BFA: Life/Death - We need Deaths and Births!

Lore Story Forum
1

So the obvious themes in BFA are that of Death and the cyclular nature of life. Without going into too crazy of speculative theory about the grand scheme of things or how it ties into Titans/Old Gods… I wanted to focus on smaller players in the Universe.

We see Sylvanas burn down Teldrassil to upset the NIght Elves and destroy hope. This forces a mass evacuation and quite a bit of loss of life for the Kaldorei. Obviously Malfurion and Tyrande are super upset and we get the story that plays out in Darkshore. Pretty good, justified stuff - we see Nelfs at odds with Forsaken, arguably the most pro-life vs the most pro-death of races.

What we need - Kaldorei are long-lived race so I don’t imagine them generally having many children (we dont even see any night elf children iirc in game…yet). An obvious solution besides fighting back is they need to get busy - Stormwind needs to be full of expectant mothers and toddling elves! More importantly, Malfurion and Tyrande should have some kids of their own! The two have been married for over 10,000 years or so now - alot of which Malfurion was sleeping. Recently reunited, a good theme out of this devastation is Tyrande getting preggers. Ideally with twins because it would follow the theme of Illidan/Malfurion being twins (maybe girls this time).

We also see alot of death and destruction, mostly on the Horde side thanks to the Banshee Queen and her Banshee Prince. We see in the Warbringers Slyvanas dies to Arthas, looking back on a mother and child she failed to save. Again, this could be a theme - this gets into crazy fan theory territory - but its fun to speculate.

Slyvanas and Nathanos are extremely close and we see in novels they were actually romantically, physically invovled. Again, with theme-ing - what if that mother/child dying near Silvermoon to the Scourge is also reflected in Slyvanas? She goes into battle, recently having found out she is with child but prior to being able to tell Nathanos - Arthas takes this away from her just like he took away the other mother/child.

But why does that matter? Again, this goes into another crazy fan theory but I think it would make a great theme in the story. Arthas was the ultimate goal for Slyv to kill, once he was dead she felt no reason to carry on and thus we get the scene at Icecrown. However, she finds new reason to live after her suicide attempt there. After Varian’s death Anduin rises to be King. However, Blizzard has made several nods to how similar Anduin and Arthas are - the shot for shot cinematic at the Siege on Lordaeron . Jaina’s nightmare showing a newly modelled Arthas again, strikingly similar. The close bond Jaina and Anduin share… yep, I’m going with the Anduin Menethil theory with Jaina being his mom. We see Jaina reuniting with her own mom Catherine Proudmoore after being estranged and finding new resolve. We are introduced to Calia in Before the Storm and how Anduin remarks he reminds her of Jaina (who he sees as an Aunt but Calia could be his actual aunt) Taelia Fordragon -daughter to Bolvar Fordragon, current Lich King and possibly romantic interest for young Anduin. We have two heavy Lich King connections here - plus if you count Slyvanas being a new sort of Lich Queen herself.

This would make a fun dynamic between Slyvanas and Anduin and add even heavier layers of revenge - especially if Arthas took not only Slyvanas’ life but her potential unborn child yet Arthas’ seed lives on… a nice big circle that plays back into itself. Is it possible? I think the timelines allow such a thing to be so and yet to find any conflict in that. Some dislike the idea of Anduin not being Varian’s/Tiffin’s son and robs him from their relationship, but even if adopted the two’s relationship doesn’t really change much. I would assume Anduin would always see Varian as his true father. Jaina fills that parental role nicely since Tiffin died when Anduin was so young and the two have always been close despite ‘not being related’ cough.

So that is some fun speculation, please feel free to tell me your thoughts or add to this.

2

While I don’t think it’s outright stated, I think it’s been implied Tyrande may be barren. At least that’s how I interpeted her thoughts about Shandris being “the only child she could ever have”.

Anduin was born before Arthas and Jaina hooked up. I don’t support retcons so I’m opposed to this.

I think it adds nothing and makes no sense. Let the Menethil line die, we don’t need them. We already have undead Calia that’s enough menethils.

It absolutely changes the relationship we have been given.

