BfA Feral Feedback (cont'd)

(Strongbad) #884
I'm praying for some more attention and fixes. But it's just gonna be off to my rogue alt im leveling soon enough.

Im not even that hardcore of a player. I PvP in 2s and 3s around 1800-1900 bracket. M+ at 10-15 keys. And heroic raid with dabbles in m+ if possible.

In literally every aspect of the game, I sit there and think "if only I was a rogue I'd be more value to my friends", or just swapping to balance (which I will do sometimes but I hate playing casters). I love my feral, it's been my main since vanilla. But since ive started playing more seriously in legion, I just feel like a burden to my friends. I can pull decent enough numbers and know mechanics so they bring me. But I can do all of that on a spec that simply isn't as limited and offer so much more in the process.

Bliz has been putting in good work on 8.1. Even the feral changes so far are good. I really just hope they don't stop where theyre at for ferals. They keep releasing changes and I'll hold out to see if anything comes. But I'm not threatening unsubscribing because I won't over my spec being weak. I'll just swap, won't make me happy, but it is what it is.

(Arranoth) #885
Has LoTP made it back to a baseline ability rather than a PvP talent yet?

(Strongbad) #886
11/13/2018 10:56 AMPosted by Arranoth
Has LoTP made it back to a baseline ability rather than a PvP talent yet?

Nope. It really should be. They can add the healing portion of it to the PvP talents somewhere. But it should absolutely be baseline.

(Ancihcaor) #887
11/12/2018 04:28 PMPosted by Rockford
As a spitball idea, you could synergise the interaction into TF, and would very much recommend a similar route from Rogue's Elaborate Planning where CP spenders increase TF's damage bonus by X% for Xsec.

I like the idea of affecting TF. I am wondering about the synergy it would have with Predator + PW, might be too strong, I dunno.

11/12/2018 04:28 PMPosted by Rockford
I guess it can be improved by simply making it yet another ability (off the GCD) that is procced from PS.

Or instead of being procced from PS, why not a standalone ability (off the GCD) with a short cooldown and 2 charges of "your next melee ability deals 25% increased damage for its full duration"? Consuming PS would then reset a charge. I think that would remove most of the need to "frequently cast a Regrowth in exchange for its buff" part (it would actually be the other way around, you might run into situations where you want to use a BT charge on something suboptimal when you are at 2 charges with a PS buff about to expire).

Another form of BT would be as an ability + passive haste buff on a short duration instead of a ability damage buff. It could also be a separate ability but a tie with PS would fit thematically speaking.

"Increases your haste by 25%. Your abilities gain 25% haste for their full duration. Last 10 sec."

It would not directly buff direct damage abilities like Shred, Swipe and FB, but it would now buff Moonfire.

Obviously I am just brainstorming here, maybe just a desperate attempt to keep the conversation rolling (I agree with Rockford, I find this thread is a little depressing as well), maybe these ideas are bad and I am just throwing ideas against the forum wall and see what stick cause I am bored at work...

(Perifery) #888
It’s pretty interesting when devs get roasted by players

(Strongbad) #889
11/13/2018 04:03 PMPosted by Perifery
It’s pretty interesting when devs get roasted by players

No one's trying to roast them here.
Most people are happy with the changes - so far- but the conversation isn't over. It's just saddening nothing more is being said.

Even looking at other under performing classes, their changes don't seem too significant either. It's really looking like they are ok with certain specs doing everything other melee specs do- but better and with more utility.

(Sylva) #890

Wonder if they’re done with feral for 8.1

(Hoofhartd) #891

Hopefully not, they added some aoe talents but not much tuning to my knowledge, and I fear they arent yet tuning us to compensate for lack of the 25% haste bonus, along with any dps loss for talents being moved around.

(Cluey) #892

This is the best solution I’ve read.

(Sylva) #893

Yeah, from what I’ve been reading we still need tuning. Which I really hope isn’t put off until it goes live.
Aside from that, I was really hoping they looked at our utility. Out of all the druid specs, feral brings the least group utility.

(Nuisense) #894

Blizzard, lot of Ferals still waiting for the changes to Bloodtalons that you said were coming. Not much time left to get those out and available for testing before the 11th.

(Martei) #895

Yep this is a problem i like to compare to other melee leather wearing dps specs/classes and when you do that you see that demon hunter and rogues bring quite a bit the damage buff for demon hunters rogues have too many to list which leaves both feral and monks in the dust. Sure we have brez bot so does every spec of druid death knight and warlock rogues are the only ones with there abilities as well as demon hunter so i dont see brez being significant at all stampeding roar… i mean its pretty useless really cant say I’ve ever heard anyone say oh we need a stampeding roar in raid when they did it was on mythic kiljaden and then you would just bring bears with there far better stamp roar (bigger radius shorter cool-down) which they get they shorter cool-down again.

