GSL finals - balance discussion

The finals were ABSOLUTELY disgusting. Maru, the greatest player that ever was lost to a good zerg, yes, but no where near as good as Maru. Rogue is extremely inconsistent and for the most part only abused an op roach push that terran basically has no answer to. Zerg isn’t as op as protoss but its getting close. Zerg is insanely favoured in ZvT and its the only reason rogue could defeat Maru. Maru is miles better and more consistent than rogue, its a disgrace he could beat him that easily.

I would advise to buff something core on terran to help the absolutely terrible early and late game. So buffing marine base damage could be a nice start. Could also make it so marine/maurauders have a tech lab upgrade locked behind fusion core that gives them +20% hp and +1 base dmg. That would really bring the power into terran late game and give other races something to fear.

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Rogue won a tournament with Zerg when Protoss are winning TWICE as many tournaments and dominating GML at double the representation. He has entered the halls of SC2 fame as one of the few people to win a premier event when their race was underpowered. Maru isn’t even in that category (a great player, but not a contender for the GOAT like Rogue).

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Maru is >>>>>>>> rogue, its even up to debate. Maru has won 4 GSLs and is better at every single little thing than rogue. Rogue is a patch zerg that abuses the weakness of terran in ZvT by spamming a roach timing terran simply cannot hold.

Maru lost to Rogue while Zerg is underpowered. Maru is a great player. Maru is not as great as Rogue.

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Zerg isn’t even close to underpowered in TvZ. The fact protoss rolls over zerg has nothing to do with this. Maru should never lose to someone like rogue

What a clown :sweat_smile: more dps for Marines and/or more HP :rofl: splash and cloack for Marines will be also good, because Marines are really underpowered and used really rarely.
And those stupidity - locked behind fusion core upgrade :man_facepalming::man_facepalming::man_facepalming: Yeaaah cuz Terran and Protoss has a problem to rush T3 units/upgrades. Dude. Just build more SCVs and turn your Minimap ON, and you will be soon promoted from Bronz 4

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Rogue has won 8 top premier tournaments in LotV, what do you mean Maru is more consistent lol? They’re both hot and cold players who perform really well sometimes and drop out in the Ro32 other times.

Those games weren’t balance, Rogue just tricked Maru really well the first two games and then Maru was full tilt and stopped checking his minimap (seriously he missed like 2-3 in vision nydus worms in game 3, and a runby that killed his CC. Then in game 5 he missed a slow bane roll and didn’t scout mutas until they showed up on his side of the map)

We only saw 1 standard game that whole series, and that was a game Maru didn’t scout properly and then donated 22 SCVs.

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Nodoby goes Roach / Ravenger against Terran Bio because they suck. Maru simply got taken by surprise by an unusual style and never adjusted his strategy. It was very weird and boring, but I will not cry out for unbalance, it’s just an odd one out

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Maru is so good he let slow banelings wreck an entire mineral line

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Every terran only and perhaps even zerg only player on this forum is so retarded, they cant be pleased, they think their race is constantly being the weakest even thou they have the most players in top 10 in Aligulac and so on. I am glad rogue humiliated maru, just like trap humiliated him but this time maru couldnt just turtle to win. I really hope someone at blizzard nerfs the turtle style to the ground, the terran eco and remove marauder stim because a 2 base terran should not be just as powerful and supply rich in minute 8 vs a 4 base zerg or protoss.

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Rogue is a better player than Maru. Roach pushes have been in the game since 2010 literally. If Maru was this good, he would have found a way to stop a build that’s literally over a decade old. Instead, he did silly mistakes like putting his e-bays in literally the most vulnerable spot in the entire map, letting Nydus worms finish in his main, being completely out of position, letting SLOW banes destroy an entire mineral line, not lifting his CCs and during the entire match, flat out skipped scouting altogether… against a player the went for agressive build repeatedly the entire tournament.

Maru did NOT deserve to win. He got OUTPLAYED by a better player. Maru was overconfident, you could tell in the interview before the match. It feels good seeing cocky overconfident players get completely rolled over. Next time I hope Maru gives us a better game, because his piss poor showing gave us one of the worst GSL finals of all time.

