Did you even read what i typed? And no once you lost the premades and they added the artificial queue time you immediately lost a huge amount of rankers. Rankers on both sides also love to honor soak their posteriors off. You have now completely side stepped everything i’ve said though and brought it back to map balance which i guess hey, props to you.
I didn’t side step anything you’re just being obnoxious at this point.
The glaring map issues will not be changed in classic and I’m fine with that.
What I’m not fine with is Horde that refuse to admit the map is trash and is 100% responsible for their 99% win rate.
You have literally side stepped my entire point and almost all subsequent points after. Read what i typed to start and try and let your disdain for the map not cloud your mind. The map is not alliance favored, it is also not the reason the win rate for alliance is as bad as it is. I still support moving the cave back, if for no other reason than to allow people like you to find something new to whine about.
Of course there would still be something to whine about in AV you still don’t see it.
Even with cave changes the map is still Horde favored although less so. IBGY will still be the best choke in the game. SHGY will still be one of the worst gy’s in the game.
It’s just like in AB the map is horde favored but entirely less so so it’s not as big of a deal. Horde in AB get blacksmith first and have the easier layout to defend with bridge proximity. LM/BS/Farm.
Please note something I’ve side stepped. I’ve tried to respond to everything you’ve said and then you keep shifting goal posts.
It’s obvious you’re just on a whine streak right now. Best of luck for you my dude, maybe you need a break from the game.
Whatever bud. Keep on dreaming that alliance are responsible for the AV mess.
I don’t need to dream, i see it every time i queue. And for your benefit:
What is up with the alliance strat this weekend for rushing IBGY… the worst of all options for you.
This is what you have side stepped and brought to whining about map balance.
I answered you on the first post scroll up.
If you think that is an actual answer and not a whine. LOL. I’m done with you. Good luck in your avs, keep running to IBGY i guess.
Yes, during AV weekend alliance play it like they did when AV first released. They care more (at least i do), which means the people that actually care about winning are in the game.
Played ~15 games yesterday, won ~9
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How is it not an answer? Are you blind or just dumb?
I said yes they are and I also said no it’s not the best strat within 2 posts.
I just said it’s irrelevant because even correctly trying to take SF you don’t increase alliance win rate by anything meaningful then went on to explain why. Going SF is better but it still causes any dead alliance to res at Aid station and also the horde get defenders advantage since they can get there first.
Pretty hard for you to read I guess.
Grats on your wins. Snacks is proof that zug zugs don’t just reside horde side.
Nice another goal post shift just like before then blame me for not answering a question when I already did.
Hell i can’t resist one last post to you since you’re having a hard time with your words. “WAHHHH map bad, why play if win rate not good, zug zug”. That was your response.
edit i’m sure he’s going to go into full blown whine mode and as i was typing this he went with the “ah i won because you don’t want to talk to me anymore” facts is hard. I’m done with you cutiepie.
Yes because explaining why the map is bad and giving you concrete examples of why it’s bad is whining.
Just admit you lost an argument and move on. Or don’t I don’t care.
Edit: Poor guy has no argument so he just puts an edit into his post to hide his shame.
Honestly getting sick of explaining this to literally everyone.
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This is a misperception. The reason the cave got moved back was indeed due to a turtle. But the reason the turtle was effective wasn’t because of IBGY. It was because the cave was closer to Balinda than the Alliance starting point was to Galv. This matters in a game where killing Balinda = 100 lost reinforcements. So the strategy during TBC was literally "rush Balinda, kill her, then defend Galv and turtle.
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This is 100% not how the game functions today. Specifically people saying “horde turtle” which is all sorts of stupid because we most assuredly are not turtling. It is a blitzkrieg strategy where Horde rushes SHGY over and over again until it eventually falls, alliance give up, or alliance decide to do something else. This particular strategy is made possible by the horde cave being a spot where players can rez. That’s what needs to be changed in this particular iteration of the map. Moving the cave when there aren’t reinforcements really doesn’t matter. Removing the additional cave rez Horde players, however does.
