Augmentation Evoker is The First Of More Support Specs

Community General Discussion
21

I do casual PvP the lowest possible level and Aug Evokers are breaking battle grounds. It was not a good idea to add them .

22

I’ve been saying this.

Augmentation evoker is not the first support spec. Disc priest was all the way back in 2005.

2 Likes
23

This spec does seem more useful to PvP but…I really hope they don’t start tuning the entire community based on PvP numbers. We’ve done that before and it caused Warlocks to get nerfed out of the game for a while.

24

One of the best things they ever did was when they finally dropped the ‘we have to make all number changes the same regardless of content’ so pve content would get nerfed because of pvp issues or vice versa, to ‘ok these number changes only affect pvp content’ etc…

25

This is just a rough math idea.

All the people wanting the extra support I don’t see why the “meta” really matters.

The truth is we should be gearing tailoring to the average player. Before you say anything instead of basing everything off what the top 100 players can do it should be based off what the middle 500 players can typically do. With that being said.

Rough math incoming. My monk which I think is a good example because the only buff they got was 2% across the board from the patch with aug evokes. At item level 443 with beacon and bomb trinkets ina mythic 20 key prepatch was around 105-115k dps over all. After patch is is between 125k - 165k dps over all depending on the dungeon. These are quick averages it changes more based on the dungeon and how many times I died.

For quick math let’s say prepatch in consistently was at 110k and after patch I’m at 140k that means more or less it upped my dps by 30k. Most aug evokes pull about 40k dps ( usually less that I have seen ). Let’s say they increased the other dps in the group by about the same another 30k. That’s rough 100k dps.

My paladin tanks dps before the patch was about 50k overall and after patch was about 70k overall. That’s another 20k. So now we are at 120k dps.

I’m not to sure about healer dps, in my 20 keys the healer is usually way under the aug evoker so I would add a 10k damage increase to the healer.

So all in all the over all dps with an aug is about 130k dps.

I feel like wether you take support or don’t it’s about the same. I also believe this was the goal. The whole system is built around dps, the only way a support works with the current system is to make it an either or scenario. Either you bring another dps or the support. Either way it’s about the same.

If we keep basing everything off the top world stuff then it will always be a let down. I am also sure the top world paladin and top world monk will put my numbers to shame.

I was able to time every single 20 yesterday, some had aug, some didn’t. I didn’t see the aug evoker making my life and easier or better. The skill cap was about the same.

At the end of the day I could see aug evoker being needed in raids to help out. It still I feel like it’s an either or situation, but there are some abilities that would lead me to bring an aug evoker to a raid, like cast distance etc.

With all of that being said I think there are some people who would play this class or a support class in general because believe it or not some people like helping other people. So I think it gives some of us the incentive to log on and play, but I think what it is currently doing is screwing up the dps Q times or the amount of time it takes to get into a key.

1 Like
26

I don’t think you notice the passive utility it gives out. Also. tends to become more useful with bad healers.

27

I think a big issue is that the game does a decent job of showing the Augvoker how they are supporting their group (with the +xxxx int/agi/str and +1s combat text) but it does a poor job of showing the people BEING supported how the evoker is affecting their performance.

Sure, the meters may show you doing 40k more dps, but the actual moment to moment gameplay does little to showcase this.

1 Like
28

I think a void themed defensive/tank support spec for like Warrior or Shaman maybe would be neat. Think something involving Dual Wielding shields, that works like a reverse disc priest in a way. So you as a character do little-no dps yourself but have a little voidling symbiote “buff” that you can place on a targetted raid member like a PI and that’s where your dps comes from (if the Voidbiote is on yourself, maybe it is only 50% effective to allow you to do solo content just fine). So your kit is all built around thorns-like effects on yourself and anticipating damage spikes to absorb them with shield effects that will also be mirrored onto whoever your Voidbiote is attatched to that will convert damage soaked by the shields to empower the Voidbiotes PI on your ally?

I know most people hate it, but I love the concept of double shield use to be a 1 man blockade in fantasy settings and it would be super unique

29

Augmentation is my favorite WoW spec of all time, and I’ve played every patch since the game released. I’m also the type that pushed for Bards to be a class in WoW.

If they do more specs like this in the future, I will be a happy WoW player and might even play for a long time yet.

