A solution for M+ quitters

I think a deserter debuff would be ample “punishment”. But I think the problem would be much less pronounced if there was actually a reason for people to complete. Currently the only incentive for people to run is to raise io score so it’s no real surprise that people leave once that isn’t possible.

If people could cap their AP through M+ rather than islands, nobody would run islands. That’s literally the only reason Blizzard won’t increase M+ rewards, and I think that’s pretty sad and just a little spiteful on their behalf.

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Oh, dude anything would be better than the current situation. I proposed my ideal scenario, but I’m not under any illusion that some dev will fall in love with them and implement them in their entirety.

I hate leavers. I have rarely ever left a key before it was done. MAYBE twice in Legion when there truly was no hope. Usually we wait until everyone else starts ditching. Once the key holder gives up it’s time to go.

BUT

There is nothing fair about trying to force people to stay with punishments because… and I cannot stress this enough… These are player made groups. This is where the community has to deal with the good and the bad. The good is that we can choose who we run with. We can look at things like a score or check achievements if we are looking for random people to fill the group with, or we do what is smart and grab our friends/guildies. It’s no different from normal or higher raid, mythic island expeditions, or rated PvP (except you cannot invite a new person once a key is in progress, but that is to protect people from getting kicked so another person could get a chance at loot or probably other bad things). The bad is that inviting random people sometimes has consequences like them leaving, or that person not actually being as adept as you thought. People I guess even try to lie about their scores now, just like we have nasty little selfish people who use a fake achievement to get into raids. When there’s millions of players and you don’t actually know these people you invite to your group there are sometimes going to be bad consequences.

There has to be a line. At some point it can’t all be random people that Blizz matches us up with like in Heroic dungeons. The content isn’t built that way after a certain point. If they made the content match LFR standards there would be no room to grow and work on things like high scores or Cutting Edge.

Two bits of advice: first, remember that reasons are unique to the individual so essentially we can’t define “no good reason”. Second, put more time into getting guildies/networking on btag/trying to get a team through a community and stop letting strangers mess up your run if you are tired of strangers doing that. Don’t try to force the ideas behind random groups like Heroic dungeons onto content above that.

Just my two cents.

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I do agree with you. A big part of my premise is actually other games’ competitve rules for quitters. I also play CSGO pretty regularly, and there the punishment for leaving ranked matches are pretty severe, BUT the distinction you mentioned is very relevant, there the people in your team are mostly random thus people leaving are outside of your control leaving you with literally 0 blame.

However, let me ask you this: let’s say you were in the group I described in my first post. You’re not leader but you’re not the person who left, what’s your share of the blame? I’d say the same as the CSGO player, 0. One can blame the leader for not “screening” properly, whatever the hell that means, but one can’t blame the others.

That being said, my goal isn’t to attribute blame to people. Like you said, “no good reason” is subjective, and sometimes people have to leave for good reason. However, the same way that i you if park your car in a no parking space you’ll be fined, and it doesn’t matter if your reason was justified or not, you’ll have to pay it. The goal of the rule isn’t to attribute blame, but to create an environment that will discourage most people in most situations to park there, or in our case here, to leave a M+.

Although I do wish there was a punishment involved I can see the potential backlash.

I think the simplest route would be to have a little counter that tells people that you left key runs. this way when someone is looking for a person to join he can see how many times you left a key run and make an informed decision on whether to take you or not.

The problem is that sometimes runs end for legit reasons. I have also been in runs where the entire group can see this is not happening. Does everyone get punished because they all left? Or does only the first person who left get punished? Then who decides what player is going to take the punishment for leaving?

My solution…

Just put in a voting system in M+. If a key is going sideways allow players to put up a vote to abandon the key. If the majority votes yes this would allow all players to leave the key without being punished because the group majority agrees the key will take to long or wont get done. I have been in groups before that have abandoned a key because the majority agree its not happening. More often than not a sensible group will agree with each other if the key is not happening and abandon it. This way nobody gets deserter or a mark for the season they left a group. Anyone that leaves before a vote is done gets something like a 1 hour deserter and a marker that shows they have abandoned a key on their record. This mark on their account lasts the duration of the season.

You can also pug mythic raid, but your success rate will be lower because the content isn’t designed for pugs. Same for mythic plus. Pugging is possible, but you accept the risk of low success rates by doing so.

Why not have the key… not go down a level? Have your cache key be -1 from the previous week, that’s fine.

The worst that would happen is people would restart the key. If the key would be lost anyways, what’s the problem? In addition, to prevent abuse, Place a 24 hour debuff on the player. Completing the dungeon will remove it. Otherwise, they’ll have a 24 hours that says “Left a Mythic Keystone dungeon prior to completion.”

It doesn’t lock the player from anything. It’s just a red flag to others.

Player who were unable to finish the dungeon will still be hit. But finishing any keystone would remove that debuff.

This is the best solution. Also make a drop down option to lower the key at the dungeon start to any level below the current key level.

The only thing I would add to this is that I think there should be a limit on attempts. Like you get 2-3 attempts per key before it downgrades to 1 level below. That way people don’t reset 100 times trying to get the perfect first pull.

That player leaving because you guys did not complete in time is totally valid.

This too. Why would you invite someone who has done 17s and 18s in time to your 14 and expect him to stay for a completion run? This is as much your fault as the person who left.

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But what if that person leaving is part of the reason they didn’t make time? We went into a +9 and because we didn’t go the way the pug healer wanted at the beginning she fought us have the way before we even got to the first boss.

“Well if you are going that way I am not healing you” so she left we took a hit to the key and ran again and made time going the way we went.

I am not for some of the punishments people are asking for I may agree with some but in the end I feel there should be a counter so we can see how many times a person left a key run before it ended.

Also if you advertise your group as a “pushing key” group and don’t complete it in time then It is totally logical for someone to leave.

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Doesnt matter. So you’ve encountered a bad player, so what? -1 the key and run it.

umm we did, you did read that part didn’t you?

I’m curious, what was the dungeon and which path proved so controversial?

Atal’dazar and we wen’t left

To be fair, that is a very sub-optimal route. Can’t really blame the healer for leaving when the group is intentionally being inefficient.

Your right she doesn’t want to be there that is ok with us, I am not arguing that people don’t have the right to leave. I only am asking that there be a counter so when looking for applicants for a run we can see how many times they have left a key run.

for example

I look at possible candidates I see some someone that has left a key twice this week I can say well he probably got into a bad grp or had an emergency understandable…then i see a guy who has left 10 times well he could be a potential problem…

I don’t think that is too much to ask.

Wouldn’t people just hearth out and log off instead of leaving the group then? I feel like there are many work arounds that would leave you with be same issues.