Warrior Rage generation has been normalized in Forever, no longer scaling based on damage done. Instead, it’s a pretty straightforward formula based on weapon attack speed in order to keep it consistent. That’s completely fine, and honestly even necessary to rein in the traditional Warrior dominance in the endgame.
However, auto-attacks no longer generate extra rage on crit.
This is a problem. It makes rage generation much more flat, akin to energy on a swing timer. It makes the gameplay predictable and frankly boring. It also makes the new Boundless Rage talent seem as though it will be practically worthless, since you won’t have bursts of unexpected generation to warrant the increased cap.
The formula is based on base weapon speed, so each weapon varies slightly, but for 1hrs it’s around 7-9 rage every 2-3 seconds, while most 2hrs are around 14-17 rage every 3-4 seconds.
Most offensive abilities cost 15, 20, or 30 rage, so you can see where the lack of periodic bursts results in sitting on your hands.
The formula is very similar to Cataclysm, in which crits generated double rage, serving as punctuation and a soft form of scaling. It’s the moment where you get to press an ability and queue a Heroic Strike.
Consider the classic combination of using Sweeping Strikes and Whirlwind together - the combination costs 55 rage. That’s 4 autos or roughly 10 seconds worth of auto attacks to press two buttons.
Normalization is good. Removing all punctuation and excitement, to the point that the gameplay becomes auto-attack simulator, is not. Maybe there’s a hidden passive at level 60 that shakes things up, but what we’ve seen so far is not promising, just slower and less exciting.
This is further compounded by the fact that Warriors have seen very little improvement to the biggest issues over the past 20 years: namely a horrendously painful leveling experience and planning their entire gameplay sessions around a 30-minute cooldown, two issues which have already been solved repeatedly in several other versions of the game.
It’s a very large change for what should be classic content.
I remain to be convinced that a fury warrior without world buffs and with nerfed BT/Flurry is actually too powerful compared to a lot of the buffed specs.
I think in order to keep the feeling of classic warrior they should lean into balancing around having full rage, potentially nerfing impale is another lever.
Regardless of what happens, low level rage feels way worse than in classic and getting a weapon upgrade also feels a lot worse. Getting a Cruel Barb or a Smite’s Mighty Hammer was amazing for ~5 levels and that feeling is a lot more muted.
I think they need to ask themselves if these changes actually make the game more fun, and I really don’t think this one does.
Anyone thinking Warrior wasn’t gonna get reigned in was delusional, but…holy crap! lol
This gameplay is anemic, boring, and NOT FUN. Like whatever man you gotta make changes to balance the game, but warrior just looks AND plays awfully at the moment.
Every other spec in the game got some cool new stuff. Warrior got a near worthless victory rush and a complete gutting of rage that doesn’t let us hit buttons.
Rage management and responding to spikes kinda feel like entire of gig of warrior of classic through lich king and with this low normalization, complete removal of crit scaling what are we supposed to engage with? We’ll barely be able to keep MS/BT on cooldown.
Another concern is the only real rage dumb ability for many levels is heroic strike which in and of itself is fine, but the issue is the ability is additive to your next auto attack. Which means that specific auto attack generates zero rage, from what I observe, I could be wrong. Your only real ability to use at low level cost rage and prevents you from gaining more rage, thus why on earth would I ever want to use it and generates tons of additional threat, means never want to use if not tank, so are only abilities to use, MS/BT and slam on 15 sec CD with 1.5 cast (cast time on melee ability why) it is dumb was always dumb and was happy it was removed but I also know it won’t change and I’ll get hate for saying it should so I won’t.
Anyways the none tanking warrior kits need a bit of love. Not like major over-halls of course just slight adjustments would work I believe.
Agree. Even tanking without the level 20 prot talent (master of defense) is miserable. I generate no rage and spend a lot of time just watching myself auto attack. God forbid my auto attack gets dodged, parried, or misses, or I get disarmed.
A paladin at level 4 is more engaging gameplay than a warrior at level 20. Warrior right now is 100% auto-attack simulator. It does look like it will get better by 30, but the current state of warrior is going to push a lot of people away.
