Overdramatic would be a redundant adjective for forum posting.
I’ve just reinstalled vanilla and have moved on. I’ll never download Reforged, and they’ll never fix the game. So f*** it.
3 Likes
Like every single game requires you to download any dlc content that has updates to the core game included. Only time you are not forced to download it is if it is completely separate, even then you often need to download a large update when the dlc is released. 2010 comp with 2 tb HD so I am not worried but I can see why people playing on their laptops are upset. Then you have to remember that most games are 30gb minimum these days.
Triple A games were a mistake. Please god compress your files.
1 Like
With all due respect, by all means, you pay for his drive then
You’re stuck in the past.
That’s taking “never see or use” out of the context of his complaint though. He’s saying he won’t see or use it because it’s paid DLC that he won’t pay for. Whereas with the classic campaign and multiplayer connectivity, he CAN see and use them without having to buy Reforged. So really only your first comparison applies, and the second only if referring to paid DLC campaigns like the Reforged campaign.
Then go make a separate thread to complain about a 10mb file being too big and see if anyone agrees, because that’s not what the TC or I am claiming. 28 GB is nearly 3000 times bigger than 10 mb and nearly 10 times the size of the original ~3 GB game. It’s not even close to a fair comparison. What you’re essentially saying with that comparison is that size doesn’t matter, no matter how big or small, and that any complaint about file size is equally ridiculous (so long as it fits on the biggest hard drives out there, right?)
Fixed.
But that isn’t how DLC works. When WoW comes out with a new expac, even if I don’t buy said expac, I need to download the content for the game to work. When a shooter comes out with DLC, I need to download it, for the game to work. If we start setting precedents for well “if I don’t see or use it” I don’t need, then I can just apply to the base game and cut its size down. It’s just the way games work now.
Size is a subjective term in this context. If I have 10tbs of hdds, you complaining about 28gbs is laughable. If I have 100gb hdd then yes 28gb is A LOT.
Yes I’m saying that within reason. Before Covid-19, 1 TB hdds were $20 if that. $20. For something that will store 90 of these games. You will in no way ever EVER convince me that 28gbs is too large. (the game folder is actually only 26.3gbs now) If you can’t spend $20 for a hobby over 17 years, you are not the ones that get to dictate size.
Sorry, but this thread is really matters, especially for someone who uses MAC OS to playing war3 like me since I really enjoy playing classic multiplayer and also to serve my work, there’s nothing wrong with this old graphic (before reforged) in my machine. But 30 GB for these graphics you don’t really want, is too much. It’s not about this kind of art is good or not anymore, everything’s very clear right now. Blizz just charges for us 30$ and for nothing, and all the one who read this thread still not refund this game, because they just love this game so much, they could forgive for this terrible failure.
I could say this game very lucky, it has a very strong and loyal community, can live for nearly 20 years, and still survive after being killed by its father. So just do something rightfully
1 Like
Thing is WoW was always like that or since its first expansion, and in MMO’s like that the interaction with other people depends on it to an extent. For example, you need to be able to see when other people get to a higher level or when they obtain gear/items added in an expansion. Same thing for multiplayer shooters if you can play matches with people who are using expansions or DLC. Although I will say that for areas or maps that require buying an expansion or DLC in order to go to and you don’t buy it, then you shouldn’t have to download all the data for that area, until if that expansion or DLC eventually stops being a separate purchase and becomes merged with the base game.
But Warcraft 3 did not work this way for the longest time (or at least, not to the full extent), nor does it really need to. Reforged is just a model/texture pack and Reforged campaign that you can’t see or play without buying Reforged. Reforged may be a separate “release” but it effectively merges with classic Warcraft 3. Just because developers make it so you still have to download it doesn’t mean it’s right.
