Congrats, you just made boosting the meta instead of killing it

WoW: Forever World of Warcraft: Forever General Discussion
1

I’ve always leveled by mixing dungeon runs with questing. A few runs a day, quest for a bit, back to dungeons. That’s how I’ve played since Classic, and it’s part of why I keep coming back. This XP nerf to dungeon mobs is extremely heart breaking.

Here’s my problem: you nerfed the reward for playing correctly and left the exploit wide open.

Think about what you just incentivized. A level 60 preps a stack of shareable dungeon quests, runs a group through back to back, and everyone walks out with huge one time quest XP while barely touching the trash. Meanwhile my actual group.. tank, healer, three DPS, all around the same level, doing it the “right” way is getting scraps per kill. If the quest XP is the real reward either way, why would anyone bother forming a normal group when a booster gets you there faster with zero effort? You didn’t kill boosting, you just made it the efficient choice instead of the lazy one.

And this is going to get worse, not better. Right now everyone’s going to be leveling together so groups are easy to find. But in two or three months after launch, when people start rolling alts, finding a tank and healer for your level range is going to take 30-45 minutes, if you find one at all. At that point “pay/ask a 60 to blast me through for the quest” isn’t even a shortcut anymore, it’s just the obvious move. You’re setting up alt leveling to be miserable specifically in the scenario where boosting looks the most attractive.

Then there’s the actual risk/reward of running these things properly. A real dungeon run means wipes, repair bills, and a chance nothing even drops for you. That’s always been fine because the mob XP made the grind worth it even on a bad run. Take that away and a rough run is now: paid repairs, wasted time, no gear, and next to no XP. What’s the upside of doing it legitimately at that point?

If the goal is getting people into the open world, fine, but gutting mob XP isn’t the way to do it. Put a lockout on repeat dungeon clears if you’re worried about grinding. Don’t just make five person coordinated effort worth less than following a booster around.

14 Likes
2

I have a feeling, with the way XP works, this would probably get you to…35. Maybe 40.

2 Likes
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Lvling your alt won’t be that bad lol, the legacy system gonna keep people playing. Everyone just dooming about not being able to spam one dung over n over

10 Likes
4

putting a lock out on dungeons, which are primarily for gear upgrades is a bad idea.

7 Likes
5

Not sure why there are certain people that I actively notice repeatedly treating this game while even in its beta state to be absolutely perfect. Has me thinking Blizzard employees and shills are really trying hard to derail players with legitimate complaints to think that they are wrong and that everything’s alright, lol.

4 Likes
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Im not sure why you think your way of playing is the “correct way” but never mind that. Boosters don’t make money by running people through a dungeon once. They make money when the same person pays over and over again. Yes, a person could still pay a lvl 60 to take them on a quest run, but thats a 1 time thing. Repeat customers is what keeps any buisness afloat.

4 Likes
7

Isn’t the obvious fix for this to make dungeon crawling give you 100 times XP, so you run ONE dungeon with your friends and gain 12 levels?

Yes, that way all the crying would stop and you could get to level 60 in 8 minutes and start ruining the experience of exploring the game/world/endgame content/crafting/pvp/etc. for every other player.

Fix provided. Make each dungeon mob grant 1 level worth of XP.

4 Likes
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Yes, it’s a short-sighted solution and punishes those who just play the game regularly.

7 Likes
9

The question is why do you run a dungeon, for the XP, for the lore, or for the items.

I figured you would run them multiple times to farm the item that you want, in which case your proposed lock out is hurting those trying to gear out their toons.

If the intended purpose is to complete the quests, well, they can hire any tank they want with incentives to help if they are looking for a tank that views the content as being trivial and costing their time.

my understanding is that the boosting was occuring from groups that would run the dungeon multiple times with no intended loot objective or quest turn ins, but just to grind the monsters that provided more xp before the change.

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Meanwhile my actual group.. tank, healer, three DPS, all around the same level, doing it the “right” way is getting scraps per kill

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Correct me if i am wrong, but the other group is also getting scraps per kill. Only the quest[s] now that provides the major XP incentive to run the dungeon if you are not there farming for loot. there is also likely a level discrepancy penalty for having such a high player in the group kill things too. [ i think i recall getting less xp when grouped with a much higher player, but it was a long time ago so odds are i am wrong ]

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A real dungeon run means wipes, repair bills, and a chance nothing even drops for you.

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In classic, an items was always set to drop, if i remember right. a bad tank will miss some taunts and those they are carrying through the dungeon will still encounter those deaths and accompanying repair bills.

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Have you been playing the beta? The amount of exp gained from dungeon quests is absolutely insane. We also have to remember that they’ve already added more leveling dungeons and plan to continue doing so in the future. The system as is is clearly counterintuitive to the proposed reason for the change. People are already skipping the Barrens entirely on beta by running 2-3 dungeons. The problem Blizzard was trying to solve has been made worse, not better.