I personally think Melee dps are more focused torwards Overtime Bleeds etc damage then Crits. And casters are more about crits now. Melee will be doing super good DPS mark my words. leveled warrior to 20 in Forever and the new rage feels great honestly feels smoother more predictable then just Stacking Crit to faceroll smash buttons to Dump all rage… me personally feel less Rage starved with the New Rage changes. Also keep in mind lvl 40++ is when warrior will really open up, i think warriors are going to be a Force to Recon with!@
They even mention it in Beta issues list that Heroic Strike and Auto attack que etc which skews rage.. so just wait they are fixing it!! its already listed. Warriors gonna rock believe me… you think they going to leave warriors like that ? no way the historical iconic strong class will be not as strong. (“Queueing an On-Next Attack ability (Heroic Strike/Cleave/Raptor Strike) disables your spell queue window.”) and that screws rage GEN.. they fixing it.
Spell queue is about queueing up a new ability, which has no impact on rage whatsoever.
I want to be very clear. This thread and these complaints are not about power.
you can have the most boring 1 button rotation in the game and it can be powerful,
or you can have the most engaging rotation that is pitifully weak.
Tuning is ephemeral, and I couldn’t care less about it. My feedback is focused on engaging gameplay, and waiting for three 2h auto-attack swings just so you can press Mortal Strike once every 6 seconds isn’t it.
Planning my entire raid night around a 30-minute cooldown isn’t it.
Nobody should be expecting complete retail gameplay, but comparing the gameplay improvements to Retribution, Enhancement, and Survival to Arms or Fury is absolute night and day.
Unfortunately it seems like-- at least for Arms is that you’re basically going to only be pressing Overpower from your rend procs because you won’t have enough rage to do anything else.
But hey, people will continue to say ‘Warriors had their time to shine!’ to justify a playstyle that feels like you’re trapped in quicksand. ‘Just reroll!’
Let them burn. “oh a leather chest that’s on my bis list? I’ll need that.” People who play dps warrior only care about trying to minmax, have zero personality and no class identity and 99.99% of them following bis lists are gray parse. Remove from game plz.
Really nervous Blizz will be slow to fix this extremely heavy handed nerf. Warriors are brutal enough to level but not even be viable at endgame?? this isnt classic, what happen to light changes.
Amusingly I think most players saw relatively small changes and nerfs to the warrior talent trees and thought “yeah that sounds about right, they were already in a good place with their vanilla rotation”.
And now Blizzard has gutted rage gen, which is likely to either need to be fixed, or much bigger adjustments to the class will be needed.
I think they should balance the class around having a lot of rage (which means nerfing damage as required) and then potentially buff early game rage gen if early warriors are hit too hard by the damage nerfs.
At the end of the day I think this design makes the game less fun and wasn’t actually required, as there are really limited returns from excess rage beyond a certain point.
Edit: I also think it’s very strange to remove itemisation choices from resource generation when that is very prevalent for healers and mana users with spirit/int/mp5.
It is fun to get more rage when you get a sick new weapon, and makes you seek out weapon upgrades along your levelling journey.
I think none of you have played a low level, non-twinked out warrior in a very long time lmfao. You are level 20!!
I am level 20 arms, and im having a blast, if you are arms, use your rend( it crits now! did you know that!?), turn on the swing timer and weave in slam with your weapon swing, and cleave/hs targets.
The changes are fine, jesus christ explore a little.
So if we currently get 4.5 rage per second with a 2h, regardless of the strike damage, what exactly makes you think that will increase as we get higher level?
How’s that going to work out when we get Sweeping Strikes or Mortal Strike?
Build up rage on a mob, you will get close to 100 rage in 4 hits in forever, with a 3.00 speed weapon mind you, which isn’t even slow ( slower weapons generate more rage).
for sweeping strikes, you generate rage on 1 mob, then pop it in the next fight when theres two mobs or more.
I don’t know what they have in store for Arms, but fury is looking like a rage generating monster.
Arms is going to be fine as well, you just have to think outside the box now and not…
big numbers = big rage zug brain.
This is all without seeing what they have in store for us with itemization and gear sets either.
If you get a change in you’ll get 9 rage (if you don’t have imp charge, then its 15 rage to start) , and then any damage you take ads a point or two here and there, and then theres bloodrage on a 1 minute cool-down.
There’s definitely some interactiveness to get your rage up to keep the gameplay fun, even at level 20
yeah for pve you don’t really use Mortal strike unless its a boss fight but who knows what that will look like by the time we unlock mortal strike at level 40.
