Affliction Warlock Feedback


#1681

Overall, I agree with your assessment of Darkglare’s functionality and primarily favoring one build or another. The fact that it is not all purpose and useful to every build makes it much less useful as a general purpose damage cooldown, this is why DSM would have been a better cooldown (if perhaps boring on paper).

Now, an aspect about Darkglare that I really do like it the dot extension, but it needs to work with that new pandemic refresh trait. If it counts as refreshing the dots during that window on multiple targets with ways of spreading more copies of our other dots onto targets (maybe by modifying Nightfall or Drain soul to spread dots) then we would have a way to interact with it in a way that doesn’t just favor one build. The dot extension element does feel a bit too much like the HoT extensions of other classes in many ways though, and as such is not as interesting as it could be. I am honestly surprised they have not put more aiming and timing effects into the game, as they have to a of vehicles in the past couple expansions that have had such gameplay elements that felt really interesting and fun. It would be awesome to have angled skill shots that required some positioning and timing to land but extended dots. In fact, that could just be how Shadow Bolt worked in general, a skill shot that extended dots for Affliction, and a targeted shard builder for Demo. I see no reason they have to function exactly the same way for each spec but only provide a bonus for the other spec.

Only reason the game is stagnant and boring right now is from a lack of innovation. They have shuffled systems and priorities a great deal, made numerous changes to things that may have broken some things, and really have their work cut out for them to actually turn things around now. If they want the game to really succeed they will need to adjust their focus toward specialization tuning behind just gear and numbers. The focus really needs to be tuned in on the mechanical play of each spec and class now more than ever, due to the design of the classes being so sparse.


(Xoja) #1682

If they really want to emphasize multi-dotting then some obvious ways would be to make one UA cast more meaningful than it is now and mechanics like DoT copying with Soul Swap.

I really don’t understand why they would say they want to emphasize multi-dotting and then just not do anything.

Haven’t addressed dead talents at all either - what’s with the apathy?


(Sefirosuwar) #1683

Aff has one working build and spec that is still really good going into 8.1 doing well on all the testing and will continue to be really strong. -
Money says they are taking a why fix what isn’t broke approach

not that they dont hear or understand there are issues but more of is the issue causing the spec to be in-usable in content and right now its not.
other then in pvp - where the issue is that aff cant do its normal damage cause the other comps and specs are just that much better.
so just give AFF a defensive buff and health and then start the nerf train for everyone else
and buff the comps that work with aff so that there partners are able to do it all and aff comes as the support only class in comps.

Making them usable in rated PVP but not requiring a rework of everything

terrible project management works for the company
helps the customer 0%


(Ratfink) #1686

I’m not sure they handle the development process, but our company uses/Agile/Stride. They have separate teams for the new stuff coming out down the road and the regression teams for what has already been developed (current). If they do use such a system, they’re probably already more focused on what is coming out next expansion instead of what’s in BFA.


(Roujeaux) #1687

I definitely think a multidot focused Affliction is better for its niche. The devs’ obsession with giving it burst options certainly infringes on what Destruction should be all about. I don’t think Darkglare or Deathbolt belong in the spec. Things like returning Soul Swap and making DS: Misery baseline for the spec make much more sense.

UA was also more potent as single target, big damage dispel protection. If they insist on a dot stacking mechanic, bring back Haunt as a spec spell, and allow it to do the dot throttle/5 stacks dot mechanic instead. Give UA its old job back.


#1688

This is actually very likely how they operate. It certainly reflects how they have been handling the content for the past few years.


#1689

I didn’t like Soul Swap play really, it wasn’t very fluid. Sure it was functional, but it just wasn’t fun. What it needed to be was a DoT spreader instead, literally just a one button press uses up a shard and spreads all dots on your current target to all nearby targets. Done.

For burst, Haunt should have been a large burst of damage and reset on death, lingering effect being a healing effect like old WotLK and not the % bonus damage stuff they decided on. This would have restored self healing effects for PvP usage, while also giving back that burst for priority adds, and allow dots to retain their damage (% multipliers dilute the specs core damage spells).


#1690

Right here, UA being ONE cast that uses all available shards and subsequent casts would add to the stacks (up to 5), and increase the duration of the stacks. Multidotting!

We aren’t likely to see such an interesting design, and surely there are reasons, probably numerical and less mechanically or gameplay minded.


(Shiiro) #1691

I think im one of the rare individuals that likes UA implimentation.

That said there should be more things that Shards should be able to do. Whilst having empowerment was awesome in Cata, I do wish there was something in play to use shards and generate shards in a more exciting manner. That said that will only happen maybe next expansion.

