Are there anymore co-op Units/strcutures needs fix?

Past month I’ve tried numerous experiments in tweaking effects (especially inefficient ones) and strengthening obscure units to become more playable.
Alarak’s Death Fleet to Zagar’s Corruptors for example.
I think I pretty much touched every one of these things that I can think of and there is nothing left to do.

I want to ask, is there any thing that could be implemented In Coop Commanders?
Please leave what could be implemented/changed/tweak and I’ll do best I can to experiment on it.

Thank you

Useful BattleCarrier Lords that can actually shoot air.

I mean, Christ. They’re designed after two different capital-class spaceships that can shoot both air and ground, yet it can only shoot ground because it’s also based on Brood Lords? Come on, man.


Stalker blink auto-cast (for every stalker). Add purifier stalker to karax.

Add something useful to stukov banshee (limited attack on charges for example, it may be weak AA, or some exposive anti-ground to give them AoE), decrease bunker cost for stukov.

Dewarp ability for artanis (or make his units has little more dps, or be little cheaper(like 10-20%)), decrease phoenix cost, maybe make some possibility to build scarabs faster (some tech, ofc if cooldown mastery don’t do that already).

Kerris and Zagaras queens heal auto-cast. Make vanguard of alarak more viable.

Nova’s snipeshot count kill when killing justdie-ish enemy first time.

Make Deimos viking tranformation faster.

But, I don’t really know where we can see all these changes and what is the point of your work. Is it some mode in arcade or?

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Hellions (both from nova and swann), and raynor’s landed Vikings.

Auto blink with vorazun could be harmful in a couple situations, when you want everything to cloak at once. Stalkers and slayers are pretty powerful already and it’s fun to blink micro every now and then. I’d rather they go unchanged.

Agreed for stukov banshees. AoE could be nice.

De-warp could be a decent QoL thing to help mobility, but ehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh it seems clunky, especially when you can just NOT go to 200 supply when you know you need to bo mobile, Phoenix cost isn’t their issue, it’s their damage. Reavers already benefit from cooldown mastery.

Again, auto transfuse could be a bad thing if you want energy for larva. It’s not particularly hard to just use heal on kerrigan when she’s at low health similar to using swann defense matrix. Vanguard range buff would be nice. Being able to shoot over slayers when both are havoc boosted would make them survive way longer and ramp up quicker.

Why should nova snipe be able to effectively ignore just die? Every other commander has to deal with it, including Kerrigan assimilation aura, dehaka essence, and abathur biomass

If you get the upgrades, Vikings transform instantly. Transformation speed isn’t an issue for them.

You know you are able to turn off auto-cast? Nobody is forcing you. Stalkers aren’t already powerful, if you don’t want to use auto-cast then don’t use it. Autocast is set on regular units attacks, and noone is complaining. Stalkers unfortunately has some chunk of their power into blink ability, which is very hard to use to full extent.

Phoenix lift units. They are there for it. They don’t need damage increase. Cost decrease always increase their damage by making more of them.

Every other commander that is not Nova hasn’t need to deal with it - they just kill unit twice. Nova kill unit first, then gets no energy for the kill, then she lost ability to make snipe streak. So every other commander - kill this unit twice (or use mc and kill it once as usual), Nova hero unit - kill unit once and be useless because you didn’t get your energy back.

I forgot to suggest giving void rays +1 to dmg and see what happens.

Buffs to Mengsk’s other royal guard, perhaps? Shock Division could have the attack speed penalty in air removed, Blackhammers… need an overhaul, and Sky Fury are incredibly squishy when everything points to them supposedly being the Aegis of the sky. They… aren’t.

Adding onto my suggestion:
What if Artanis and Vorazun had their own Solarite generation mechanic? I was thinking something along the lines of +1 Solarite generation for each major structure tier you reach. (+1 for Cybernetics Core, +1 for Twilight Council/Stargate/Robotics Bay, +1 for Templar Archives/Dark Shrine/Fleet Beacon/Robotics Facility for +3 total.)
I find their Solarite-based abilities to be weaker, just because of how slow their generation is. Every other energy-reliant topbar in the game has a way to speed up their generation (Solar Efficiency, Imperial Witness) yet these two get shafted.

The Developers tweaked the BattleCarrier Lords to attack only ground as an incentive for the players to use Mecha Corruptors with them in tandem. But then again, BCLs are very hard to come by and expensive.
In short Agreed.

Add auto cast isn’t a problem, but it is complicated when blink should be used (so it doesn’t get wasted) but is this change really necessary when you can select your stalkers quickly to blink away? What ability would Instigators should have (other than having charge of blinking (How about 3x teleportation or both))?