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So for real. Can we PLEASE stop trying to compare the map / strategies / reason for changes in TBC to the current map / strategies / reasons for changes should happen? They aren’t comparable. Literally none of it.
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Rolling our eyes at the fact that such wins are well within the noise of winning about 2-3% of the time anyway.
The AV Map needs to change.
This is about right.
Don’t mind Zejung. He’s very quickly confused because if you say people changed how they played, then it somehow absolves the map of any issue. He’s very silly like that.
It is the only one that pays off if successful. Everything else is slow death. AV queues are quick enough to warrant the trade-off for Alliance, but it also comes with a hefty cost at harming rep gains so it isn’t even consistently done.
Not particularly no. An option isn’t “good” if it relies upon a significant increase in player coordination, skill, gear, and experience over what the Horde are mustering.
And this is a non-starter because of the above. Horde make it to SF before Alliance and if we significantly fight the Horde over SF, we really expose SH. Assuming Horde are derpy enough to not really try to take SF very strongly doesn’t actually help Alliance because that means the Horde are derping straight into SHGY, and with a fractured Ally, now have taken it. That’s bad unless the Alliance are uniquely powerful to split and hold both, which means if they are, they ought to have just rushed down IBGY because the Horde are simply too weak.
it’s actually the worst option you have. To rush it you give up SH and SF, and it relies on not enough horde going back for IB. Which i haven’t seen happen since the premades were broken up.
It requires more communication which can be done in the 2 minutes before the game starts. It doesn’t require you to out gear or out skill as a whole, it just requires people to not be selfish which is it’s own battle. It also requires you to be significantly closer to even in gear to horde than alliance are currently which is a player issue.
Horde never rushes SF unless you’re talking about 1-5 people. They always rush SH. You will always lose people along the way in the ensuing fight but enough of your team should make it to vastly outnumber any horde there. Horde are going to leave about 10 people at SH choke every time. The issue starts when you have rezzers but if horde is derpy enough to send their whole team to SF (minus the 10ish at SH) which i assure you they are, alliance rezzing at SP need to immediately group up and retake SH. Now the map speed is even and you fight it out and have stealth go sneak cap and defend SF. It’s not great, but it is significantly better than IB. IB is the worst option.
To try to hold both SH and SF is to give them up because you’re not going to hold them both without significant coordination.
/boggle
Communication is more than just “hey Group 5, go take SFGY and hold it”, you would need to consistently communicate where to go, what sort of fighting is happening where, etc, and more importantly, when to finally take the plunge to take IBGY.
Splitting Alliance forces between SHGY and SFGY is entirely unhelpful. If Horde actually just ignore SFGY, they’ll battering-ram right on through SHGY and screw Alliance the moment anyone dies. You have to hope that you can take, and hold SFGY while fewer Alliance can hold off the mindless zerging of Horde who are happy to stall there, or at SPGY, to get their 30min win. And even if you hold long enough to hard-cap SFGY while maintaining SHGY, you’re now just… slightly closer to the IBGY assault point which still has to contend with cave resurrection reinforcement, thereby requiring significant differences in skill/gear.
SFGY doesn’t change the problem with IBGY, even if it helps alleviate SHGY falling, but you still need more than just mindless zerging from SPGY to SHGY by the Alliance to fix that failure.
Exactly the point. Getting shot only 10 times in the face vs 15 times is certainly an improvement, but you’re dead all the same.
Soooooo basically what horde is doing every AV game? If no one else is doing it, i do it every AV i’m in. Am i to be lauded as some national treasure because i can type out a few measly sentences during a game and think logically about what will happen at X if alliance are at Y? God i’m beginning to think 90% of alliance forum goers are actual whiners who want to win a game while putting in 0 effort. Your entire reply is basically just hoping you get carried.
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