Is there any consideration to giving Holy or Discipline a kick? During Dragonflight beta, the development team expressed that Priest utility was in a good spot without kick. With the 9.2 changes, significant portions of that utility are being nerfed down.
I hear ya buddy. It took me years to get over what they did to shied spam disc. It finally got interesting and I kept hearing people in community talking about how they want to simplify it. They went way to far. They need to leave mind blast alone. I mean how does TE/expiration even work now. If this is what were getting id rather they just make us support. I think once people get over the Initial wow factor of the cooldown were getting. They will realize the spec is a shell of itself
Ultimate Penitence is something the spec very much needed. A+ on that. Light’s wrath was super cool, but it just didn’t fit with how Disc played nowadays and the talent support for it was abysmal which just made penance better than it.
Harsh Discipline change is flat out bad. IDK why they want to return to that design, nothing they said justifies it. Even people who didn’t like the setup that I know, not a single one wanted it to return to RNG.
Scov change mandates the mindbender side which feels bad.
TE is useless unless you don’t take Purge the Wicked which… why would you not?
Light side got a lot cooler, but the rotation seems like it might be pretty boring now, and there’s absolutely nothing to address our damage being kinda terrible.
At the very least, they reduced the giant amount of points we were obligated to spend in the final tier, so that’s a big win.
Will need to test how some of this works. IE: If penance activates inescapable torment, what happens with Ultimate Penitence with a bender out? Does it just go wild? Etc.
Edit: Oh, and atonement boost by 50% in dungeons is GREAT.
Holy priest tier set is stonks for the renew spam style in raid. It’s gonna be pretty good.
Mass dispel and PI nerfs should have come with Silence moving to the general tree IMO.
I agree… or even Shining Force.
Great point. It would be nice to receive some compensation.
From a mediocre M+ perspective
Ok so heal is just a dead spell or what? I’m fine with it but nerf flash heal mana cost by 60% or something.
Random change but whatever
On a good day this hits 3/4 people in M+ so whatever
I mean I never really used these spells for healing, but damage, so ok? Random change. But I won’t mind if they aren’t used anymore I want a button back.
If you want to buff healing, fine, but a better way to do it would be to just nerf incoming damage. Also, prayer of healing costs too much mana and is too weak, it should be stronger on its own to give holy priests an option for decent spammable + reliable aoe healing. Sanctify should spread like Disc’s Luminous Barrier so it is more convenient to use in M+.
Does flash heal get increased for shadow spec too or only disc and holy?
Cuze if no, then it’s nerfed hard in pvp since they removed the pvp buff…
i am a bit confused.
- Symbol of Hope recovers 40 seconds of cooldown for a major defensive ability (was 60 seconds). *
is a huge hit to holy priests in raiding.
i dont think with all the changes renew is worth spamming youll just get the passive from your holy words. which feels bad cuz sanctify hits one less player
ultimate penitence looks cool, and i am excited to try it. so it pains me to say some of the other changes are much less exciting. it makes me wonder how these changes are being decided on.
for example, i think schism should have been combined with shadow covenant. not mind blast. now that mind blast is on such a long cd, we have to alternate the new shadow cov mindbender shadow spells with smite. so its just smite, penance, smite, divine star, smite… nothing.
i think almost everyone would prefer to keep mind blast how it is, with 2 charges. i think the 2nd charge to mind blast was one of the most positive changes the spec has received all dragonflight. so twilight equilibrium gameplay is looking to be much more constricted now, which seems like a huge step backward.
if any spell were to be deleted, i’d say most people would have nominated mindbender instead. it has become more powerful recently since they added essence devourer, but i still don’t know who enjoys that side of teh tree gameplay style. and personally, if you’re going to give me a pet, i want a permanent one who can hold some aggro. but this temporary pet is not exciting, its not even very visible on the field, i think everyone would have cheered if mindbender was deleted, and instead you put a powerful 2-in-1 schism+shadow covenant button down there instead. but otherwise yeah, excited for ult penitence.
not a fan of: sw: death backlash damage changes. tithe evasion changes. power infusion changes (obviously). schism deletion. schism damage amp nerfed (again). divine star rand halo nerfs : (. the pitiful mind blast buff even though its on a hugely longer cd, seems way out of whack. harsh discipline changes (booo, hisss). symbol of hope nerf (just…why?).
stuff i like is the new tier sets, ultimate penitence and its sub-talents. those look interesting, but as happy as i was, once i write it all down, it looks like the negatives far outweigh the positives. sorry about that, i definitely wanted to be happy though. still looking forward to the patch, mostly
It feels like Blizzard is deliberately nerfing Sanctify and Salvation to balance us around the new tier set bonus.
We’ll need to test this out on the PTR, but if assuming you get 2-3 procs a minute then that should make up the extra Holy Words for a faster Salvation reset. Also need to test how the Renew interacts with other talents.
It encourages an Empowered Renew build for raid which I already play. For M+ I have no clue how it’s going to work because I’m not rolling Renews on the entire group 24/7 unless there’s a RoT aura. The dungeons on the M+ pool aren’t rot aura heavy either.
It all comes down to the proc rate.
Idk man. What did we do to the devs i dont understand.
Mind soothe destroyed, mass dispell destroyed, PI destroyed …all utility gutted, still no kick or relevant cc…absolutely nothing in return. No damage nerfs reverted even though we lose tier set. Surge of ins nerf.
Like how the f you should be hyped about the patch…they are still trying to nerf exodia comp by gutting shadow even in new patch where nobody know if it will be good or not.
Just absolutely gut the mass dispell and look for more places where they will apply magic debuffs to ppl. Lovely.
The initial first impression is not looking good at all for sure. I don’t know any healers in or out of my guild who are even excited with the healing changes to begin with. There’s going to be many more changes coming over the last couple of weeks so we just have to see what comes next.