I have actually considered rolling rogue a bit lately i really really don’t want to but how does a feral compete against a class that has i all pretty much. Cheat death should be feral not rogue. The saying cats have 9 lives is cause they cheat death :stuck_out_tongue:

Also yes way too many abilities take us out of form decurse is one of them funny how moonkin can stay in form and do it. Its even more funny when you look at the fact that soothe can be cast in form as an offensive dispel yet the defensive dispel cant be used. Would love to hear an explanation from blizz on this one

(Sopa) #896

Am I necroing this? But I know I did stop bothering giving feedback about Feral, our own community is too divided on what we want, and these issues will keep coming back for such is the way of the spec, always has been and probably always will be.

Happily playing my Hunter once again as I was at the start of Legion. Never thought I would give up on Feral this badly, at least during Legion I made the choice because I solely just wanted to raid. This time around I think I may be actually done with my druid for any end game content unless things change drastically, bummer… considering its was my main for over 12 years, all the time invested in it and the connection you create with your character over that period of time.

(Rockførd) #897

Not at all a necro as it’s a continuing discussion, though I also suspect that what needs to be said, has been already repeated many times. That’s not to say feedback isn’t useful, it’s points such as the mechanical issues that need to be repeated again and again, despite the feeling that they’ve not listened to feedback here or in other threads.

Saying that, things like the change to Rip have come directly off these forums from loud repeated feedback more than 6 months ago (and I do hope they’ve kept notes).

Unfortunately, there will be divisions in 8.1 such as we have now. Maybe not near as bad being there’s the removal of Jagged Wounds that fed into particular playstyles. But I still stand by the opinion that Feral needs a solid, base kit with talents augmenting the playstyle instead of defining it.

(Waraila) #898

The druid discord probably screamed loud enough to prevent Blizz from changing bloodtalons, despite it being the massive millstone around feral design in the age of Mythic +

(Martei) #899

I think posting has slowed to a crawl due to the fact that we are seeing changes. That said the people who are playing on the ptr say they are seeing a dps loss with the new changes. Couple that with we haven’t seen or heard anything from blues about whats going on in forever, makes people think that there is no point in feedback. 2 way conversation goes a long way even if its rare when you get nothing you feel like whats the point in saying anything.

One of the major issues I have heard on ptr is with the change to rip you can now get your bleeds up quickly but if you have the savage roar talent you get an issues with getting all of those things rolling. Opener would be rake rip then combo points for roar but by that point you will need to get rip going again so do you use rip again or finally get roar going. The point of these changes was to get more damage quickly but that doesn’t work well in that scenario.

I honestly haven’t logged onto the ptr to test things. I just don’t feel the want to as I have an expectation of Blizz to fail horribly with Feral as they usually do. I’ve said it before I will continue to say it NO BLIZZ EMPLOYEE PLAYS FERAL that’s why we struggle so much they don’t play feral in the endgame content so they don’t understand how it plays in those situations. They continue to prove this over and over.

(Nuisense) #900

The issue Ferals who like BT have with it being just removed is that BT currently offers an active gameplay choice. Just take it out and you remove an active gameplay choice. CHANGE it to something that works better but is still active… And you won’t have any of those Ferals complaining.

(Waraila) #901

I prefer it removed, but note I said CHANGE in my post. You have a bunch of ferals who think it’s the be all and end all of skilled gameplay. It’s not, it’s about as mechanical as you can get, and stifles feral gameplay in the fact it adds to the ramp and makes us pretty meh when it comes to design for endgame play. Yeah you can tunnel, but that won’t make you very useful on multitarget fights.


The opener is really only an issue with both SR and BT (which granted is still likely to be a thing). Without it’s pretty simple:

Berserk -> TF+Rake -> Rip (1-2 CPs) -> Shred (or MF if LI) -> SR (1-2 CPs) -> Shred to 5 -> Rip or FB (if SbT) -> Shred to 5 -> SR (5 CPs)

Even assuming zero crits, neither Rip nor SR would fall off before you get the next one off.

The big problem comes with BT and the non-guaranteed PS procs at sub-5 CPs (and potentially the extra gcds could be an issue but I suspect this would be rare with a reasonable crit percentage).

(Nuisense) #903

Okay, sure. As long as it was an active ability. Doesn’t mean it couldn’t be (re)designed to be able to be used on multiple targets when needed. If it made you happier, it could be re-named to something else. As long as it is active. Or, if it MUST be a passive, something that changes how a fundamental ability works so that the spec plays in a different way. Otherwise, what you have is basically an Azerite ability built into your spec tree. Don’t we have enough of those already?