“No matter what they try” looks an awful lot like copy-pasting Timeless Isle with a few tweaks ad nauseum. Simplest way I can put it is the game needs to innovate new/exciting content to engage players. Last time we saw this was Legion, with WQs and Invasions, which were generally well received. Much like how daily quests were well received in TBC. Much like how Timeless Isle was well received in MoP.
I think WoW (and the playerbase) falls into the trap of thinking there is going to be some sort of content design that can just be repeated endlessly and never lose appeal, but that’s just not how humans tend to work. Game design needs to be an ongoing, evolving process, rather than slapping a new coat of paint on the same hamster wheels repeatedly and hoping it’s good enough (or worse, obligating players to use the hamster wheels even when it’s not good enough with grinds/rewards/power progression).
If annoying terrain puzzles with weird collision frames are made irrelevant, so be it.
I still quite enjoy the view and spotting elusive nodes below or treasures that don’t appear on the minimap from above.
In a few weeks, none of the mobs in ZM will be dangerous to us at all. Does that not also make it more or less irrelevant? The only obstacle that would remain is literally just the terrain… which is the laziest obstacle to create.
I also really quite like watching a rare spawn and a fleet of players flying over.
It wasn’t fundamentally different. The Maw was the same formula, but harder to navigate and with more arbitrary restrictions on how long you could spend doing said content (like no mount, Eye of the Jailer). It took what players disliked about Argus and made it even worse.
I think Eye of the Jailer encouraged absolutely terrible player behavior and harmed cooperative gameplay. Helping someone in the Maw only ran up the meter, which encouraged you to not help others, and then, if you did help others, for them to leave you holding the bag so they didn’t run up their own meters. The net effect was very bad and I think the Maw-induced selfishness lingers into ZM.
The general sense I get from most of GD is “I’m only happy when I can quit WoW”
They do lose their meaning if they stop posing as a barrier to us, that’s literally how it works. WoW is a game you play. Things have meaning in relation to us interacting with them. As soon as you stop interacting with them, they no longer exist. Flying deletes the open world. You cannot be pro-open world and pro-flying in a sense, pro-flying means you hate the open world gameplay and only want to suck the rewards out of it, whether they are pets, mounts, or toys. These people don’t play for fun, they play to check boxes on a list.
Yup. The absolute worst, most annoying argument when it comes to flying is “I’ve flown before, why can’t I fly now?”. The fact that people think that’s a valid argument is one of the biggest mistakes of adding flying in the first place.
I honestly had the same feeling as the OP yesterday. I was actually taking some time, trying to find the treasures and explore with my ZM cypher boots before flying (I ain’t a warlock or a vampire). Was having fun with it.
Flying 100% makes things easier and saves time, but I’d be lying to say it isn’t a little bittersweet.
Good question. I have no concrete suggestions but perhaps another layer of quests/story/stuff that is only accessible by flight (as opposed to that silly jumping nonsense for ZM treasures).
Not simply locations that are there for the sake of being there. That I agree is boring. It would make the area more three-dimensional, almost like a zone above the ground zone, so to speak.
i agree. this is why i’ve always advocated against flying being brought to new areas. sure it’s nice, convenient, and all, but people don’t seem to realize how it kills the emersion of the game. once flying starts, the game seems to go back to solocraft. players helping strangers was nice. wpvp was actually pretty fun. grouping for rares then all making the trek almost seemed “vanilla-like”.
Honestly, the zones should be developed with flying in mind. Anymore, the developers are designing zones that have weird cliffs, edges, invisible walls, and holes.
No joke, I had to hearth out of a hole in Zereth Mortis the other day because Door of Shadows wouldn’t land on a surface to get me out of it. Why in the Hell is there a hole like that anywhere in the terrain, other than whoever placed it didn’t test it thoroughly like they should have. And that’s not a one off. Luckily, the other ones I fell in because of a weird edge I could DoS myself out. Had I not DoS, it would have been another hearth for me.
That’s bad level design.
And why did we have to wait for flying? What did we really gain by having to wait. Access to a few chests and one rare? The entire reason we’re out here now is to farm rep for our double legendary. That comes next week. After that, who’s going to come out here besides alts than need some quick gearing? Maybe mount and pet farmers?
All relevance of the zone will be lost when your characters get their double legendary, besides just getting to the raid.
That’s a chasm with no way to cross beside flying over. If that’s designed for flying then every single zone could be tagged as such. Just remove the path up the mountain and bam, designed for flying. That’s lazy.
Bliz made flying a problem and they can unmake it at will.
Flying should be the exact same except needing to reach level 30 for slow flying and 40 for fast flying unlock if you buy that.
everything in game should take into account that level 30 and up players not only have ground mounts, but also flying and other modes of basic getting around.
and one side thought. Imagine if bliz announced that one could only rp walk until gaining an achievement you could run, or ride ground mounts or similar hoops to jump through? same same as flying vindictive time gates for stuff and calling that time gating content?
