Mangle procs that heal. Really bliz, of all things that you could have built around for bear, you pick mangle. An ability we cant even build around for our talents…
Soo anyway who else is switching tanks for df, since obviously blizzard hates bears and wants everyone to stop playing them.
Seriously though why not make it maul procs, that would actually bring maul to the forfront of gameplay for bear and have great synergy with multiple talents in our tree.
That looks not very powerful, but it increase bear’s st dmg and also rage regeneration. Right now without the increased dmg, in st mangle has about 20% of your dmg. So it’s still something. I think you think it worthless because you are comparing DF’s tire to SL’s tier set. If you look at other tanks set, you’ll find none of them are super powerful like dk’s in SL. So imo, seems a fair tier set, just not epic at all, but a fair one. Everyone only gets a little from tier, except feral, that’s basically bear’s 4pc once more.
I’ll agree, not the best 4pc set ive seen…
I can only guess Mangle, because not everyone is going the Maul route in the lower talents. Most will probably pick up their Mangle ability again, since it’s great ST dmg. Last thing I want is a tier set forcing maul talents on me. Maul might be great for offtanking in raids or certain niche situations, but I rarely even touch it in certain M+. For me, rage is for Ironfurs and FR and usually never caps out.
The thing that gets me, I wonder how much of that proc will be just overhealing… hitting with mangle at full/near full health but… if it has heal aggro… heck i’ll take that too. God knows we can use what ever threat we can.
Regardless, I’ll never turn down more self sustain and harder hitting Mangles.
Bdk gains 10% dmg and haste. Demonhunters get a plethora of buffs to them that will make them very good. Protwarriors get something that directly goes into what prot warriors doo as a whole and combos with multiple talents they have.
Mangle cannot be built around at all does miniscule dmg and the healing will be irrelevant. Think about it, in any situation with aoe this teir peice becomes useless immediately.
Especially if incarn is up, in incarn it is gennerally going to be better too shield dmg through ufr then it is to heal the dmg dealt since pawsitive outlook with 20% chance to thrash again will just do more most of the time.
Also its not just this teir that is the problem, bear as a whole in df, the talents comboed with this teirset just shows they do not care about bear and want everyone to quit playing it.
Bear has had these kinds of problems and no true identity ever since legion and they refuse to actually fix it.
I’m ok with it. Gore procs a ton so its almost a 15% increase to mangle and a 5% to thrash while giving us yet more threat and survivability baked into what we are already pushing anyways.
Out of the sets I’ve looked at its one of my favorites as its pretty consistent instead of something like vengeance’s 12% chance.
The numbers are incredibly low and on aoe this teir peice does almost nothing.
My mangle does around 2400 dmg rn, which means with a gore proc i would gain 360 dmg…
That is nothing, and this is specifically with a gore proc, without a gore proc youd be looking at 120 extra dmg.
Infact as a comparison condensed anima sphere heals say 5% max hp, with around average tank hp of 160k. I would heal 8k every 10 seconds whereas with mangle i would heal around 2.5 every 4 to 5 seconds with the occasional 2.8k heal with a possible chance of a crit even though our crit is low.
Over the course of a dungeon condensed anima sphere is gonna heal more due too not pressing mangle ever during any aoe packs since it just dosent do anywhere close too enough dmg or healing.
The set should be changed to maul instead of mangle.
I think the focus will be on 2ndary stats. Those tier set pieces that have good 2ndary stats can be used as a tool to get good stats …the set bonus is close to worthless in itself ^^
The Guardian tier bonus is a complete joke. The spec has been abandoned in Dragonflight. The talent tree is also the worst in Dragonflight right now, It needed a rework and it didn’t get one. Bears will be terrible in Dragonflight.
bdk gians 10% after consumes 10 bone shields, that’s tier set is also nothing. DH/pal/war/monk’s are much better, but due to the small amount of benefit, I won’t consider that a big issue.
I checked some dungeons I recently did to give a general idea of the healing:
Upper(heavy st dungeon): Highest healing is frenzied regeneration, 4.05m(37%). Mangle dmg is 1.9m.
Gambit(heavy aoe dungeon):highest healing is UFR, 3.6m(47%). Mangle dmg is 617k.
JY: Highest healing is UFR, 3.18m(40%), mangle dmg is 1.34m.
