Artanis P2... w/o Warp Speed

I’m thinking about trying Artanis P2 with Energy Regen mastery instead of Warp Speed.

It’s blasphemy, I know, but I’ve been an ardent Templar/Archon user so I appreciate a consistent regen/CD over time, without relying on having 25~50 spear energy read at all time. I can, of course, also try to make more units therefore reduce the chance of running out of energy for ability.

Is there any test showing which mastery has better energy regen over time?

I’m a little confused by your question. If you’re more comfortable with the Cooldown/Energy mastery, then of course that’s the one that will give you more energy (however little appreciable amount it may be).

What is there to test?

OP’s question is about forgoing one (+) of P2. Getting the warp in speed bonus when you use Project Power Field to teleport your units elsewhere.

Aye, the warp speed bonus is a well supported option far as this forum goes. If the benefit of regen and CD reduction from warp speed can make up for the 45% additional regen/CD reduc, then I might benefit more from choosing thus.

The warp speed is the popular one, for obvious reasons, but if you find a build that’s fun and/or works for you then why not? People as a group are gonna be crotchety and stuck in their ways, the style defined as ideal isn’t always going to be.

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I might try to fire up coop tomorrow and test how much energy you get from warp speed mastery per warp tomorrow. If it’s high enough, it could be worth it. No need to waste energy on over shields if you can warp and storm fairly consistently.

That, is one of the reason why I pick the regen mastery. Sometimes situation calls for both offense and defense and I need to keep a few Templar at the base to storm waves off without relying on using spear energy to frequently warp. (Defending the temple, for example)

P2 is well worth the warp field without any masteries. In your case you ignore any synergies granted with masteries, as in the attack buff/etc including energy regen on warp in. The warp in energy outpaces the constant energy regen, but is useless outside of the timeframe it is active or if energy values hit maximum, though you are also trading that extra regen for cooldown reduction on abilities.

Personally I go with 4 points into cooldown reduction and 26 points into warp in, or otherwise 6% energy regen and 52% speed, this allows zealots and phoenix reduced cooldowns while otherwise retaining maximum speed increase.

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What does the warp-in speed have to do with increased energy? Why is everyone talking like you cast the field and all of a sudden you gain more energy? The P2 field re-applies the warp-in (mastery speed if you have any), which is an attack speed and movement speed buff (not an energy thing at all).

Regardless of prestige, if you don’t choose the alternative cooldown/energy mastery, your energy rate doesn’t change… or am I missing something here? (Cuz it sounds like I am haha).

I uh… Thought for some reason that the warp in speeds up everything including energy regen. However, looking at the description you might be right. Guess I’ll start by checking that first later.


I see you are a rebel! and likes to do things different from everyone else.

I think your question is:

“Is there any test showing which situation is better with energy regen over time mastery?”

Your other question was confusing :face_with_spiral_eyes: I think the obvious answer to is to test on infested maps like DoN and ME, where HTs’ storm are used most often there. You could test with 30/0 or 15/15 or 0/30 and let us know how you did :slight_smile:

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Actually, you seems to be right.
Checking the upgrade “MasteryArtanisSoAPowerFieldHaste” (involved with behaviors and effects), it affects Acceleration, Move Speed, Attack Speed, Energy regeneration and Cooldown.

edit after further research:

  • energy regen mastery:
    +0.0084375 to +0,253125 energy regen
  • warp speed mastery:
    x1.02 to x1.6 multiplier to energy regen
  • base energy regen of HT and Archons: 0.5625

energy regen mastery regen rate:
0,5709375 to 0,815625

warp speed mastery regen rate:
0,57375 to 0.9

Of course, it must be remembered that warp speed mastery buff is temporary, while the other is permanent.


Thanks for checking, had no idea it applied to energy regen as well (although thinking about it, this behaviour is noted in Warped-in Reavers). Interesting details though. :+1:

Thanks Mr Undead, I didn’t know this. Knowing this I think warpin speed energy regeneration should be competitive with energy regeneration mastery.

Nevertheless, OP still should do this test for us 30/0, 15/15 and 0/30.