Right now for Afflict I just want the talents addressed.
Increase nightfall proc rate
Increase the damage of drain soul
Remove the shard cost from Vile Taint… or buff it
Make soe the seeds reduce the cast time of Seed of Corruption
Make shadow embrace enable shadow bolt cast while moving
Remove soul conduit… replace it with something that gives shards instantly

small things


(Xoja) #1692

What do you like about it? What makes it better than other shard-spending mechanics we’ve had in the past (Soulburn, Haunt, etc.)? There hasn’t been much defense for UA stacking so I would like to hear more about the perspective of someone who enjoys it. I don’t really think “burst” is an excuse btw, since there seem to be misconceptions about Haunt being sufficient “burst” damage.

Fun idea and something some Warlocks have dreamed of for a long time but it would be considered broken very quickly. Think about why SoC has a long cast time and that it only applies Corruption. I don’t see us getting something this good any time in the near future, but I do think that providing some way to more quickly get our damage on 2-3 targets would be reasonable and ideal.

I definitely support the idea of one cast using multiple shards, and submitted some ideas about that earlier in the thread. One cast being 5 shards worth would probably be a little strong but they could also just revert UA to its old form and let us do other things with Shards :grin:


(Delofasht) #1693

While using shards for utility is fun and interesting, it is problematic in a world where shards are used for damage. We are sacrificing damage for utility to summon a different pet during combat for it’s utility, and then also losing casts of damage abilities. These are things that I do not think any other class has to do for their utility. So instead of using our utility, we simply ignore it existence.

I concede that dot spreading and maintenance on one spell might be too strong… but it could be reigned in with a 30 second cooldown. Long enough to refit one spread every other rotation, but require manual upkeep the rest of the time. As you have noted though, they would likely need to rework how Affliction DoTs do damage in multitarget situations (honestly something they should have looked at as far back as Cata). I proposed a resolution to that years ago, but it required a bit of coding and per tick updates checking for nearby enemies and adjusting damage based on nearby enemies. Essentially the idea was to have Affliction’s DoTs be AoE effects, that scaled down with number of nearby enemies. This way you could focus one target and still be doing damage to all of them, but when multidotting there was a limitation to how many targets could be affected by any one copy of a DoT. This made for a different kind of mindset of Affliction than other DoT specs in the game. Such a unique mechanism would have provided nice variation and not require dot spreading capabilities.

Lastly, most of the other specs with DoTs have ways to spread easily and quickly… yet the spec focused on DoTs has to spend the most resources to spread only one of their DoTs. It does not seem designed appropriately.


(Nahuy) #1694

I an not as knowledgeable as many others in this thread but here are some my ideas.

  1. Change shard generation - make it more fluid and consistent. Example would be every tick of Agony generates a shard fragment. Now this should increase the rate at which we are casting UA. There is the potential that our damage will go up so we might need an adjustment on UA damage. My thought here are that this will help make our game pace faster paced as we can though more UA’s out across many targets. Might help with dispel mechanics as we can still get dispelled but guess what I have 3 more UA’s already to go.
  2. Vile Taint should have the shard requirement removed.
  3. Shadowfury should be a single target instant cast stun. Darkfury should make it an AoE stun.
  4. Demon Armor should replace Demon Skin and Demon Skin should be baked into Soul Leech. Demon Armor is almost a mandatory PvP talent and so it should not be in the PvP talents.
  5. Demonic Gateway should be instant cast. As it sits right now its very hard for warlock to get the most out of there mobility talents as we need time to set them up properly. This change would help and allow warlocks to utilize these talent in more PvP situation.

I am not sure the 10% health from Demon Armor and the additional 10% from Demonic Embrace is going to enough to keep us alive long enough in PvP. By the end of 8.1 people will be hitting a lot harder. So 20% health might just delay the inevitable.


(Diora) #1697

As it gets closer to 8.1 i feel everyone that has regularly posted here has lost hope. I know it s the holidays but 5days without a post .seems like warlocks have given up. I for one was looking forward to resubbing and playing my freshly reworked / buffed warlock. But that does not look like its going to happen.


(Jessail) #1698

At this point I think blizz is ‘happy’ with where affliction is even if we’re not. I’m not expecting any changes and especially not any buffs until 9.0 at this point.


(Delofasht) #1699

Yes, it does seem that most of us have stepped out. Talking to a wall is not really doing us any good, we have gotten no responses and do not feel better for having said it all in the first place.

