People are complaining about disc using renew or flash heal apparently…
NEW time cost
Renew CD = GCD
Flash Heal = cast time of flash heal
OLD time cost
PWS CD = GCD
Shadow Mend = cast time of Shadow Mend
why are people complaining?
something something button bloat something something i dont wanna push holy buttons.
not my words but a summary
The button bloat I’m worried about is HW:Life, Shadowmend, Shadowfiend, maybe Mindgames, PoH, maybe this Empyreal Blaze, etc. etc. all joining the hot bars. I can’t even wrap my mind around Binding Heal not just going away.
But if history is any indication they’ll find a way to make several filler spells much more useless than the others.
i mean you asked
I am fine with Flash heal, pom, and renew returning back to all spec’s roots.
These specs were able to do this before, and with the introduction of merging the specs back to the root, “the Class itself,” I think it’s a healthy thing to do.
I just want to emphasize that if we do this, then spells like Power Word Shield needs to be able to contest. In at least bC/wrath for PWS, its power rivaled the other spells and as I showed, was prob even a bit greater. Only Greater heal really outdid it.
As for button Bloat.
I think the devs should focus on making the core aspects of priests and their corresponding specs + spells to Feel good to press, rather than throw a bunch of throwbacks spells to make us feel happy for now as they buy time to really bring everything together.
Pretty much, I would prefer less bloat, as well as more power to the spell I currently have. The more spells you get, I feel like the more they end up powering down everything overall. Just look how Waterdown PWS and Devour plague is.
Just giving my thooughts. Core spells need to feel good for all specs.
Once we got that working, See what spells from the past can be kept, what can be changed/reworked, and what can be removed.
Not sure what direction they might take any spec into right now, but as long as they keep their individuality while working smooth, then i am fine.
I just don’t want something clunky because they either don’t know what they are doing or are too busy trying to please everyone.
I really am not sure I understand what you’re even trying to get at with this?
Disc doesn’t have anything like this except one talent - and that talent’s not likely to be played around at all?
Also the spec didn’t change much like at all. All that changed was PW:S got replaced by Renew and became a slightly better shield at the cost of a cooldown - and Shadowmend can’t be spammed anymore (which you didn’t wanna do anyway). In SL they weren’t taken for mitigation, they were taken for extremely high burst healing, and in early nathria specifically that was done with Spirit Shell.
PW:S hasn’t been a main source of healing since WoD. And in legion, clarity of will was tuned terribly and barely even functioned - nobody that was playing Disc at a mythic level was even trying to use it, because it was like healing with greater heal on Holy priest - just bad all around.
My points are-
Why replace P:WS with renew?- just fix P:WS?
Why put a cooldown on Shadowmend? - just to have disc use flash heal?
Why make Shadowmend & P:WS both have a cooldown reduction?- just to make disc play like holy?
What good does any of the changes serve?- just fix the balance issues?
After you add all the holy skills on top of disc, why wouldn’t everyone just play holy with less button blot?
Holy has better passive heals (ATM) with out the worry about atonement or having to swop to Dmg. Will blizzard end up with a dead class spec? ¯_(ツ)_/¯ probable - The number of disc players now- it’s just sad.
We agree Blizzard needs to improve balance, past mistakes doesn’t make me feel hopeful.
The shift was because we ended with dead talents with this focus to a class driven talents.
Disc didn’t have use for renew, wich are in the class tree.
Holy didn’t have much use for shadowmend if was not for PvP interrupt or this new empowerement.
PW:Shield was undertuned for everyone and disc just used as an atonement applicator, to buff it for other specs to use, or even disc, it has to have this CD.
I personally dislike the shift from shadowmend to flash heal, but that left us with some empowerements we still need to see how will turn out.
They still are their own spec, really far apart. Flash heal and renew are not strong for any of them.
Agreed blizzard created the problem, and the fix is to make them all the same.
But needed now to apply atonement with P:WS & Shadowmend having cooldowns in disc.