5 Likes
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1-20 as always been fast.

We have no idea how 20-30 will scale, nor 30-60.

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The boosters wouldn’t be running a 1 dungeon service. They would be running multiple dungeons of quests.

Lets lay it out:

The booster has a few alts who have the various dungeon quests in their logs and since quest sharing is global (even if they change this there are work arounds) they can share the quests with the boosted. The Booster uses a warlock summoning service, mage portal/teleport service, etc to bring the Boosted to the first dungeon. Quickly clears said dungeon, ports the player to the major cities/areas required to hand in the quests then rinse repeat for the next number of dungeons they are running.

While overall this is certainly more steps than running people through the same dungeon over and over, we are seeing on beta the exp gained from these quests is staggering and incredibly overtuned. Boosters will be able to skyrocket players up in levels and it will only get worse as Blizzard adds more leveling dungeons over time.

Blizzard made these changes to stop boosting and prevent people from living in dungeons leveling. This “fix” makes both issues worse. Players on beta are skipping the Barrens entirely by running 2-3 dungeons. The intended fix doesn’t work, plan and simple.

2 Likes
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So i’m going to assume you haven’t played the beta and are just going off “vibes”. There is a reason so many people are bringing this up as a concern. It also literally just worsens the issue Blizzard was trying to fix by implementing these changes.

3 Likes
14

I am playing the beta, I just have not gone to any dungeons yet. I am level 14 and just left Zephras.

From all accounts, players were already 12-14 by the time the left the starting zones, so that right there is something to acccount for.

Next, we know that the level cap is only 20. That is 6-8 levels in the 1-20 range.

Furthermore, we know that the amount of XP needed to level increases as the range does. 1-20 does not have the same amount of XP that 30-40 does.

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So you have no reference on a discussion you are joining in on. We have plenty of people showing that you can literally skip the Barrens entirely. What was historically a long-lasting leveling zone filled with quests, having players of various levels can just be ignored because of the dungeon quest EXP changes. Blizzard stated they wanted players out in the world questing, but this change is counterproductive to that and it’s even easier and less time consuming than dungeon grinding was in the past.

The point people are trying to make is that the fix clearly doesn’t work, and even if it lessens in later levels, what about 5 years from now when they’ve added even more leveling dungeons?

From the Horde perspective they have added 5 dungeons (this doesn’t include HoT) available from levels 15-40. Players can run RFC, RoL, WC, SFK, BFD, RFK, Excavation, Dalaran, Gnomer, RFK, SM, RFD The Drowned City and Krol’dok all in that range.

They went from 8 to 13 dungeons in that leveling range, over a 50% increase.

Yes, we don’t know 100% since we are locked at 20, we’ll have a better idea at 30, but the fact that already people are skipping the Barrens entirely means Blizzard’s “fix” isn’t working as intended. Based on what we are seeing so far in beta, I wouldn’t be surprised if a Horde character at level 12 could run RFC → RoL → WC → SFK → Excavation → BFD → Dalaran → Gnomer → RFK → SM GY and be level 30, or close to with minimal questing in between.

Blizzard didn’t want people sitting in dungeons leveling, but guess what, their change doesn’t fix that.

Also, because it’s beta, this is the time we should be bringing this up no? Why would we wait for launch and “see how it goes” when all the evidence we currently have says it’s a big problem?

7 Likes
16

that’s a real point and I’ll give you that one time quest runs don’t build the same business model as infinite grinding did. But the customer doesn’t have to be the same character twice. It’s every alt, every friend’s alt, every guildie who wants their quests done fast. That’s still a repeatable service, it’s just volume based instead of loyalty based. Different business, same incentive to exist.

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Logistics of that would be insane. Many quests also require prequests for them.

It will definitely be possible to skip a good amount of levels like this, but it won’t get you to 60 and it will definitely not be as easy and convenient as dungeon trash meat grinder.

18

The approach to solving the problem was wrong.

The shortage of T/Healer, it doesn’t matter how you change the dungeons.

I would like say the most T/Healers have a fixed team, they only go to LFG to find people when their friends are not online.

The only way to solve the T/Healer shortage is to make the T/Healer feel that to the dungeons is easy and doesn’t waste time, otherwise, they will just go for the rest xp.

Not to comment what right or what wrong, most people will look for shortcuts to take, especially those with resources/powers.

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it’s an easy fix. nerf the quest exp :expressionless_face: it’s way too high

2 Likes
20

They need to not have all the quests collectable at the dungeon. Give people a reason to do some longer chains and to rerun a dungeon if they missed a quest