However in the context of Warcraft 3 like what me and TC are comparing it to, going from 3 GB to 26.3 GB is a HUGE increase. The fact that you need to buy Reforged in order to use most of that data just makes it worse for people who don’t want to buy Reforged. It’s not quite the same thing as a game that was always big and/or has been lumping big DLC in it from the start. And if we’re talking other games, look at Starcraft Remastered. Yes it increased in size, but not nearly as dramatically. You only need 8 GB of space according to the system requirements. They could have went with more detailed graphics that took up far more space, but they didn’t.
Well you said $50 about a week ago. Sure, they couldn’t have predicted Covid-19 but nonetheless, “that’s just the way prices work now”. Regardless though Warcraft 3 Reforged is $30. Should we buy that too? All the people that refunded or just didn’t buy it would disagree. Point being that just because something is $20, $30 or $50 does not mean we should buy it. This is all yet another “issue” that some people might have with Reforged.
See last paragraph, but also I addressed this separately because: If I told you I had plenty of space, then suddenly in your eyes I could dictate the size or complain about it? Because that’s what that statement comes off as (again, see Stormknight’s post, this is exactly his case and one I still agree with). That’s like saying that people with less money shouldn’t have a say in whether taxes get raised and that people with more money should have all the say. What kind of logic is that? No, I doubt it would matter especially since you said I will never convince you that 28gbs is too large. Yeah, I don’t think you personally will change your mind, that’s why I said agree to disagree.
Ok cool, you don’t think you should have to, doesn’t work like that though.
Stop comparing how games worked in 2003 to how it now works in 2020. It’s getting old. World changed, internet changed, how we download and consume media changed.
I don’t care what you think is “right”, it’s how this works. In a perfect world you’d be able to choose every single file you do/don’t want installed, but that’s not how it works.
Yeah, it’s amazing what happens in 17 years. Ever tried comparing an xbox game from then to an xbox game now?
“if we’re talking about other games, look at SCR, it takes up less requirements”
“they could have gone with more detailed graphics but they didn’t”
So that explains why it takes up less requirements…
Yeah I did a quick google search of 1tb hdds. However prices now are higher cause of covid, so I looked at pre-covid prices. And since the game was out before covid, I changed the number.
I mean if you want to buy it buy it, I refunded. Also you’re equating a single game purchase with a tech purchase that allows you to play any game you want space wise. Not remotely the same thing.
Anyone can talk about space, regardless of how much/little they have, but that doesn’t mean I’ll take them seriously. If someone complained about how crap their lawn looked, and how their lawn mower was broken, and the part needed to replace it was $2, and they didn’t buy it, I wouldn’t take them seriously. However it was $300, I’d feel bad for them. It’s about context.
You mean complaining about having things on his PC he’ll never use? Welcome to PC gaming, hell PCs in general. Games come with DLC you’ll never purchase, don’t like it, find a new hobby.
You’re taking my comment without the context. It’s what I said above, you can talk about it, but it doesn’t mean I’m going to take you seriously. If you couldn’t save just over $1 a year for a hobby, you aren’t the people who get to dictate what happens to the majority.
You’re right, you won’t convince me, because I understand time passes, things get bigger, and you can’t run something from 2020 on something from 2003. And it sure isn’t the companies fault you don’t keep up with the times.
Do you get in arguments with clouds? I’m being serious.
I don’t know why you keep arguing for a billion dollar business to continue their status quo while simultaneously stating the times have changed. Waste is waste, it has no bearing on what the current year is. It’s rampancy throughout the industry isn’t a valid reason to accept it.
Excuse me while I laugh with Deep Rock Galactic that doesn’t even take 2GB on UE4.
5 Likes
Good point, stating that times have changed and arguing for or defending a business’s current status quo is sort of hypocritical, because it goes against the possibility or support for further change. There’s no reason that the times can’t change again, even if it means going backward to go forward. So what’s wrong with arguing against the status quo? That’s how change happens.
