395/400 Item Level Emissaries: Yes please

What problem is that? The problem of people disagreeing with you, citing actual evidence for their points , you not agreeing with them, choosing to be a victim and attack them, getting it thrown back at you and being unable to reap what you sow?

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Great. Another reason to quit.

Why? If it was like this at the release of BoD it would have discredited a lot of the content of the season 2 patch.

Azerite available at Heroic raid level, Emissary rewards higher than Normal raid rewards, almost equivalent to M+10 rewards (and equivalent or higher than +9 and below)

I won’t even go into details about PvP where the new rewards make anything below 2100 rating irrelevant.

I’m curious to know how this would have been better released months ago when season 2 began.

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Look man. Maybe just take a break from the forums and don’t let forum interactions dictate if you are going to play the game or not.

If you don’t like the game, then don’t play it.

But quitting because people on the forums that you will never meet in game? There are ways to get around that.

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It’s actually the case for AGI and STR based classes as well, it’s a fallacy that raid gear is any better than world or dungeon gear outside of base ilvl. It all depends on itemisation which varies per class, and with limited options but an aim for coverage quite often only 1-2 pieces will be optimal for you. M+ offers more variance which in general means more “better” options.

The issue is with how quick ilvl increases from fresh 120 having ~280 ilvl to current content ~390-405 ilvl (for a normal player not heroic/M+ player).
Stats interact and scale in a multiplicative manner, they devalue (outside of exceptions) themselves whilst increasing the value of others, generally speaking.
So whilst the intent was great that having a larger stat allocation to primary increases the value of the piece, you get to the stage where the primary is so high that having an additional 40 isn’t going to matter as much as having say an additional 1% crit which multiplies the value of the entire stat.

It’s why gem sockets scale in value relative to average item level. The more stats you have to improve with your secondaries the more valuable those secondaries become.

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The Warrior Discord (only using as an example since you are posting on a Warrior) has 18,000 people online right now. At almost midnight. On a weekday. The resources are out there. You just have to look a little bit.

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Which is why I wish they’d go back to sockets on gear like MOP rather than “Hey I raid every week and do several m+'s and have one socket but my buddy plays far less and has 7.”

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I’m not saying that the opinion of this being “bad” is wrong; I’ve said that already - therefore I’m not ignoring people that believe that.

I’m just calling out a perspective that feeds into that feeling, and another perspective that completely negates that negative feeling.

Play for fun and to kill big monsters - and you’ll be happy that there are lots of players geared enough to recruit and kill said monsters with.

Play for numbers - and be forever disappointed because someone else is always going to get gear before you doing lesser content, that does horrible dps and always dies to mechanics, and then it all means nothing when the next tier/expac rolls around.

Certainly, that’s law #1 of MMO’s. But my point is you don’t have to then give those people even more gear for basically nothing. Catch-up gear = fine, catch-up gear that makes current LFR and normal BFD’A utterly irrelevant =/= fine.

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I felt like the forums were a final plea.

That if Elitism doesn’t die, then the game will. I don’t want to invest in a game that relies on esports.

Before WOD and the esports, there was bliss. Cata was the least bad “bad” expansion, and I loved Wrath/MOP.

If I am going to jump-start the game or anything else again, I need a psychiatrist. Because basing a semi-permanent solution, unsubbing, to a hopefully temporary problem, that being Elitism, I feel is my final recourse and only path considering the state that BFA is in regarding nearly everything.

Correct. My Hunter with almost 1700 Mastery STILL has Mastery as #1 stat priority at like a 3 compared to Agi (3 to 2.4 respectively). My stat above Agi is Haste at 2.75. So even at a WORST case scenario, my lowest secondary is still worth 14.5% more than main stat.

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Yeah. Those were dailies dungeons. It wan’t a big deal, but the raid sources were a better source, and the main source as well. You had to spend a year to get Frost Emblem geared if you ONLY did Heroic dungeon dailies. And you couldn’t miss a day, or else you missed out. From this, you really earned it because it took a long time to acquire.

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Its lvl 400 gear. That will RNG spawn once or twice a week. It doesn’t invalidate heroic raiding. It gives players gear so that they can kill bosses they previously have not been able to.

If someone is actually salty about 400 gear, at this point, then they have bigger problems.

