Co Op and why "brutal mode" keeps getting buffs

Co-op Missions Discussion
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Alright… so here’s my question to all you “know it alls”

From the beginning of co op, it was great, it really was, all difficulty levels were doable, and playable.

My Situation, and i highly doubt anyone will do anything but here’s my problem…

No matter what i do, in brutal mode, i can’t seem to win, i play all the commanders, and all my commanders are 15…

Yet… i still lose all my stuff, from what i’ve heard, and researched.

The Game Developers, Buffed Brutal 4 times…
And made the commanders a little squishy, or weak.

Now imo… that’s gonna make people not wanna play the game… you’re basically favoring the Ai, by giving them Buff’s, and making the game unplayable.

Maybe it’s just me, maybe… i dunno…

I play fair, i expand to my 2nd Depot, i made all my upgrades, and i still lose…

I wanna know why the Game Developers are Favoring the AI, and not the commanders, and players ?

People tell me… they are losing interest in this game, and won’t touch brutal, cuz of how hard it is.

Look i understand people want a challenge, but if you’re gonna nerf things, and make the Ai unbeatable… nobody is gonna favor this game.

I just don’t understand why the Developers, support the trolls, and not the actual players.

I’ve seen people on reddit whine about how easy the game is…

I don’t know what they’re on, or where they’re getting these “the game is too easy” idea from…

I can’t even unlock all of the game achievements… I’m not a good player… so because of that, my game experience is pretty much ruined.

Games are suppose to be fun, Not make you feel like crap, or make you depressed irl. Seriously… do the game developers not care about the players and their feelings?

I’m starting to wonder why people support developers who only go after player’s money.

All i know is… i can’t play brutal, it’s rigged and everytime i ask someone about it, i get laughed at, like i’m trolling. But the fact is i’m not… i’m really struggling… and nobody cares…

And i’ll be honest with my last statement… Not every person, is exactly the game, not everyone games the same way. So to tell people “yea the game’s easy” you’re basically trolling the community because as i stated… not everyone is the same.

I just wish the developers cared about the community, and not money…

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I’ll be honest, your post sounds like a student that does not study then whines that his exam is too hard.

  • Did you ever consider trying to better your skills at co-op (there are resources out there you can use: starcraft2coop, Team Liquid guide for co-op) so you can properly pull your weight in Brutal?
  • Why play Brutal at all if you already admitted that your skills are not up to par for playing in that difficulty?
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Have you ever watched a replay to see where you went wrong in a particular match?

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Brutal really is easy for most people. I lose maybe one game out of 100.
If it’s hard for you, then the other 3 difficulties exist for a reason. No shame playing on Hard.
If you want to get better, make sure you saturate your minerals and gas as soon as possible, most of the slower players I meet just don’t mine enough resources. Also, try to remember the timing for the enemy waves and save some hero cooldown or top bar ability to kill them easily. Start learning on some of the easier maps like Rifts to Korhal or Void Thrashing, the time limit is very forgiving there.

Also maybe check out some of the commander guides on TeamLiquid or Starcraft2Coop dot com (google them, can’t post links).

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It’s all about learning the strengths and weaknesses of your commander, what build(s) are good to use against certain compositions, and what masteries are optimal to use based on your commander.
I main Alarak, one of the least played Commanders in the game. I have zero troubles playing him at the Brutal difficulty. I’ve played him for… I actually don’t know how many hours now. Too many for me to count. He only has two, maybe three builds that actually work (I only use two,) and I have no problems executing them on most maps. (Cradle is the worst for Alarak players due to having to micro the trucks on top of everything else…)

You need to pick a Commander to stick with and learn on Hard before moving to Brutal. You don’t have enough practice or experience to really comment on Brutal.

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I am not claiming to be the best at co-op but as all these other people have said, brutal is really not that hard hence why it keeps getting buffed. i agree with what Sprite said, find a hero you like and main it, learn it, learn the builds and it becomes pretty dang easy.

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I think it’s pretty clear based on the responses here. Everyone can empathize with your feels towards this topic. However, it is clear many can play Brutal with ease.

As such, there must be a reason why many can (and are replying so) while you can’t. It is not a “know it all” trolling you but just some simple statistics based around different skill level (ie. coop experience-ness).

My advice for you to paving your Brutal games is this:

  1. Select a single commander. Set a goal like expanding, or making first unit/army, or clearing objective x, or any of the combination.
  2. Time yourself on the set goal. Check replay on how to reach it faster next game. Is it making 17 workers at 1min better or 15 workers + a tech structure? Figure it out.
  3. Repeat 1) & 2) to hone your build order. Compare it with TeamLiquid Guide recommendations. Check it against other sources building orders. Truly understanding what specific benefit each build order brings. (Secret? There is no ‘best’ one fit all but there is a ‘best’ for any specific purpose.)
  4. Repeat 1) - 3) for other commanders.
  5. I guarantee you, if you invest even a week’s worth of game play doing this, you’ll improve immensely (at least with one, if not more commanders).

And lastly an honest opinion. Based on your own description of “unable to do achievements” and “losing most Brutal games”, most experienced players will instantly know it is a simple lack of optimal build order and/or lack of commander strength that’s holding you back.