Also, judging by your Deep Rock Galactic comment, it seems you got my point about Starcraft Remastered while he didn’t. The point is that modern games can be made without taking up 20 or even 10 GB of space, especially if they are just remastered versions of games that were under 5 GB to begin with. But instead of doing that, they choose to use remastered models that take up significantly more space, which may not be a problem in and of itself, but because they still chose to force it on anyone who updates the classic game or wants to play battle.net.
Likewise I could say that comparing how other games work in 2020 and defending that status quo is getting old. Warcraft 3 is not just another 2020 game. You want to compare it with 2020? Let’s go back just a little bit: 2017, 2018 2019 where Warcraft 3 was still ~3GB of space, proof that it was NOT like other modern giant games at the time. All of a sudden 2020 comes and bam, ~25 GB of increased size. Modern games don’t just instantly go from 3 GB to 28 GB, nor are Remasters always forced on owners of the classic game.
Did most (or even any) original Xbox games increase to the size of an Xbox One game over time and force users to buy more space or a newer Xbox to keep playing that game online? No? Then that’s not a good comparison and actually serves as an example of games NOT requiring players to do that. But like I said anyway, for WC3 this didn’t happen over 17 years, it happened from one patch in 2020.
But it is close to the same thing if you are buying it JUST so you can keep playing Warcraft 3. Who said I wanted to buy more games that take up lots of space? And the lawnmower isn’t a good comparison because that’s just a wear and tear or mishandling cost that isn’t the fault of the manufacturer (except when it is, in which case you may be entitled to money or free replacement under warranty). Whereas in WC3’s case it’s Blizzard who is directly responsible for this increase in size, not the consumer, but Blizzard isn’t giving you a bigger hard drive or upgraded system to play it with.
Way to deflect. Thing is it does not “feel” just like a DLC pack. Unlike other games, it’s being advertised as a “Remastered” game, not a DLC pack. Also it’s the vast majority of the game’s size. So it feels like an entire game that is nearly 10x bigger being forced onto you whether you buy it or not.
Games that don’t ever increase in system requirements or only get a little bigger relatively say hello (including pretty much every console game). Also have to disagree with that comment about dictating. If anything is dictating here, it’s arguing for or defending the position that everyone should have to download the assets. Whether the majority supports that or not, it’s still dictating to people who don’t want to download them. I’m arguing it should be up to the consumer, the opposite of dictating, and you even say that in a perfect world, that would be ideal.
If you want I can propose it in a way that wouldn’t dictate anything to anyone other than Blizzard (which is the case with any proposed change): You choose whether or not to download the assets and can still update the game and play online either way, even if you didn’t buy Reforged (you just couldn’t use them unless you buy them). If given the choice, I doubt many people would want to download them if they couldn’t use them, unless they plan on eventually buying Reforged.
Likewise you won’t convince me, because time passing is a poor argument for a game that from 2002 through 2019 did not take up nearly as much space. Especially while at the same time you defend the company’s status quo to stay the same. And it sure is the company’s fault for forcing this onto anyone who still wants to play online. They are directly responsible for doing it this way.
1 Like
Do you know why it was the same size in 2017, 2018, 2019? BECAUSE THEY HADN’T DONE ANYTHING TO IT.
OMG IF YOU MAKE SOMETHING IN 2003 AND YOU DON’T CHANGE IT IT’LL BE THE SAME SIZE 16 YEARS ON OMG.
That doesn’t make it a modern game.
Imagine then comparing something that hasn’t changed to 17 years of industry change and thinking anything you’ll ever say will be taken seriously.
Imagine not understanding that if you took an xbox game from then and turned it into an xbox game from now the size would go up.
Facts don’t care about your feelings. It’s what it is.
Again comparing 17 years of gradual advancement to something that was from 2003 one day and 2020 the next.
Yeah and given the choice people wouldn’t download DLC content if they didn’t plan on buying it. GAME WON’T WORK THOUGH. Thanks for your useless idea.
I’ve got one for you, how about we all get magical wish granting fairies that will give us anything we want and make things won’t any way we choose and then everyone will be happy!