30

I’m skeptical that there’s room in this game for a support role as a separate entity from healer. Since Blizzard started pushing healers to do more damage, many have asked for a way to contribute damage in a supporting way instead of directly. It would have made sense to simply add that kind of playstyle to some existing healing specs like holy priests or as secondary options for say a more caster focused mistweaver/holy paladin when they spec that way over fistweaving/melee.

If we now have a new role that focuses entirely on buffing and debuffing, it seems like that will leave healers in their current lackluster state where we do some healing and have to weave a boring dps rotation for lackluster direct damage in-between.

It seems like Augmentation could have just been a healer spec that provides damage with a support style as opposed to prevoker that deals damage directly.

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31

Aug let’s me play with friends and have fun in the DPS roll. Normally if I can’t play healer I just have a mediocre time. And if healer was replaced by support all healers would lose their single spot to it.

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32

You are correct I don’t notice it because I have not started healing this season in higher keys.

I think heals / mitigation / damage avoidance would be the biggest gripe. Because in all honesty there is only one healer to each group, so you either have the healer be buffed or you get stuck with a raw healer.

But again I think it would be either or, and a simple fix to this would be to give tanks a buff to give to the healers that is only applied in 5 man groups. That way it doesn’t matter if the support is there or not.

Let’s be honest not even talking meta, but if it isn’t either or you are significantly crushing the dps’s chance of finding a group. Essentially if every group has to have a support, that means every group will have to have 2 dps instead of 3. Sure some dps with change to the support but I don’t think enough will swap to support to lessen how long it takes to find a group.

Currently on my monk which is almost 2600io it takes about an hour sometimes less, sometimes longer to find a group. In season 1 it was easier. But I think the community has reached the spot where they won’t see an increase until next season or next expansion ( which ever comes first ).

Monks are viewed as bad, so blizzard has effectively made my time searching for a group a little longer.

At the end of the day, I think they need to stop with the new classes, spec changes etc. they need to find a formula that works across the board for all classes and damage, then tweak the %s until all classes are doing about the same dps per a single mob, and per a group of 5 to 10 mobs. Seams like the amount of money being spent on revamping specs through each expansion or season if due to poor formulas.

Like maybe get rid of haste, mastery, vers. And stick with primary stat and crit for all dps specs. From there I think it would be easy to tweak each ability by a % until all classes do the same damage in situations.

Maybe I don’t know what I am talking about, but just the way I see it.

33

buffing tanks and healers doesn’t solve anything because that’s removing gameplay. It’s elevating people who do not belong at that level, to that level. There’s always going to be someone stuck at 19 skill wise etc.

People stuck in +2s probably need a 400% buff to heals and tank survivability to make ends meet in a +20.

34

This game has functioned around the tank/healer/DPS triad for almost 20 years. If support specs become mandatory then all of the game’s content has to be redesigned around that. And if they are not mandatory they will continue to be the balance dumpster fire that Aug is.

Blizzard is not capable of properly balancing DPS specs on their own…trying to balance them around buffs from support specs (which benefit different specs differently) is something that I am 200% sure is completely beyond their capacity.

4 Likes
35

If augmentation dps lands somewhere in the middle, Blizzard can pretend that it’s balanced, like all the other classes that totally aren’t.

36

I suppose it’s easier to balance if we’re talking about abilities that add damage based on the Evoker’s stats, not the buffed player’s.

At the same time, it might be more interesting to rely on the player’s own power so that, let’s say, a weaker Evoker can provide more power to a player that has better gear.

There’s also the fact stats benefit classes differenly, so… might be better to replace a 4% crit with a 1% of each stat or buff the primary stat of each class.

Anyway.

I think the support role can be quite flexible. They don’t have to be made equal like aug. Some might be support through heals, other through defenses, that sort of thing. If you think about it, Enhance Shaman are quite the support spec already. DF made plenty of specs have support utility in general, so we’re definitely seeing something like that already.

37

i can’t wait for melee support like champion in lotro

38

I don’t really see support specs taking off in wow because they have to provide more benefit than a regular dps to justify their place, and if they don’t do that, they won’t be chosen

Basically, they ALWAYS have to be better than a dps

2 Likes
39

Finally, a cheerleader spec for my warrior where I dance and shout at my team.

40

META = Most Efficient Tactics Available. It’s not made up by players; but rather something that naturally exists based on how the specs and encounters are designed.

The meta is discovered/calculated/figured out by players, but it is not created by them. The meta exists regardless of whether or not players follow or enforce it.

The meta is not an arbitrary list that someone thinks up because they like a certain class or spec.