Infested Banshees are like hit and runners like Kerrigan Mutalisk except they are tankier and has much better regen (20hps as soon as burrowed), Also they have cloak and relatively easily enmassed. I don’t think they need AA, They can easily call Infested Liberators or just run away.

Agreed with Phoenix’s gas cost which is 100. wouldn’t “De Warp” defeat the purpose of “Instantaneous Warp” that Artanis have? Also Reavers already benefit from it.

Hmmmm, how about making Queens able to heal their units “Inside” the Omega Worm?
Vanguards are powerful but their pellet speed is slow.

the point of Just Die mutation is that every enemy unit gets extra life.

They already do that with Shredder Round. Speeds up transformation by 75%

There are some untapped potential or unimplemented cosmetic effects for each commanders.
I’m going to make videos about each things and upload them to youtube. Hopefully the Developers may see them and consider them.

btw, its a month till 27th Anniversary. I also have to pick up my pace.

What exactly is De Warp? is it sending your units back into the Psi Matrix? If so, Artanis doesn’t entirely need it.

That is an appropriate response, save them up in the Warp.

If Queens can use Auto Transfusion inside the Omega Worm or Heal into the Worm would be incredibly useful! Kerrigan’s Health and Torrasque health would be fully healed instantly.
Of course you can always turn off your auto cast button. Queens are not really useful right now and I just discovered they can queue Larva recently.

Their W.I.L.D missile is an issue for their inefficiency, I’ve tweaked this so they can be more useful.

Agreed, how about 10% sound like (90 Gas)? I know it’s little buff but considering their Anti Ground performance, this amount is justified. Or would you prefer 80 Gas?

They are Ok, but you need to use Black Hole Very frequently.
Their power charge is short, after 5 seconds Void Rays needs to charge all over again. I would like to double the duration.

You will gain 8 level 3 Shock Division with Intercessor much faster than you think. With moving shot and separate control, they are almost unbeatable. I’ve tried this out and I promise they are already sensational.
However I would like the Shock Division and Intercessors to have a separate button which automatically lets them unite/separate (like Hippogryph Rider button from WC3).

Agreed, Bulwark Field Area improvement is necessary. Some of people propose that they should walk over troopers what do you think? Blackhammers are Ok in other areas, you need to control them separately for Overwatch, which is again sensational.

These are the WORST ROYAL GUARD.
Here are their Problems

1. Weak Attack (fixed)
  1. Their attack has no impact. I’ve made the new passive which why replace Level 1’s “extra damage to Massive” passive to “Dual Weapon system” that allows the Sky Fury to use every weapon it has in one mode (But still restricted from attacking both Air/Ground in one form). When implemented, the Sky Fury’s performance in fire power boosted greatly.
    Here is the link:
2. Convoluted Tactical Alignment
  1. It’s another level 2 ability “Tactical Alignment” is ridiculous. Not only, you are forced to transform to trigger it, it only lasts for 5 seconds and immediately cancelled when you transform again after you trigger it. Why not make it longer and triggered when attacking an enemy?
3. Nitpicking Phoenix Protocol
  1. Level 3 Phoenix Protocol is risky ability mostly because there is no shield indicator like Intercessors (Couldn’t Aegis have indicators too?). You can attack your enemies but if those shield run out, you will lose your Level 3 Sky Fury.
    Sky Fury needs some serious upgrade.

Maybe they can have extra attack VS Massive units by default or via upgrade?

Artanis doesn’t need Extra Solar regeneration in my opinion as his forces are highly durable, hard hitting and cost efficient (Zealots and Dragoons can protect important units). Artanis has very useful Solar Abilites but Artanis doesn’t depend on that a lot.
Agreed with Vorazun though. Vorazun are highly dependant on Panel and Black holes has no Cooldowns to limit the useage
I think to apply Strike from the Shadows to buildings so Vorazun’s Caster Building (which stores SOA ability) can benefit from 50% Energy regen (Strike from the Shadow). The result was good, Vorazun was able to restore more than 25.2 Solar energy in 1 minute as opposed to 16.8 energy.
So, in the course of 20 minute of missions you get
336 (13 Black Holes/Dark Pylons) > 504 (20 Black Holes/Dark Pylons). I think this is a balanced buff.

