You said earlier that you care about logic and lore, but now you discount the lore books as irrelevant, and think a leader is incompetent because the writers didn’t have him giving us enough dailies in game?
Are you saying he’s incompetent or absent? You’re changing your argument. Right now it sounds like you don’t like his character so you come up with excuses to call him incompetent. Even more, you don’t dislike him for what he is. You dislike him for what he isn’t: a warmonger
You’re failing to see that Baine, and the Tauren in general, are not military leaders. They are moral and diplomatic leaders.
He doesn’t have a horde of orcs. He doesn’t have legion of undead. He doesn’t have an army of mana-addicted elves. He has a small supplementary force of peace-loving Tauren. Anytime foreign affairs are important you see him right there. You see him planning and gaining trust with Tanaji the entire time, with the pandas in MoP, with the highmountain in legaion, and pretty much everywhere where it counts.
If your only metric of success is a military victory or leading large campaigns of troops, we’re never going to see eye to eye. You can put an asterisk next to his wins if you want. Those Asterisks are your opinions though.
He’s both incompetent and absent. He’s never around and when he is, he’s either helping a Proudmoore or losing territory. Not mutually exclusive. And you keep going back to his diplomatic skills when you haven’t shown any example of diplomacy other than the willingness to suck Alliance ****. Pleasing your enemy is not diplomacy.
And no, we do not see him in MoP. We see Dezco in MoP. We don’t see him in Highmountain, he wasn’t there for a single quest. We see him in the emissary hall, same as every other Horde leader who we know will all get to recruit one race. We see him with Talanji not sending enough reinforcements to Nazmir, abandoning us in Vol’dun and doing nothing in Zuldazar other than having us check in on Forsaken doing their job. Then we see Zuldazar get raided by the Alliance and Baine is nowhere to be found.
Keep padding his resume. Anyone that’s actually played this game knows he’s never around. Your revisionist history isn’t going anywhere.
You keep trying to turn a lore discussion into a personal argument. He’s never sucked up to the Alliance. He’s only had fair dealings with them, and he got more out of those dealings than they did.
You’re grasping at straws and pulling on quest numbers now and counting that as legitimate lore reasons to judge a character. I’m not revising history here I’m just stating exactly what happened. You’re the one with the clear bias against the cow.
Ive given example after example and you just try to spin them to sound bad. It’s disingenuous, and exhausting if I’m being honest.
Oh really? Where was he in MoP then? Where was he in Highmountain? You said he was there, being a diplomat. I ain’t see him and I did every quest multiple times. Where is he?
Where were you in Highmountain? you say you were there yet I never saw you there. Does this mean you not there? I never saw you turn in a quest, yet you say you did.
Sigh, okay but it’s the last time I’m going to provide examples that you can look up yourself.
MoP
Baine was the one keeping a leash on Garrosh the entire time. When Garrosh used Sha magic to make orcs go mad, Baine was the one that ordered General Naz to send out a force to take them out discretely so that we wouldn’t break relations with the locals. The entire time we were on Pandaria, the Pandas were watching us and trying to decide if we were allies or just warmongers trying to destroy their land with our petty war. It’s a constant theme of the expansion.
Baine is shown as one of the only leaders capable of showing restraint and respect through his protection of Anduin. Baine is the one that finds the Divine Bell.
If it was left up to Garrosh and the rest of the Horde Leadership, all of the Pandas would have been alliance and we would have lost. This is all seen in game.
For Highmountain.
He’s literally the NPC that recruits them in all the quest. I don’t know what you were expecting with that one.
Baine and the rest of the tauren could face stomp u…
I would not be opposed to the entire tauren race leaving the horde. In fact…I expect it. I would rather defend our own vs…trying to cohabitate with garbage like the forsaken.
I’ll give you MoP, forgot about that little area with the bell. He did ONE thing in MoP but I’ll give it to you.
Highmountain, on the other hand. No. He was not there. He only showed up, as I said, on every leader’s allied race recruitment quota. He was not there with us as we were aiding the Highmountain reunite their tribes and protect their home. He was not there to help them repel the Legion. He was there after everything was done and things were settled to recruit them because they both look like cows.