The reason Varian was so darn protective of Anduin was because he was all he had of Tiffin, and he reminded him so strongly of Tiffin. Changing it so he was adopted makes that not make sense- there’s practically zero relation between Anduin and Tiffin in this case.

So no, I disagree that little would change, it would completely change their dynamatic.

Aside from that, I agree that we need more kids being born. Too much death, not enough birth.

7 Likes
3

Don’t elves in general have low breeding rates to begin with? I seem to remember losing the blessings of the dragonflights compounded that issue by causing the older NE’s to become sterile from living long past their normal lifespans. There’s a reason the Teldrassil genocide hit them harder than it would have say the humans. To the point where I believe only Blizzard pulling something out of their asses can realistically save them from extinction.

4

I didn’t pick up on that line in the same way but, it’s a valid thought. I hope that’s that the case Surely Elune can help. I fugured it was because they didn’t try often enough with Mal sleep and Tyrande later being an Alliance leader, they just got married a few years ago. And I think that line actually says that Shandris is the only child that she “may” ever have. So she might have not had the chance to try often. I figure she may adopt baby Finel.

I wonder what’s considered as low birth rates, like a few hundred every few years maybe?

I couldn’t agree more. It would ruin the established dynamic they had as father and son.

They may have had low birth rates but there were births. The elves do have children, Finel proves that but in their laziness Blizz have never shown them. Remember when they gave us Frandral’s grandson and showed him as a Blood Elf child, but had no problem making Nightborne children. :roll_eyes::roll_eyes::roll_eyes:

2 Likes
5

Is this even true anymore with Blizz going ahead and making Lorash an ~8,000 year old blood elf who was born a night elf? Feels like the natural lifespan of elves got a serious(ly dumb) boost.

3 Likes
6

Hell if I know. I have a vague knowledge of lore at best. I never actually looked into getting Chronicles here because I assumed liked a lot of obscure things it would cost a damn fortune in Australia.

7

I can’t remember exactly in which novel. But Tyrande isn’t barren, Malfurion refuses to give her a child. That’s why she adopted Shandris as her foster daughter, I don’t know why but he won’t do it.

But…We know Varian is his dad, and his mother is Tiffin Wrynn. Is there really a theory circulating out there debating established facts?

This is not accurate. The Dragons became sterile after the death of Deathwing (for absolutely no reason but this is what is established). But there has been no mention of Night Elven sterility, not to mention they don’t have an established “normal lifespan” because as early as lore begins Night Elves have been immortal.
Night Elves are evolved from Dark Trolls who settled around the Well of Eternity, the Well of Eternity made them immortal. Then the blessings of the Dragonflights after the Sundering allowed them to keep their immortality.
Only after the Third War after the defeat of Archimonde have they ever become mortal.

8

Horde gets enough deaths thank you very much we dont need anyone else to die.

3 Likes
9

Skipping the theory stuff to get to the meat and… yes. Even before Teldressil the Night Elves weren’t vast in number due eternal life. The High/Blood Elves and the void kin were reduced by 90% in the 3rd war with further casualties piling up with the failed assault on ICC. And then the faction war. The civil war with the Gnomes.

Realistically speaking the Alliance and Horde both should be running on fumes considering they’ve basically been at war for between 7 to 14 years straight. Time frame uncertainty due to in-universe passage of time. This all being 5 years after the end of Frozen throne which was mere months after WC3. There are a lot of dead and comparatively few living.

10

You heard the man.

11

Anyone have a source for this?

12

It didn’t make them immortal, it made them virtually immortal. Which is expressly different from the unqualified immortality Nordrassil gave.

13

I’m going to request a source, cause I definitely don’t recall that.

The only time the topic of having children came up, from what I recall, was Seeds of Faith, where Tyrande made the comment about Shandris probably being the only child she’ll ever have. Malfurion made no mention of not wanting kids.

Though, to be fair, I can understand Malfurion not wanting a kid considering how often he’d be called off to the Dream. He may not want to possibly neglect a child of his, if he bore one.

I’m honestly up for Tyrande and Malf adopting Finel, from the novella. She’s an orphan after all, and Tyrande was the one to name her.v

14

I’ll try to find it, it may take some time as I have to scour my novels but I’m pretty positive I remember reading that.