My ideas for Blackhammer:
Damage dealt vs ground structures is doubled (give its ground attack something unique that isn’t done elsewhere in his army, plus it draws from big daddy odin)
Bulwark field radius increased to same as sentry’s guardian shield, plus comes with graphic to visualize (either the same shield as sentry, or just radius indicator like tyrannozor)
Self-repair in overwatch mode, plus radius of bulwark field is doubled (a bizarre gimmick that would let it be useful to pushing troopers while also locking down an airspace)
Move speed increased to 2.25 to reduce dependencies on intercessors to transport (a common complaint in coop servers is how blackhammers are slow and get stuck behind everyone)

Sky Fury ideas:
Keep bonus vs massive, but add bonus vs heroic. Rank 2 upgrade adds +4 range in air and +2 on ground in addition to tactical realignment. TR cooldown reduced to same as duration of ability.
Attacking massive units results in large splash radius, but ONLY massive units. Attacking anything else does nothing special.

Blackhammer are actually deal powerful damage as it is so that is not really necessary.


Not really necessary seeing troopers can turn to labourers with Supply bunker in an instant.
hot key particular troopers and make them into labourers.

I was thinking of speeding up Black Hammers with Sky Fury’s speed boos upgrade.

What do you think about Blackhammers walking over the troopers?

For me, I recon this ability needs to be lengthened to 7.5 ~ 10 seconds or initiated when the Sky Fury attack. They are short and very hard to initiate as they are (Also, TR effect disappears when you transform while in effect).

That is very hard to implement on my part. Maybe implementing tweaking the Validators (OK, let me worry about that)?

I agree with vs Heroic bonus but I’m not sure about range upgrade. It kind of overlaps with Raynor’s Viking, I’m considering to withdraw range upgrade I made with Deimos Vikings as well because of the same reason.

I added “Dual Weapon System” for Sky Fury as default so it can be unique to Sky Fury and increase its damage output. perhaps I can implement Extra damage Massive/Heroic?

Blackhammer’s ground damage is outclassed by aegis guard in every respect. The only things it’s better against are light units and archons, and even then, Aegis’s stimpack makes up the difference. Hence why I want the double damage vs structures, to give it a unique source of damage.

While you can make laborers at the drop of a hat, I am of the opinion that this should be something to supplement automatic regeneration on royal guard, not your only source of repair. Doing this tends to really mess with one’s flow while playing Mengsk, and I’d know this from playing dozens of games with him.

Go for it!

May be possible by giving Sky Fury’s forms two weapons: one which can’t hit massive units, and one which only can. We’ll have to see.

Also I forgot to mention, perhaps add health regen during Phoenix Protocol, and rework Evasive Maneuvers to damage reduction rather than dodge chance (these are suggestions I see from many people, and I agree, damage reduction is more reliable than dodging.)

I saw an idea for stukovs banshee having ground aoe and I thought maybe they could have a “crashing” burrow that deals aoe damage. It could activate automatically when their health gets low near enemies or just be usable when their health falls into the red zone. They are durable units but their damage is disappointing without the line damage that raynor banshees have.

Apologies first but I need to get this off my chest.
I just realised that Sky Fury’s Level 3 abilities (Evasive Maneuvers/Phoenix Protocol) activation conditions are retardedly overcomplicated and contrived for the sake of being “Unique”. (Level 2 ability is complicated too btw).

So I decided to unite this abilities and implement Mestrophis’s idea of making damage reduction instead of Dodge.
The new ability is “Phoenix Barrier” and it will now be implemented on all form of Sky Fury (Basically reduces damage and erect shields when taking Fatal damage).

Stettman Change

  • Mecha Locusceptor can now also attack Air

  • Resource increase in Battlecarrier Lords Stetmato Gun and Locusceptor Bays upgrade 100/100 > 200/200

(Give its ability to potentially shoot out 300 damage for 4~7 times with 1.5 cooldown, this need to be doubled)

(This upgrade allows Locusceptor to also attack air, with Battlecarrier Lords becoming all powerful, I had to increase the upgrade costs for compensation)


  • Stalker now can be auto-casted (not sure if its needed but OK).

  • Void Rays also have far longer charge duration (also includes my version of speed buff)

Stukov Change

  • Stukov’s Infested Compunds starting from level 2 allows the Volatile Infested to be spawned with 5% chance.
  • 5% Chance for Level 3

Kerrigan & Zagara

  • Queens can autocast Larva and Transfusion (give it chance)

  • Queens can cast Transfusion for Units inside Omega Worm and Overlord

Alarak Change

  • Vanguards Pellets drop much faster (+50%)

Mengsk Change


  • It’s Bulwark field is 5 (Same as Tyrannozor/Aberration)

  • Blackhammer can walk over troopers

  • Blackhammer benefit from Aesir Turbines 1.88 > 2.91

  • Double Damage against Structures (not sure about his, Blackhammers are Anti Air specialists)


  • Rank 2 Increase + range 3 Rank 3 now has splash missile (0.5 range) (This seems more appropriate for Blackhammer’s Anti air speciality).