It’s incredible, you keep making this dumb argument and not once did you realise just how dumb it is.
Nope, it’s how games work now, you have to have the same things as others, to play, and that it’s 2020, your game got updated, welcome to the modern age, hdds aren’t 50gb anymore, go buy a new one.
Please never reply to me again.
Funny how that works out.
You’re right, Reforged a being mutually exclusive option from Classic doesn’t care about your feelings. They don’t overlap. You might have noticed this isn’t an MMO too.
1 Like
Nah. 30gb is a bit ridiculous even now.
If you actually look at the files, a lot of what’s in there is heavily unoptimized. Most of the art files look like they come straight out of work files and aren’t optimized well for performance or space. I mod the game, I make art, and I see this is a huge difference to how they did the art in SC2 or Heroes of the Storm.
They split up each unit into multiple texture maps which really aren’t necessary, and each is so high res that it really makes no sense to have in an RTS unless they were really planning to keep the up-close cutscenes that they originally planned for. But no, since those cutscenes were scrapped there’s really no reason to have high-resolution textures still in the game rather than compressing them all to a lower, more manageable format for release. Even SC2 and Heroes of the Storm don’t go overboard with multiple big textures.
It’s laziness to not have the game optimized and cut down to a more appropriate size. They’re just leaving in all the base high-res textures in there for the sake of it, and most of the time they’re not even being used since no one plays the game scrolled in close to units at all times.
It’s a massive waste of space. Great for modders like me who can make use of the high-res textures, but that’s about it.
3 Likes
Yep only mmos have DLC, you’re right. Only mmos have patches when DLC comes out that makes you download that content.
Why do you even post?
Yes, and? Are you trying to say that different games function differently online? I’m not going to break down the details for you. You don’t need the MHW High Resolution Texture Pack to play online. It’s the functional equivalent to Reforged. This is an actual fact.
3 Likes
In theory this is possible for singleplayer, but definitely not for multiplayer. Or at least, you can’t use LITERALLY all of Blizzard’s HD graphics in an SD map. As far as my knowledge goes, there is no functional difference between SD and HD graphics, they just have the two modes that can switch which vanilla graphic set is being used.
Anyway, you couldn’t use literally the entire HD graphics set because maps online are limited to about 100MBs or so. It should in theory be possible to use “HD” graphics in SD mode though, since the only actual distinction between the two is map/mod-based (whether a map maker wants to consider a model HD or SD for their internal file structure) and not on a per-model basis IIRC (as in there’s no difference in architecture between SD and HD models other than SD models are just “lower” quality).
Wow, someone else recently made their own thread about this AND brought attention to many of the past threads about this. I didn’t realize there were this many:
26gigabyte for a 2g game -
Blizzard you need to roll back this update!
It's downloading, even though I didn't buy it
Why am I still being forced to download GBs of Reforged assets?
I didn't buy Reforged. Why is it forced on me, and where is my classic client?
Forced to download reforged?
Reforged is a forced downgrade for classic users - #153 by DrSuperGood-1327
Of course that doesn’t count all the people that agree but have not made a thread about this or don’t use this website, or all the news articles that mention this as a criticism. Clearly this isn’t just some “dumb” complaint. A lot of people agree about this, even if at the same time many people don’t care.
That at least partially explains why they take up so much space. But yes, all the more reason why it’s a waste of space.
That answers that then. So then, going back to your original post, you’re saying that people who didn’t buy Reforged can play custom maps in HD mode (with Reforged assets) due to still having the Reforged assets downloaded? Again that seems like a big loophole and even less reason to buy Reforged. But if that’s the case, then to satisfy both sides, they just need to have the Reforged assets be an optional download, so people who want to play HD maps without buying Reforged still can, and people who don’t just wouldn’t be able to play them. They could even have an error message for people who still try like “You need to download Reforged data to play HD maps.”