Personally I think the design philosophy needs to change away from gear based goals of completing specs. (See new pandemic trait design). Such designs invariably feel bad to have to chase down and get through RNG layers to just feel complete as a spec. Now having to spend a kind of currency that is gotten from mythics, raids, and arena/rated bg to slot specific traits would have worked instead. Straight replacing one trait with another, so that then gear is functionally just a stat stick and what we are farming then is specific looks plus tokens to switch slots out in gear. The gear could have small passive like movespeed, leech, or damage reduction on certain fights or zones, so that we then want it to replace gear from the previous tier to be better in the new tier of content.

That is mostly centered on general design, but how it specifically fits for Affliction is in those traits in gear that we need. Blizz solution of more chances at their RNG does not solve the issue. Some of us will still want some traits and simply not be able to have pieces of gear with the traits we want no matter what we do.

Traits also should not be giving us the same level of power as talents, they should not be modifying the spec so heavily. Inevitable demise should be a talent, new pandemic window shard gen should be a talent, sudden impact just wrapped into WiA.

Traits should be improving specific abilities damage or the shape of our targeting of abilities. Example: Traited Sudden Onset now makes Agony be applied in a cone in front of the caster, but now has a 12 second cooldown. If traits worked like this then boom, instantly having interesting new spells that many of us would be seeking out, not just bigger numbers of damage. Changing the gameplay without affecting directly the mechanical play of dotting everything in sight (just an easy way to apply it to all targets, but more vulnerable in PvP to dispels).

Overall though, I am pretty much done saying the same things over and over, each expansion is me giving such kinds of feedback to a wall. Our wants and desires have been either seen or not at this point, it is on the devs to make it happen or watch players move on to other games. I know I have been doing more of that lately.


(Sefirosuwar) #1700

black friday and cyber monday - just hit, Ive been playing allot of consoles games and found my self not missing WoW in any way what so ever. -
Even after leveling 2 toons to replace my Locks and just feeling unsatisfied with either of them. -
Boomkin is fun in PVP but forget mythic plus… it feels so bad when the boss comes, aoe is fine on big pulls.

I leveled that to feel better then playing my lock and all it does is make me wish my lock was good. and that I didn’t have to play another toon just to be good in arena’s -GOD blizzard fix your game already.


(Xoja) #1701

For me it’s a combination of a few things. One, how long everyone on this forum (not just Warlocks) have been leaving feedback that is completely relevant and points to real issues with the game that has been flat out ignored. It has been almost a year since BfA testing started and that is plenty of time to see that the devs have not been swallowing their pills.

Also, I realized that many people on this forum show more passion than the devs do for their classes. People test, analyze and leave feedback for this game for free like it’s a second job but all they really expect is a quality product to be delivered. It didn’t happen with BfA, and it doesn’t look like 8.1 is fixing as many things as it could. It’s really hard to trust them at this point, as much as it is to enjoy playing right now.

It’s not even just about Warlock or Affliction at this point for me. It’s about every class in the game feeling like but a shell of what it used to be, and constantly asking myself how they could let a game so beautiful get to this point with class design. 14 years of iterations, trial and error with design and this is what we have now.

But as for Affliction, I really think the sentiment that they are happy with it is correct. The window is almost closed for PTR changes. Feedback has been echoing for months now - they had what they needed from us a long time ago. But what’s sad to me is that within minutes of being on the Alpha server and looking at Affliction I knew what the problems would be. I could tell it was going to be terrible in Arenas. And here we are almost a year later, looking like there is going to be a second season with the same meta.

I’m actually done until I see something concrete. Aff is my favorite spec and I can barely stomach playing it as it is now. I don’t need to go into why… I’ve given enough of my time doing that already.


(Eldrìtch) #1702

I mean people complained enough about azerite and that got addressed so…I guess we just haven’t complained enough yet lol.

Honestly I get more enjoyment now out of coming up with and seeing others’ ideas of how the spec could be fixed/changed than I do actually playing the spec as it is currently.


(Xoja) #1703

Azerite saw a lot of complaint volume because it is something everyone uses, I think. I wish the same could be said about an individual spec but between this forum, the Warlock forums and the Arena forums I would hope they’ve seen that something should be done.

But yeah I agree with

It’s a lot more fun brainstorming things that would make Affliction fun. A lot of them are pretty simple things too, sadly.


(Wrathh) #1704

I was thinking about this today as a turbo cleave proceeded to win after I ran out of mana…What if fel lord operated the same as observer but for melee. Hell, remove the stun, but cause the fel lord to strike 5% of the targets health if a physical attack occurs…but then I stopped day dreaming and realized this thread is up to 1.7k and there has been absolute radio silence for nearly three months.