The MAU folks would have loved Emblems/JP/VP to fill in the RNG holes.

Even 2 pieces of gear is about the same you would get from a full clear of heroic. Just full cleared the raid on my shaman. 1 piece of gear. Nine bosses.

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Ok, in the spirit of being completely honest and not in any way trying to troll you, it sounds like you have bigger issues than this game and that taking a break is something you dearly need.

Having said that, there are some serious flaws in your reasoning:

  1. Elitism is never going away. Never. It’s neither unique to this game, nor a temporary ailment you rub a cream on or pop a pill for.
  2. Labeling anyone who disagrees with you an elitist (aka the gaming version of the SJW calling people haters) neither strengthens your position nor makes theirs weaker. In fact, it’s rather arrogant on your part to assume that you’re 100% correct and they are 100% incorrect. As if there is no middle ground and you’re the authority on the subject.
  3. People have been claiming “WOW is dying” since BC. It’s almost 15. Elitism isn’t killing WOW, WOW is killing WOW. Sure elitism sucks, but let’s not pretend that there weren’t elitists back in the days of 12m subs.
  4. I wouldn’t say there was anything close to “bliss” pre-WOD. People had issues with Cata, issues with MOP and some will even argue that the introduction of group finder in Wrath was the start of the “downfall.”
  5. If you are that traumatized by the WOW forums, I’m truly sorry, but that’s a clear sign you do need a break. People can be jerks for sure, but let’s not pretend that you’ve been super nice to people either. Which leads me to…
  6. As has been said, if you’re gonna dish it out, you have to be able to take it. When you call people names/use terms like “elitist” for those with opposing viewpoints, it doesn’t make them predisposed to being nice to you. In fact, you alienate far more people than you probably intend to and you do a disservice to those truly experiencing elitism. Think “The Boy Who Cried Wolf.”

TLDR you can’t attack those with differing viewpoints and call them elitists simply because they disagree with you and expect to make it away unscathed. It’s the nature of the internet.

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What people are trying to explain to you is that this has been the easiest period in WoW’s history to get great ilvl gear.

Does the best gear come from the hardest content? Yes. And it should remain that way.

But consider starting tomorrow, you can get 400 ilvl gear solo. Where mythic raiding only gets you 415 gear.

WoW does not rely on esports. it bends over backwards to give the casual player all the gear it possibly can.

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It’s not for nothing - it’s to help the community have a better pool of players to recruit/pug from.

Whether or not it’s “fine” is a matter of opinion.

Yours obviously differs from Blizzard’s which also differs from mine.

There’s nothing right or wrong about it - it’s just a matter of opinion.

People want a reason to log in and play.

If you play “Just for fun,” you are competing with all the other “just for fun” games. Being able to play for something gives a sense of purpose to their time. If the reward systems are such as it devalues that sense of purpose, you will likely lose players with that mindset. (Most of my friends moved on specifically because the endgame is boring. It stagnates.)

I might play Overwatch a couple hours every week, but I’m playing to get back into Diamond. I have fun, I also don’t have fun. But I feel like I’m spending my time trying to earn something. With WoW, I bashed my head against Heroic. (Former Top10, I have personal expectations.) With that said, progression is progression. After putting forward all that effort, to know that my rewards are now on par with daily quests makes me really dislike how I spent my time earlier.

After all, along with 15+ other people, we spent a lot of time working towards a goal, slowly creeping our way to the finish line. Now…mid-tier, all that work we did effectively feels wasted.

I have no issues with boosting up item levels. But to do it mid-tier…no. I’m not okay with it.

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Better gear doesn’t make the pool better to recruit from. Its why people with 400+ ilvl complain about RaiderIO and their inability to get into higher m+.

If you rely on recruiting 400+ ilvl people for your heroic raid, you are just looking for a carry/unchallenging run.

Experience matters more than gear. Throwing gear at people that is above their experience level is giving people a misplaced idea of how “good” they are. People feel they are good enough for mythic raiding and +10s based on their gear. But they don’t have the experience.

If you focus on the experience, the gear will come.

People are complaining about not being able to get in +10s due to RaiderIO when they havent done a 6…7…8 whatever. They don’t want to do the 6s, 7s, 8s because they outgear it and they get nothing in return.

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