Zen next, or are we just gonna ignome that


#81

Overbuff. And 55-57% is for Brigitte depending on what levels you look at her. It’s Zen and Mercy’s winrates that are suppressed.


#82

Nope, and find it strange you’d think that seeing how zen is perfectly fine


#83

No way the OWL uses the high skill ceiling supports? The pros get value from him because he actually requires aim? No way, we should nerf him so it’s just mercy and brig in the OWL.

I’m not sure you’ve ever played this game. Have you ever heard of goats comp? Depressing AF. Have you heard of the grav dragon comp designed to counter it? Also depressing AF. Have you heard of bash shatter? try bein a rein when the enemy has a brig. Scratch that try being a tank that isn’t orissa. try being lucio or moira. Any dps with an interruptible ult, scratch that too, any dps besides phar and junk, she counters MOST OF THE ROSTER and how many counters does she have i might add? two. Get out of here with that “pickrate isn’t high enough” BS. She is picked plenty and when she is you feel it. And when she isn’t you still feel it due to grav dragon being a snooze fest.


#84

I just can’t understand your reasoning for nerfs based on anything but dev numbers. If Jeff put out a post showing what difference Zen’s discord made in 500 games as a percentage of overall damage and it was too high yea I could agree. But your claims based on personal experience hold no value on whether the orb is TRULY OP or not. Zero. You’re not a dev and you have no real access to numbers.


#85

You already covered Mercy?

Anyway, Zen is actually probably the most balanced support. There isn’t a single part of his kit that is either too strong or too weak, but he is heavily favoured by the recent metas.


#86

Are you ready for my stats?

Well, actually that’s not stats that’s just a dev saying she is the most powerful support but close enough for me.


#87

Actually yea, we’re going to ignore zen because zen has been quite balanced for quite some time. =p Devs acknowledged it yet again and we won’t be seeing any zen nerfs in the near future.


#88

The pickrate by itself isn’t the problem, it’s the combination of high pickrate WITH high winrate. When a hero is top 5 for both pickrate and single team winrate, that’s when it’s a problem.


#89

It’s so high in OWL because he requires excellent comms, target priorities, aim, ult economy, and game sense to get the most value. All of these are abundant in the OWL so naturally they pick him for the value he brings when these are implemented.


#90

I think instead of a nerf, the discord orb should be changed so it instead makes the target deal 30% less damage. That way Zen still has a viable application and niche but can’t change kill ranges on a whim for his team.


#91

If that was the case then heroes like Ana, Sombra and Zarya would have a high single team winrate. None of them have a 50% winrate or better, and going into the playoffs only Moira had a worse winrate than Zarya. You can’t use high standard of comms as reasoning for Zen’s high winrate.


#92

I’m pretty sure i used more than comms in my argument but whatever. Also ana and sombra are trash tier heroes currently, it’s hard to win with an underpowered heroes. Zarya has a hard time because OWL players know that pink bubbles means don’t shoot. Zen isn’t underpowered, but he isn’t overpowered either, he’s just really effective when played correctly, and JJonak, ryujehong and so forth play him correctly. Also OWL isn’t a good reference for ladder.


#93

You may have used more than comms in your argument, but of the things you listed it’s the only one that is more important for those 4 than other heroes. Positioning, aim, game sense and all the others are things that other heroes have in common. If you’re making the argument that Zen should have a higher winrate than all heroes except Widow, over heroes that take more skill to aim, then the argument has to be based around his communication levels required.


#94

If that means a balanced ladder than yes. Also who requires more aim to play than zen in OWL? Lucio isn’t played, and hanzo’s hitboxes are giant. And everyone else is hitscan=easier to aim than projectile.


#95

Zen is in a good spot, the problem is the other healers are not. It’s not Zens fault the other healers need tweaks.


#96

Brigitte has insanely good winrates, over 57%. This post is incorrect.

Also the Devs said Zen is in a fine position. Mercy is what enables him to survive and with the nerfs he’s more killable by a Winston tesla cannon.


#97

It’s already been proven that Hanzo having large hitboxes is a myth, but other heroes with harder aiming than Zen:

Genji
Pharah
Mei
Zarya
Ana
Lucio
(+ Hanzo)

You’re really overrating how hard Zen’s orbs are to fire


#98

There’s a thing in gm coming up right now called ‘No Zenyatta, no win’. Couldn’t be more right. He has to aim, so don’t nerf him. #doublestandards
“MERCY WAS THE PROBLEM, SHE MADE ZENYATTA META!!!”
So why was the meta Lucio/Zen before the Mercy rework, or are we double standards once again?
Zenyatta in gm has a 1 percent less pickrate than Mercy but a higher winrate than her.
An extremely high picked hero has a high winrate. Balanced though…wdym, he needs to aim; leave him alone.


#99

Lolwhat? He has one of the easiest hitboxes so it’s impossible to not hit him and he has no escape. He will always see some playtime at high tiers because of his cieling. He’s the model hero design, he’s balanced.


#100

he got hit not to long ago with the increased time between shots for volley.

mercy got exactaly what she needed… just because you can follow people around and hold M1 does not make you a good player… if anything she needs a complete rework to be more inline with other supports instead of the go to for people want an easy way to rank up