Sky Fury

  • Includes Dual Weapon System buff (This was personally my beloved buff also, it can use serious offense power up)

  • Add + Hero/Massive attack buff

  • NEW ABILITY Phoenix Shield provides 25% damage decrease (Can’t overlap too closely with Fenix’s Conservator).

When taking fatal damage in any form Sky Fury gain 250 and lasts for 25 seconds. Cosmetic effects are stronger and the shield gains its own meter. (I decreased the shield).

  • Tactical Realignment activates for 5 seconds as soon as it attack something (its activation condition is overcomplicated and unnecessary too).

Stukov Banshees have Cloaking as well as range increase by +8 (also, their burrow increases energy regen +20).
I think their offense doctrine is to snipe dangerous foes while behind waves of Infested.

I don’t think every Banshee a splash attack is a good way to keep them unique. Unfortunately I don’t know how to increase their offence but their durability, regen and efficiency in sniping objectives and armoured enemies is very nice compared to other Banshees.

I think taking away base ability to do splash damage from banshees is not the way making them unique. Maybe unique useless, if you want such kind of uniqueness. Compound don’t need 5% chance of volatiles, you just making tanks less useful. So your point about stukov as i see it: “Let’s make “unique” units for stukov, but everyone just go on play infantry because mech is too expensive and unique in their inferiority to infantry”.

Artanis lacks dps. Dewarp is elegant way to fix it: You pick temporal buff mastery, warp in units, enjoy the dps. Then you consume charges on building (which btw will require more resources for buildings, to provide enough charges for dewarp, and refund cost may be dependant on unit’s current hit points for the sake of keeping healing support from ally relevant) to dewarp them, and get ability to warp them again with newly applied buff. Ofc with this change some numbers on both masteries may need tweaking but this don’t change the point. Other way is just to give artanis units flat dps increase or cost decrease, but this won’t be as interesting as dewarp mechanic which also helps with mobility.

Something around 10-20% discount on phoenix i guess is just the thing that needs to be tested. But knowing how do you like making OP thing I’d advice just give them 10%.

Viking transformation speed is not enough. I bet you never tried to play using them actively.

Just Die enemies does not receive second life. In that case Nova’s snipeshot energy regen would trigger for killing off first life of unit, but that’s not happening. It’s a bug that should be fixed.

Auto-cast for blink ability for stalkers is the thing that should have been for every stalker in the game from the very beginning. Other units just attack automatically and have no problems. Blink is the essential part of this unit the same as attack, it shouldn’t be special ability for some of the stalkers. If auto-blink makes the relevantly stronger, np - just increase their build cost a bit, it’s not a big deal.

Instigators should have something more interesting then auto-blink. For example, give them energy and bind some ability to it. My thoughts about it: Give them ability to do bounce attack (3 targets, some minor cooldown like 5 seconds) which costs energy, and make their blink cost energy too. So they would benefit from energy regen upgrade, and allies that regen energy, and Instigators may want to not turn auto-cast on for saving more energy for their bounce attacks(which can be turned off too ofc). Other idea is to give them some overload mode, that increases their dmg by some decent amount (50-100%) but each shot deals dmg to Instigator too and drain energy. Also they may lose their anti-air bonus dmg when attack air, so it won’t make karax good AA commander in an instance (which would be way too dramatic change).

I don’t get this are you agreeing with me that Banshees shouldn’t get Splash for the sake of being unique? Or Uniqueness doesn’t outwiegh the usefulness thus I should implement “splash damage” to Banshee?

Fair enough

Infantry is the popular choice. Except for Liberator’s attacks (which the cloud form stops in the middile of attack) they are good enough. Shame people don’t play them alot.

So, it’s like warp in your units. Take them back then summon them back in the Matrix Field (With no cost). Is this what you mean?

I used to, but I’m trying to find moderation these days.

Haven’t played much with Raynor Vikings but Deimos Vikings and Sky Fury has no problem for transformation speed.

Yes they do, they come back from life after you kill them.
About this Nova snipe bug though is interesting, I’ll write it down later.

I’ll experiment on this later.

This could overlap with Talis’s Bouncing Glaive. Personally I think there are enough Protoss commanders that have Stalker (or Stalker like units).

Maybe Instigators can be made their range into 10 after blinking?