I went on the PTR and tested the Holy Priest set bonus.
- The 2-piece Serenity / Sanctify Renew is treated like a regular Renew and can stack on-top of Renew over the usual 20s limit. I had a 60s Renew rolling on myself at one point.
- Casting Renew on yourself if its over 20s duration won’t extend it. Also, if you trigger the 14s Serenity duration and cast Renew it’ll go to 20s. So it’s better to use it on targets that already has Renew because you can get an instant 24s+ duration.
- The 4-piece free Serenity / Sanctify only works if those Holy Words aren’t on cooldown. It doesn’t instantly reset those abilities. Also the buff lasts until you die.
- The 4-piece proc rate seems pretty high if you’re rolling Renews. I got it to trigger 4 times in a minute. That’s very likely the reason why they made it harder to reset Holy Word Salvation.
Overall my thoughts on the 4-piece is that if you play around its strengths you’re going to generate Holy Words like candy.
idk how many reworks priests are going to get overall, feels endless.
But i darn wish they just fix everything as a whole at once with deep well thought out changes that have received loads of time investment, then this bit by bit rushed out changes that makes no senses at times.
I tested the Disc Priest set bonus.
- 2-piece bonus picks a random Atonement and extends it by 2s.
- 4-piece does as it says: you double Smite your targets when under Shadow Covenant. That means faster Mind Bender reset and also makes the Blaze of Light talent a must pick. The overall double damage is more than Mind Blast per cast.
- 4-piece is pretty strong when combo’d with the Sanctuary talent because it applies the bonus twice.
Overall the 2-piece is meh, but the 4-piece is strong because you can fast reset Mindbender by an extra 10s or more on the cd.
Speaking for M+ Disc: changes look pretty bad and ill-conceived. We are going to feel the loss of Aberrus set very hard, and new set does not compensate in even the slightest regard. Insta-proc Radiance was the only way to deal with the group-burst high mobility combos that were so frequent in S2, and I suspect will become a pain point in S3 as well.
The 4-set is tied to Shadow Cov, and that’s now tied to Mindbender/etc, a long CD. I don’t see this set having the same impact as insta-proc Radiances. Furthermore- it’s just more dps, and if Atonement isn’t in a healthy place (it’s not in raids, and barely acceptable in M+ with the S2 4-set) it won’t be a worthy healing tool.
Harsh Discipline was a personal favorite and I enjoyed the determinant nature of it. It’s what a good rotational passive talent should aspire to be. Changing it to RNG already sounds bad and unreliable, but to attach it to the now nerfed, casted Radiance is going to limit it from being useful in situations where you want it.
Mind Blast is now just Schism by another name. Not useful, not cool. Plays havoc on Twilight Equilibrium. They’ve removed so many of the options for proccing TE, which hurts those who like the complex rotation, but then also disrupted the simplified rotation I prefer (MB->Smite->MB->Smite->Penance). Everyone suffers for this.
Luminous Barrier wasn’t seeing play, so they decide to nerf PW:B instead- not cool. PW:B already has constrictions to justify that meaty damage reduction, nerf the reduction and keep the positioning and timing requirements and you get another non-impactful wet-tissue-feeling group CD.
With the Mass Dispel changes, they had better remove Bursting. And the all-around utility nerfs seem so misaimed- trying to undermine Exodia shadow priests, but the end-around hurts Disc and Holy more, who needed the utility just to keep up with others’ special toys. Reminder, Holy Pallies still have an Invincibility button and Battle Res.
And the things they left untouched or unaddressed:
Aegis of Wrath untouched. Contrition still weak. Train of Thought, weak. The class tree still wracked with throughput vs needed utility binds. Shadow-Atonement half of the tree looks more mandatory than ever. PoM and Renew still lacking any synergies anywhere for us.
I know I had conflicts with the group of Discs who enjoyed the Schism-tree branch, wanted the complex Atonement-focused rotation and so on- I don’t like that style, but I still didn’t wish these kinds of radical changes on them.
I wondered if it was a buff. So if they are on cooldown, when 1 gets off you will immediately have 2 if you have that buff?
I honestly felt much better reading the tier set and feel like it has potential. It could perhaps keep me playing holy actually as I just was worried it was even playable with all of the nerfs.
I didn’t see you made this post about tier sets until now. Thanks for testing these things out!!
Not really happy with any of the changes, but I really don’t understand the harshness of the symbol of hope nerf.
Like, did anyone feel like that was an overpowered utility?
Also, increasing the CD of mass dispel by 4x just feels brutal.
I don’t think we have a ton to be concerned about after messing with it.
The 50% buff to atonement outside raid means you can actually lean more on your atonement healing than you could before. Because of that, you’re generally resetting Bender much faster taking Void Summoner.
TE is pretty useless now, but on the other hand we can take Aegis of Wrath with void summoner AND the ultimate penitence line. We sacrifice Harsh Discipline that way, but Harsh Discipline rework makes it so much less consistent that it honestly doesn’t feel like much of a loss.
I’m seeing pretty significantly increased healing numbers through atonement right now, and our damage is actually pretty good IMO.
The only issue I think is our 4piece, which is… kinda extreme trash. Smiting is generally the last thing we want to be doing in a Scov window, so it’s very weird that the 4set is like 'hey we’ll buff smite there! ’
It also feels very questionable…all these reworks when the expansion is heading to either -its end or - its half way trough. Either way its unbeliveably disrespectful to customers…that they released classes in such state that half of them need rework which take place like 3/4 year after the launch.
I would take some changes rather than no changes.
There is actually no right time for these changes. Someone will always be unhappy.
This is but the FIRST iteration. Changes will come to this.