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Where overconfidence ends and cockiness and disrespect begins? To undervalue an Elite player like Rogue is deadly and Maru paid the price in full.
Both are grat players, it’s enough to be too sure of oneself to be swiftly punished…hard.
Congrats to Rogue, he deserved in full the win.
It’s nothing to do with Balance (though Terrans are a little favored and the whinner -Maru whinned just before the match) it’s about taking seriously your opponent.
Arrogance is a luxury that no-pro should have.

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The best thing Rogue does is show the AOB what is viable with zerg.

I have been saying this for years on this forum and most people ignored me. Ravagers are one of, if not the most overpowered units in the entire game and only get better at higher skill caps. The “common” wisdom among most pundits of the game is that “roach ravager is a low tier tech”. Mass roach is but Ravagers are NOT! We have seen Serral using Ravagers in late game ZvP AND ZvT for years now. In some ways it is even more powerful in ZvT because of the large number of immobile units (Siege tanks and libs… plus BCs and Thors to a certain degree). I will admit though… even I was surprised that Roach Ravager could just steam roll through mass tank lines. That is the one thing that should absolutely hard counter it. Even banshee wasnt good enough. Dont get me wrong there is a counter. Bio does well with upgrades/marauders. BCs do just fine obviously. But mech is honestly full of supporting units… going “mech” isnt a real thing at the pro level IMO.

Ravagers, have a high damage spell that is AOE and can hit air on a short cooldown for no energy. Plus it is a great fighting unit and is fast, has 1 base armor, a big health pool, good dps, good range, and no light or armored tag. Requires very low tech. Lets not forget the underrated ability to transform from a hurt roach back to full health, greatly reducing the “effective cost” of the unit. Only “downside” is the high gas cost but is well worth it especially if you get value with them as a roach before morphing. If you hit with every bile plus their already good DPS they are laying out HUGE DPS. AND even if the bile doesn’t hit, it still hurts the enemy. How? They have to get out of the way so can be used to force poor positioning, extra APM, and if their units are moving, they arent firing. Not to mention its “main” use which is to completely neuter forcefields and thus kill any sentry play (but to be fair I guess Protoss got the Disruptor which is definitely the stupidest design for a unit ever)

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TvZ is a fine matchup that can go either way. Maru was just uninspired and outplayed.

I wish TvP was anywhere near as fair as TvZ is.

Uninspired and outplayed?

He was steamrolled by the same strategy literally 3 times in a row. And Maru tried multiple strategies to beat it. Honestly, it might have even worked the 4th time but Rogue tried a lower eco version that IMO is not as good. Worse eco, worse upgrades, and much fewer ravagers which are what makes it dangerous, not the roaches. Especially against tanks.

Roach Ravager is not supposed to even be a viable ZvT strategy. Bio and/or tanks should stomp it. Banshees too. But it absolutely rolled Maru 3 times in a row even attackign into heavily fortified positions with tanks.

maru, supposed to be rogue, what delusional world do you live in where maru isn’t supposed to lose to anyone?? yes, he’s probably one of the best terrans (on a good day) but not everyday is a good day… you forgot to take into account that these are HUMANS playing the game, not mechanical robots that are able to do everything perfectly everytime, humans are prone to error and this series shows just that.

if you have any more questions or concerns, feel free to keep whining, but you will be wrong.

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I am not wrong, Maru is objectively the best player to ever play sc2. And lets say his skill fluctuate 20% lower on a bad day, that’s still about twice as good as patch zerg Rogue. There is a big imbalance that needs to be addressed, in TvZ, TvP and maybe in ZvP.

Terran is weak and needs to be buffed

rogue might be more accomplished, with more varying titles. so i don’t know what metrics you use to qualify as best player… but maru and rogue are both contenders, but rogues list might just be better.

of course he won’t more, he plays a race that was disgustingly broken for 3 years.

Maru has better micro, harder micro, better multitasking, better everything. Don’t even argue with me this is a FACT.