They are just making a problem. For no good reason. Disc had powerful P:WS for years and years with out a issue. I believe the new priest Dev might need some help.
So you’re implying that pw:shield and shadowmend are strong on live?
Having renew as an atonement applicator when you want to apply to someone who received damage makes a lot more sense. Pw:shield still apply it as well. And you’re basically just using flash heal instead of shadowmend (that becomes optionnal and stronger) it’s basically the same thing you have 1 new button baseline that is cheaper as well.
They are doing exactly what you’re saying they should by making the baseline stronger for all 3 specs. Pw:s is basically useless on live for holy/shadow.
Where in the world did you come up with that?
Not really. bubble- heal though atonement
Yes like I said
I never said I want then to be the same- have said quite the opposite
Well, if a dps takes damage, you pw:s him and atonement heal him up. If during the time you heal him up he doesn’t take any damage for 15 sec, that’s a lot of mana that goes down the drain for a shield that overhealed.
This happens more often than not. I’d rather put my shield on someone I know will use 100% of the absorb all the time.
I’m not advocating for renew but having a stronger shield has to have its implication and renew isn’t a bad idea although it’s adding bloat, sure. But what would you suggest otherwise?
For shadowmend I dunno yet if I like the idea. I’d just replace baseline flash heal and would go to HW:Life if in need of a big heal.
Yes fix mana issues, that’s been a HUGH complaint from BFA 8.0.
Just tweak disc toolkit and not replace it with Holy.
For the love of god, YES! This is what players have been complaining about, make the class’s feel good (FROM THE START) with flowing, smooth and fun skills. Stop over complicating things.
Agreed- though I have no idea how long it will be before the Huge nerf. I can see a big complaint in PvP incoming
But we are gaining less skills than we are losing, we just have to adapt.
I’d remind everyone that disc in legion used to have a spell with the single purpose of applying atonement, called plea. This allowed power word shield to continue to stand on its own and be a big absorb that wasn’t spammable and had uses in dungeons and PvP.
This is the same thing. Shield back to being chonky and on a cooldown, and renew as the applicator replacing plea.
Yes plea was soooo bad, it lasted as long as legion.
I only played with the calculator a little. I don’t see discipline losing more and one skill. Just shadow covenant, are they all in shadow. I can see 3 or 4 added.
Between BFA and Shadowlands, both Disc and Holy had their baseline mana cost on their abilities increased by 0.4-0.5% each. So for every 10 casts you’re consuming 5% more mana than you did the previous expansion.
This made managing mana a chore this expansion and it was almost exclusively balanced around using night fae on Holy. Other healers didn’t have the same level of mana issues like Shamans and Paladins who literally just laughed and were like “what’s mana?” for most of the expansion.
Basically Monks and Priests were in the same boat in regards to struggling with mana. I’m just hoping the new expansion finally looks into it because they stripped away the 2-3 other passive mana returns.
This really. Ive played the spec as it is since legion so am used to watching mana religiously in raid. I would be lucky to get even 1 innervate so i dont plan around it.
He isnt really wrong. Disc has been the burst spec since legion. Just cause it had some absorbs doesnt mean it was their identify. Their a job was to burst.
No i refuse I dont think its going to get really tested until raid time.
Jak did a video and was unimpressed with pws
Yes but they got rid of plea because they wanted to make disc more accessable to the masses since it was under played, wanting to simplify it. Im curious to know what their thinking is adding renew and flash heal in if poeople struggled as it was. People go yay more ways to add atonement but that isnt peoples issues with disc really
This is kinda what they’re doing by providing a cheaper ST atonement applicator and boosting PW:S though…
They are trying to unify the priest specs a bit more, I feel the renew change is a good one personally. It’s still a spell that disc had for a long time even if you say it’s a holy spell.
“Just tweak” isn’t really a suggestion. They’ve been “just tweaking” for a while and disc has been struggling a bit (even though it works) so things needs to move a bit.
Disc is still the healing through dps that we have on live…