The tier set should give good amount of healing for st tanking, which is the short board for bear. Imo, the biggest problem for bear is still the same as this exp, bears rely on different build heavily, for example, talent like UFR/earthwarden… is super powerful for multi target but useless for st. This is not a problem in raid, but idiotic in m+. I enjoy raid as much as m+, I don’t get why there is a reason you can’t change talent/gear in m+. As a designer, you should never deny yourself.
You are counting incarn and probably ravenous frenzy in that aswell, All this does is make us tankier in something we are already tanky in.
Outside of incarn is what actually matters since mangle will be hitting 1 target and can only be used every 4 seconds outside of procs.
Its basically like the healing of the teir set we have on bear now, essentially just statpad healing that dosent do much of anything outside of our main cds.
The solution too the teir set is to make the proc of gote maul instead of mangle and the teir set actually becomes good.
But then this directly competes with the Galactic Guardian build, which is what they were trying to avoid in the first place. This is what happens when you design a class around two very different play styles in their spec tree. Whatever the tier does, it has to be viable for both, or else you completely neuter one or the other builds for an entire patch or you take the tier completely off the table for those playing the other build.
I mean rn mangle procs are gonna compete with maul and moonfire procs. No matter what its going to be a janky playstyle because they refuse to actually fix bear. Id rather have too deal with 2 competing then 3 where mangle does almost 0 dmg whole the others provide more healing and more dmg then what a cast of mangle can achieve with the teir peice.
Dosent exactly seem like they were trying too do anything other then make bear irrelevant other then for the moonfire build. Now that i think about it the whole bear tree in general walks all over eachother. Moonfire build dosent work well with anything else in the whole tree really, maul build or thrash, and theres not really enpugh talents too go full into a lunar bear playstyle just a psuedo moonbear thing.
Every other build is absolute garbage compared to moonfire, the dmg and healing of that setup will be the only reason why anyone would even think to play bear.
I don’t believe it really changes anything about the spec at all.
Because they’re meant to complement one another, at least in a M+ scenario.
The content we’re doing right now isn’t difficult enough at 392 ILVL to really make much of any type of decision on things and with tuning still ongoing, who knows how this will fall out, but at least right now I believe Ursoc’s Fury and Elune’s Favored both are going to contribute substantially to bears underlying passive healing, so much so they’re likely going to be competing in tandem with which will be #1 and #2, by a close margin.
I actually like that, because part of the theme that Guardian’s complained about coming into S4 with the loss of Urh, we felt like a wet noodle outside of Incarn and so if Elune’s Favored allows us to smooth out that feeling and combined with the CDR (hopefully getting buffed), it really actually touches on the 2 major M+ pain points with Guardian in my view.
Well if you are comparing the Maul build to Moonfire in a M+ setting, the Moonfire build is just going to win, every time. It’s a build designed specifically around that style of content and I think that’s great. I also think the Maul build will be substantially better in a raid setting than the Moonfire build, and that’s equally good.
Specializations have traditionally had a raid spec and a dungeon spec, so I don’t see a problem here with this.
I do think there are some small changes to the tree’s organization in terms of the placement of a few nodes that could help smooth out pathing, particularly for trivial content allowing players to pickup other options if they don’t need specific defensive traits, but I’ve advocated for that change for weeks to noavail.
I just dont see how it is even close to being a problem if maul was placed in the teir set as compared to mangle.
This would add far more then the stupid mangle junk which will only effect single target in a very meaningless way, plus with pawsitive outlook (ik its flashing claws or whatever but this name was better) thrash still will probably end up as priority during incarn so the mangle junk is just useless and serves no actual purpose.
Atleast with maul this could be amped up to doo meaningful dmg which would combo with UFR which (with rough math) would have the ability of healing upwards of 30 to 40k and shielding for 75% of dmg dealt on top of that which is massive and interesting as compared too gaining mangles 2 to 3k heal while we have probably over 200k hp.
id take the ability to turn maul into a great defensive and offensive spell over mangle doing an extra little bit inconsequential dmg and healing every single time. Seriously though with this kind of dmg and healing condensed anima sphere would do more then this junk if it were simply just healing for 5% max hp.
I would like to see maul being more useful. Even go back to the old version, 40 rage and no gcd would be much better than the current maul. It should be a perfect replacement of iron fur when you don’t need armor, if the tier set includes maul and heal from the dmg of maul will be better and make the maul build path not a useless build.
Or just make every tier set the same, mangle gives 4% dmg and dr. Since there are already half of the tank tier have that magic number for no reason.