I love tanks being raid bosses
said no one.
The armour revert isn’t negligible, though. Say Hanzo shoots an armoured tank in the head. Before the patch, pre-nerf armour would reduce that 240 damage down to 168. Post patch, OW1 armour reduces that to… 235. Ouch. The helmet passive reduces that damage down to 175, which is less scary, but still actually worse than before.
That’s why tanks still explode - because they haven’t actually been made significantly beefier. What’s actually changed is which characters now act as tankbusters.
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As long as 5v5 exists, one singular tank will always feel terrible to play
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It seems tank players are still unsatisfied and they’ll never be satisfied with such a small buffs in 5v5.
A good solution for 1 stronk tank could be
- Buff tanks as much as possible so that they can 1v4 against dps/supps only by W+M1.
- Now dps/supps are just negligible and the game is more like tank 1v1.
- So we can safely remove dps/supps from them without affecting the game.
- Make tank queue their 1v1 game and the rest of dps/supps could play 4v4 without queue times bottleneck.
Or we can just bring back 6v6 and make every hero suited for it, no different complete reworks. Just revert everything back to Overwatch 1 and have the Overwatch 2 heroes abilities redesigned. 5v5 is obviously not working.
(Ex. Like Junker Queen’s roar instead of it using on her teammates, she can use it on herself.)
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I think Spilo called it a “psychology patch”. It is basically a way to do a power shift, actually a nerf overall, but gaslight the community into thinking it’s a massive buff. It’s just marketing.
Unfortunately, it’s working on some people. “Tanks are raid bosses” is a sign that the marketing is more effective than the reality.
That’s not to say it didn’t help any tanks either. JQ is undeniably better. Just it wasn’t this massive tank fix people think it is and like you said, some tanks still explode.
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Yin, just a PSA because I didn’t know this until recently either. When you reply to multiple people like this, only one gets the notification. Most of these people will have no idea that you even responded to them.
If you actually want people to know that you replied, you have to do it one at a time.
Oh yes, it matter. It matter because power creep is never a positive thing in any game. It negatively impacts the game in the long run.
In World of Warcraft, they almost broke the game completely at one point due to power creep. Diablo 3 still suffer from power creep and other games in the past have suffered because of it.
Power creep is added when developers get lazy as adding power creep means they don’t have to do proper balancing.
Power creep is when they give one role a flat buff across the board through things like the dps passive, or the one they just made for tanks, or the regen passive for all roles. These kind of changes also causes a massive power shift due to the power creep affecting one role more than the other, and right now it has gotten so out of control, i doubt they’ll be able to balance any hero properly ever again.
Your suggestion means that the 100% hp increase would be canceled out by the 100% damage increase… That’s not balance, that’s just adding more numbers, which is also adding more power creep, and yes, that would be problematic.
What we need, is for them to stop adding to the power creep and remove most of it completely and balance each indivdual hero and re-introduce 6v6. It’s the only way to save this game, because the game in its current state is just bad, in all aspects.
5v5 will literally never work no matter what they do. The only way to make this garbage work is to remove hero swapping(and even that wouldn’t help). So basically we’re wasting time with each passing day because they really need to just remove 5v5 and go back to 6v6.
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Meanwhile, in the DPS tier-list…
I am aware, thank you.
It’s less about responding and more about informing. It’s not specifically about the response, and more about people reading and understanding and thinking.
I guess that’s my point. There’s a really good chance that none of them have seen your response in order to read it, understand it, or think about it.
Show me a professional source that says that.
Because yes, does it change the baseline power level? Sure.
Is that baseline always less fun? Absolutely not.
The idea that a new baseline is automatically bad by default, is basically just saying:
- “Change is bad, because it changes things”
Which is pretty non-sensical.
Well, Symmetra has never been above average for any long period of time in Overwatch…
They haven’t done any “adjusting” in months. Soldier, Soj, Tracer…
where did this narrative come from that all the cc in ow1 was intended for tanks? most use cases were centred toward dps and tanks, with most abilities just ending up going to tanks
6v6 could absolutely work with minimal cc, it just reinforces the idea of main and off tank and allows more teamplay and teamwork
and with mostly tanks being allocated cc now, it makes even more sense
cc is not a bad thing, the only issue rn is all the cc that does exist gets tunneled into 1 tank, combined with stuff like discord and whatnot it just creates a miserable experience
It is, since it doesn’t counter heroes it supposed to.
CC supposed to counter mobile heroes, but punishes non-mobile heroes more. As well as tanks, since they make easier targets.