Thank you, that’s what I saw on the mastery tooltip. I knew I hasn’t smoked that much terrazine yet.

Or, as Mallos suggested, 4/26, where you get 52% warp speed and maintain 4% permanent energy regen. How do two buffs add up, though?

And here comes another question: At what % does the benefit of Warp Speed buff start to have diminishing return? As in, typical encounter lasts about 10 second or so, would 60% buff speed edge out 52% that much to make a difference? Is there a decline similar to worker/mineral saturation here, where the last 5~10 points of Warp Speed do not benefit as much as the initial 20.

It’s too intricate and complicated of a question. Basically you’re looking at specific cases for each unit to unit (and then units to units) engagement.

For example, will 60% increased immortal destroy a marauder before it can shoot back 2 shots? Or will 50% similarly provide that benefit? If so, then the only real benefit of 50% speed VS 60% speed may be for against a static objective when immortals are blasting it. Way too many layers.

As you can see that it becomes way too complicated. My money is still full on Warp-in Speed (unless you’re full on Reavers like 1000% of the time, all the time :stuck_out_tongue: ). That doesn’t seem like your cup of tea though. So I wouldn’t worry much about an effective split (this mastery set isn’t geared for energy like at all, even if you had 30/0 it is crap).

Yeah… I was thinking about units like Reaver and Zealots here. When Zealots go WW they stop attacking, right? Which means whatever speed boost they get would be minimum compare to Immortals in your example. At the same time, Reaver would benefit from both attack speed and CD reduction. (Their attack speed can change, right? I’m not too sure)

Sounds like warp speed might use the time scale modifier, meaning everything is sped up. So it might also be a multiplier on the regen effect of the cooldown/regen choice as well.

Not sure how it could be tested, but if someone’s bored it might bear looking into.

you can go into maguro maps in arcade to test choices without wasting someone elses time

As interesting as it may be to overthink it, you guys are overthinking it. Some pretty standard breakpoints are as follows:

more than one third of the time aka 33%+
more than half of the time aka 50%+

You can see the 52% hits that more than half the time. Sometimes making something 150% better is more useful than you would realize, it can be a good metric to preserve an intuitive understanding of what that extra 50% is doing, pretend you had to find out exactly what that extra 47% was doing instead. Break points are never so simple though, outside of specific counter-play and heavy research into opposition and playstyles, standard breakpoints more than suffice for general usage.

However break points are meant to be optimized, they are specific scenarios where you can do something (apply points) to maximize gain and minimize negative outcomes. There is always the tradeoff in these scenarios, something good while hoping for less bad. When considering a breakpoint you pretty much always start with the good you are looking for and then consider the bad outcomes to narrow the field of what is good.

With Artanis I have 3 unit comps, zealot+phoenix, zealot+archon, and pure goon. For me I consider that the warp in mastery attack and movement speed is the good scenario, I want as much as that as possible. That is because only zealots and phoenix use cooldown and archon use energy, I decide that the energy and cooldown from the other mastery is not useful in comparison to the attack/movespeed. However due to what I pointed out before, this is only for a short period during the warp in. In order to align my breakpoint with the possible gain of the cooldown and energy during the time outside of the warp in bonus, I can reduce the points in the other mastery to add to it. I chose the minimum amount of points in order to reduce the cooldown of the zealot charge/whirlwind and phoenix lift.

Overthinking? 100%, that’s half that this forum gets into. But why would those specific numbers be standard breakpoints? Apart from being nice clean numbers, they’ve really got no bearing on anything.

But, if the two masteries were to stack, then that means that someone using P2 and caring particularly about the cooldown/regen rate would want a 13/17 split. As that gives basically the same rate during warp in as 0/30 (very slightly higher, actually), but also give 119.5% outside as well.

Also, in the spirit of overthinking; a 7/23 would give the absolute best warp in rate at 161.33%, compared to 0/30’s 160% and 13/17’s 160.13%.

Naturally, it all matters if the two are combined as multiplicative instead of additive. Problem is, additive 13/17 is 153.5, and testing a whole 6.63% is… Not exactly feasible.

Best way would be if a map maker wizard came along and checked if the warp in mastery is time scale or not. But, eh.