Those clowns were people who abused the system. The system was changed to help deal with that abuse.
Im sorry but making tweaks to make the game better is something they do nearly every tuesday morning. Making a change to reduce abuse of the vote kick is just common sense.
But if 4/5 members of the group want to finish the key after the timer has reached 0, then someone should not be punished for leaving?
I refer you to what I already answered:
Grievous week. They were probably chain pulling without watching their debuff, or helping clear it in between pills by eating/off healing.
OP, if the healers struggling… Help. Eat as soon as you’re out of combat, heal yourself or others.
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So make an entire big system and make stuff more complicated…why?
I would rather face the additional risk of having groups that aren’t going well fall apart more easily or the very rare grief quit than go back to the days of refusing to heal tanks until an issue is resolved. Those were dark times and I don’t want to return to them.
Ok, so if I go make a sandwich and come back when the time has reached zero, I will not be punished.
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You should, and will, be reported, like any other greifer in the game. No matter what, it seems like you’re trying to find scapegoats out of preventing folks from committing to events they join for.
So I can troll by initiating a vote abandon and it will pass because everyone “smashes that yes button”
Epic
Doesn’t sound like you have ran higher Mythic+s before because with the 3 extra stuff for the key, there is plenty of AOE damage going out that isn’t always avoidable and it does a good deal of damage. Not only that, the damage output is a lot higher so yeah, it does take a semi skilled healer to keep up on 10+ mythics.
Not saying the OP is right or that they weren’t standing in stuff, but 10+ mythics there is a lot of unavoidable damage that can go out.
But that’s aggravated griefing at worst. If you set up a system that locks people into a no-win situation they’re going to start acting out. Which honestly seems like more drama than what we have now. It’s grievous week and I’ve only had like two groups fall apart on me this week and realistically one of them definitely needed to.
Nah. You should only get the debuff if you leave or are afk when you’re kicked. The way it is now makes very little sense.
Coming from someone that is practically never kicked from anything.
Don’t join something you’re not committed to finishing. Don’t see what’s so hard about that. If the group is going to fail, then once time runs out, or just call a vote to leave, leave once time runs over.
Mythic+ is the equivalent of ranked play in other games without the consequence of the penalties of every ranked game out there. You should be penalized for botching the teams run, prior to a vote being called or time running out.
I do not see how anything I’ve said has to do with scapegoating.
Also, your proposed system forces players to commit to events they did not join for. If a player says he just wants to push, and everyone agrees they just want to push, then your system only works if three of those five people stick to their commitment. So, we now have a system designed to force people to stick to their commitments which can be used to threaten people with either sanctions or being reported if other people do not stick to theirs.
I wanna be clear here… YOU got removed. Not once. Not twice. THREE times. Maybe, and im just thinking out loud here, MAYBE you should consider what the common thread is and work on getting better.
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Time to move on OP from this and play another game, I did… not looking back. Sub runs out very soon. cheers
Would it be nice if every group worked out? Yeah. Have I had groups I fell apart too quickly? Yeah. Do I think that locking WoW players into a cage and then telling them to be nice to each other is going to work out? No.
If someone doesn’t want to be in a group they’re not going to try as hard and that’s just going to make the whole thing worse. Better to rip it off like a bandaid. If you tell them that the first person to leave is going to be the one to suck the fat debuff we all know what they’re going to do.
Sure, you can report them for griefing and they might get punished. But what did you gain from this? Instead of them just leaving you’ve wasted more time and suffered more than you needed to.
Let me lay it out in a fullbroad example, as the system would work nearly just fine.
- I create a push group. The goal is to time
- Everyone in the group agrees that the goal is to time before starting
- We end up making 1 bad move, costing the run or possibly cutting it extremely close on time
- 1 person wants to leave, from that 1 bad pull, and yes these type of people exist. Person initiates vote to leave
Done deal. If 3 of 5 vote no, to calling it as there’s still a chance on time, then if that individual leaves, they should be penalized. 3 of 5 is extremely lenient with 60% party favor over most games requiring 80%, 4 of 5.
Every system has its downsides though. Say there’s 15 minutes left and you’re only just now downing the 2nd boss. There’s no way you’ll time it but the party is holding you hostage. Unfortunately, there’s some people out there like that but that’s a minority. Of course you hear about them in MOBAs but those folks are not the majority.
If you want a safe haven, the system can be passive and you only have to commit half of the runs time. I don’t like that, as there could be a chance you can recover, if 1 bad pull happens down the road and some nut leaves after the group is back on track, but that’s also an option as well.
We gained 1 less person in a 8 hour window. Over time, this should increase as they get reported more. Could work like Overwatch where you get penalized for an entire season. I don’t agree with banning you from the season or permanently, like Overwatch does it, but you should get flagged as a frequent deserter, so groups know to avoid you. It should be account flagged and not just per character.
There are good ideas and bad ideas, but most common, in my experience, are those ideas that seem to be good but just fail to address their mandate. They are well-meant, but fall short.
Vote/kick exists for a very real set of reasons that organically rose to prevalence though the bad behavior of a number of players.
The idea of vote/kick seems like a good one. It certainly doesn’t seem like a bad idea to give the party in majority the power to address some sole troublemaker.
But what seems like a good idea in this case still falls short of the mark. The good idea still leaves all the power in the hands of some single aggressor who can browbeat, threaten and annoy enough of the players involved to get their petulant way.
Someone with a necessary role and some definite aggression can demand everyone else comply with that popup. If you bring your own second, you don’t even have to push very hard.
But people will hit yes just to keep moving. they will mindlessly hit “yes” just to keep themselves from coming into the crosshairs.
I think most players just want to do the content and move on. they don’t want to argue over party politics or anything at all. A soon as someone starts jumping up and down and pointing at someone else, everyone knows what is coming, and no one wants to take that poor sap’s place. The popup, the click, move along.
Thus, the balance of power still rests in the sweaty hands of whomever wants to cause trouble for someone else.
It is unfortunate that some choose to just ostrich down into “no such thing as a bad vote kick” and “working as intended”. The parrot parade doesn’t really serve to demonstrate the process being fit for purpose but arguing with them is definitely a philosophical dps loss.
And the whole thing is made muddier by the fact that there are occasions wherein vote/kick does good work. there are situations where it is required, and it meets that requirement equitably.
But there are other situations where the system just serves those willing to harm others and who do not care a thing about their party. Bad behavior still rules the party and it even turns the vote/kick system into a personal punishment device.
Vote/kick is a good idea.
But it is a good idea that has failed to keep miscreants from doling out tiny temp bans like an admin and if the goal is to provide stable groups that discourage bad behavior then it could use a little attention.
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They can demand all they want. Only other people can accept those demands.
What you seem to ignore is that people will just start griefing the group, by pulling extra packs or going afk. Those things are not bannable btw, there is nothing that says you can be pulling packs and have to wait for a tank to do it.
Is just better to let them go and 4 man it.