly dinged 80 needs to do to gear up in the first place. Yeah, I see no correlation at all there.
Also, you forgot one part of mythic+. You get better rewards the higher level you get to. What was the rest of that statementâŠ
which would also provide more valuable rewards.
Oh, so you are also going to get better rewards the harder the challenges get. Just like Mythic+! Oh my! this much be a coincidence.
Wake the hell up. They are taking things from retail and implementing them into classic.
You are the one who said endgame. Endgame you are either doing dungeons to gear up for raids, or you are doing raids. Absolutely everything else you can do before you finish leveling to get to the endgame. You can even throw in all three battlegrounds that you get access to before you are done leveling. It still wouldnât equate to what everyone considing âleveling content that can be skipped because it is a small part of the gameâ.
Endgame is repeatedly redoing the game content over and over to get gear and in the case of PvP rating. That is fine. That is what we as players like or we wouldnât be playing this type of game in the first place, but donât for a second think that when you remove that repeatability the endgame is the majority of content. It isnât, more content is made for leveling than it is endgame. We just spend more of our time in endgame.
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I would believe the concept that âQuest Helper is too hard because weâd have to rewrite it for every quest, since Cataclysm destroyed most of the dataâ, but, as I posted on another thread:
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If I wanted my game to feel like vanilla Iâd be playing classic era.
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Maybe someone should remind these âdevsâ that this is Wrath Classic now. They donât seem to realize that.
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My response was to someone claiming that 90% of the game is leveling.
They are taking out the quest helper? Why? Out of everything else in the game this seems like a minor thing.
People have been using an addon for this since what the start of Classic? Are they going to start banning that as well? This just seems absurd to let addon stay in but the in-game service get the axe.
Besides this isnât new content. Why do we need the sudden need to protect the mystery of leveling in Northrend?
Really what is up with some of these changes?
OP is a liar. They never said anything like that.
What exactly do you think the "+" signifies, genius? xD
Right, so you have no idea how Mythic+ works. Got it.
I would love for you to point out where they said they were adding random affixes to Wrath Classic dungeons. Go ahead, Iâll wait. 
Oh hey, Heroic modes also award better gear for the harder challenge! My oh my!!
So call those Mythic+ too, or stop being a brazen liar and intentionally misleading people. 
Exactly, thank you for making my argument for me that leveling is just the same five or six types of quests over and over.
Iâm glad you agree that your argument works exactly the same for both leveling and raiding. It makes it easy to see that it comes down to what takes the most actual play time.
Unless you quit quickly after you hit max level, leveling takes a tiny fraction of your time played in World of Warcraft.
High five for being on the same page!
Okay so do you think blizzard will actually do something new and originally for âchallenge modesâ?
Or is it more likely theyâll just upscale hp/damage stick affixes in and call it a day?
The problem is that the people saying this donât know what vanilla should feel like.
Nearly everyone who felt that way about classic 2019 quit before making it to level 60. Paid boosting, multi boxing, all of that stuff kept classic alive, while the âvanillaâ feel people simply stopped playing entirely because they realized the game they loved was dead.
Look at what happened to SOM when they removed boosting and made the game harder to get into. Barely anyone played it. The same will be true for wrath. Players want things to be easy and accessible. They donât want challenges or long grinds.
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Fair enough I guess What Iâm trying to point out is thatâs what the default argument is going to be if 90% are going to use an ad on any way why take the trouble of putting a quest helper in But.
Why go through all the trouble of taking it out which is probably more difficult If 90% of people are using an ad on for it anyway Is it an argument of choice ?
I donât know I donât get it
This is what I was effectively getting at.
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Exactly and I 100% agree with that because hereâs the thing Even a lot of people that do enjoy classic and even do enjoy the lovely process have their limits.
I mean even people Like stay safe NS fan do have the limits of how many characters they really want to level thatâs why Iâm saying at this point why donât they put in an experience boost hurt per character.
And make it scale I just think itâs absolutely silly to pretend that the large majority of the player base likes to level when obvious proof has shown us otherwise.
I just want to play Wrath Classic. This is becoming Wrath- (minus) instead.
Who the hell is leading this kind of crap decisions?
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I think it has more do do with the cost of development than anything else, just like LFD.
Why spend a ton of cash to retrofit a retail feature into classic (I know wotlk had its own version) only for it to be revamped down the road ON TOP of the fact that most players are using addons like Questie that fulfill the same purpose.
From a cost perspective it makes no sense.