Best of luck!

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Its Brutal…if that’s too hard play on Hard level, or be Normal, or remember this is a Casual game.

While I can do regular Brutal games, many mutations I do Hard, the rest Normal or Casual.

Play on whatever difficulty is fun for you.
If you lose 70% of Brutal games but enjoy the challenge, great. If you like wiping the map even playing with a weird strategy on Casual, do that.

Brutal is Buffed so there is variety in the choices you have.

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Glad someone was blunt so I don’t have to be the first.

They are buffing brutal because many brutal difficulty players want it buffed, because they steamroll it. Some of them practically even steamroll it in their sleep. Trust me, it can be done, and if you are losing brutal it’s not because the game has grown unplayable.

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99% sure that this is the same guy who said the achievements were impossible like 3 months ago. I told him to email me and everyone left decently nice comments, but he never responded or reached out for help again until now.

That being said, I never thought stim was a valuable upgrade until Artosis said it was in a GSL in 2017, so I can see why some people are behind the curve.

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I have to intentionally handicap myself extremely bad to give even a slight chance of losing in a regular Brutal, more often than not even Brutations are relatively easy, especially these past few weeks. So with that said I hope they stop messing around and give Brutal an actual serious difficulty buff cuz I barely even play anymore because there’s almost no challenge.

If you find the current iteration of brutal to be too hard then consider yourself lucky and be grateful for your current state of mind because without challenge there’s no fun to be had. You’re probably still fairly new to the game and just need to spend more time playing then eventually you’ll be like most players who feel like Saitama when they play regular brutal.

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It is you. Lots of people can carry brutal on one base, that’s why they keep buffing it.
Try to learn from your allies. And instead of focusing on upgrades - make units. Massing T1 units for any comander is enough to clear brutal maps.

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I’m getting a feeling this is a troll post, but I will bite.

Brutal difficulty, as the name suggests should be difficult.
If it’s too hard for you, then please do some research, watch some videos of other good players and try playing at the lower difficulty settings. You have options.

You say the developers don’t care about the community and they should lower brutal mode’s difficulty, because you are having a hard time on the hardest difficulty of this mode, despite the fact that a lot of people find Brutal really easy and boring.

Can you get any more entitled than that? Please get over yourself and think.
The options are there for you, you are not stuck on Brutal, you can choose a lower difficulty and once you improve come back to it.

If you want an easy and strong Commander pick Dehaka and mass mutalisks or Zeratul and mass immortals. You can literally just a-move, even in brutal.

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Team liquid has great guides on SC2 coop (older guides a bit outdated).
There is also a great website called starcraft2coop that has up to date guides.

Some years ago i had trouble making the change from Hard to Brutal.
Hard was too slow and easy while brutal was a big jump in difficulty (unless i used some very strong hero commanders like Kerrigan).

But i just kept playing and playing (usually on Oblivion Express for practice) until Brutal became as easy as Hard.
Its just about experience and practice and memorization.
Do the same build order with a commander 20++ times in a row on the same map and you will feel a lot more masterful.
When the macro (base control, production etc) becomes second nature to you you will have a lot more time to think about micro and battles.

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I have seen many people like the OP. They feel humiliated if they are told to play the lower difficulties. But still keep whining how the highest difficulty is too hard, and everything must be brought down to their level.

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I just hope he/she takes the advices provided.

It’s fair for him to feel the way he feels. However, it’s hard for anyone to further empathize with anyone if they don’t try to improve.

A lot of less experienced players seem to play a variety of maps with different commanders the entire time. That’s a great strategy to keep it non-monotonous but a poor strategy for in-depth learning.

Some learn just fine that way and does Brutal while for others this tact fails. For me, it’s simple… if one strategy to learn/improve doesn’t work, try something else - especially if that something else is provided by the community already.

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Now I ain’t a very good player, but so far I was able to handle Brutal maps pretty well. Just starting to make the transition from Hard to Brutal, and yesterday I sucked out in Dead of Night with Tychus, but I ain’t giving up just yet. I think it’s doable, but you cannot lose faith if a particularly strong wave wipes part of your base out. And always be on the lookout for Ghosts with nukes, that was a sudden surprise for me the first time.

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Definitely watch a few youtube videos of sc2 coop brutal of the commander you want to learn.

Watching someone else play coupled with reading guides is going to help you greatly… only thing missing then will be your practice.

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You think? I mean, he even expands to his 2nd Depot: why should he lose, since he’s willing to mass to 23 supply?

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This post is the exception that proves the rule: modern videogames are designed manipulate the player into thinking they’re skilled rather than testing the player’s skill, and thats why I’m playing a game from 2011 eight years later.

Why don’t you enjoy playing on lower difficulties? If that’s what your skill level is at, play at that level- if that makes you depressed or sad you’re way too emotionally invested in letting a videogame define your self-worth.

I also play a bit of Apex Legends on my PC- PC shooters have always been harder for me than console shooters, and I’m a low silver player at best. If I reallllly applied myself and spent a lot more tine playing I could probably work my way up to gold or platinum, but 1: I dont have that kind of time, and 2: it would mean I’d have to play the game ultra serious, which just isnt that fun.

Play videogames to have fun.

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