Dps passive will always ensure tanks die way fast
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Of the original launch heroes, the only ones with “hard” crowd control where found on Defense heroes, Tanks, and two Offense heroes (Pharah, Cassidy). Of the two Offense Heroes, Cassidy had a hard stun and Pharah had a knockback effect.
Outside of that, Lucio had Soundwave - which costed ammo at the time. None of the other Supports had any hard crowd control.
Defensive heroes like Symmetra had a stackable slow - which didn’t really have much effect on non-Tank heroes since Genji, Tracer, Reaper had abilities that would either ignore it or just suppress it when using specific abilities like Blink or Swiftstrike. Mei had a Slow that turned into a freeze after 2/3 seconds of her primary fire, and Ice Wall. Junkrat had Trap, and knockback effect with Concussion Mine. Torbjorn had “soft” crowd control via Turret (same with Symmetra via RMB charged orbs and Sentries), Bastion worked in the same way, but much more lethal.
As a whole, every Tank had hard crowd control. Rein’s Earthshatter, D.va’s Self-Destruct (which is more “soft”), Winston’s Primal Rage, Roadhog’s Hook, Whole Hog, Zarya’s Gravity Surge and RMB (slight displacement).
New heroes started with Ana, introducing Sleep. Sombra with Hack/EMP (largely non-threatening at the time to most everyone save Reinhardt, Tracer). Orisa came next with Halt - a mini-Gravity Surge. Doomfist followed with Rocket Punch, Uppercut (soft), Seismic Slam (soft). Brigitte would follow with Shield Bash (Hard stun, second one ever following from Cassidy), Whipshot (knockback), and finally Sigma with Accretion and Gravitic Flux. Ashe had a knockback with Calvary Gun (largely non-offensive or too difficult to deal with), and BOB who could knock up targets, ala Uppercut, if they were in his path.
Ashe is probably the ‘last’ “Defense Hero” even though they had merged the roles prior to her release. Since most of her design hallmarks had a very defensive-oriented elements including Dynamite and the lack of a strong controlled-burst. Not to mention being a backline hero that was a core trait to the Defense-role.
The game was originally built with the idea of only one Tank per team (though no hard restrictions on role choices). Blizzard correctly thought that no one would play Tank normally, and that would be rare. So they balanced the original game format around the idea of Tanks (and Supports) being generalists; the original gameplay design is based around Offense heroes going up against Defense heroes and then rotating the runs between each map (one team would be on Attack, and the Defending).
When the game launched and there were impromptu tournaments, Blizzard noticed that a lot of players would double up on Tanks and Supports and tried to balanced towards this direction, but without ever changing core framework, or the templates for their designs. So the core framework of the game had borderline broken Tanks coming in along with very powerful Supports (who they resolved to have healing from then on out with Ana). This dynamic showed very clear indications of problematic designs with Triple-Tank formations coming to a head with the GOATS compositions as more Support choices became available.
But it was always intended that Tanks would be the ones with all the crowd control. In Blizzard’s statements, and design specs, every Tank is a “main tank” They never intended for any Tank to be an “Off-tank” just as they never intended for an “off-Support”.
The original director for Overwatch is Jeff Kaplan, who came from Everquest as Tigole Bitties; a notorious Halfing Rogue from the largest guild on Cazic-Thule - Fires of Heaven - who ran very inflammatory posts on the SOE/EQ boards complaining about Hybrids like Paladins/Shadowknights being overly dominate choices for Tanking raids. Him, along with Furor (Alex Afrasiabi) never liked the idea of hybrids and preferred “pure” classes. That sentiment is also reflected in Overwatch’s core design and preference towards Tanks.
This is because of the original design of the game, didn’t have a specific composition in mind, let alone multiple Tanks. Any sort of benefits that were offered by Supports or debuffs towards the enemy target would naturally have a bigger impact on Tank targets, because of the very specific way they designed the Tank-role. The original launch Tanks didn’t have much in the way of managing ammo, only one of them was ever concerned with hitting critical hits (D.va could, but her wide spread wouldn’t really allow for this consistently). Only Tanks had armor, save Bastion and Torbjorn (special exceptions due to their sizes), and everyone else would be dead in a handful of shots. Damage was (and still is) tuned towards dealing lots of damage towards Tanks (Specific exception being Genji and Supports) with a handful of shots being used to kill everyone else; with a high chance of missing.
It’s also just basic math. You can damage-boost Soldier or Tracer, but you’d get more reliable damage-boost out of Winston when he’s hitting more than 2 targets, or Reinhardt who would hit as hard as Genji’s Dragonblade. And still hit harder with Firestrike than Soldier with Helix Rocket - and more frequently back then too. Meanwhile, the Tanks would still be able to resist more damage take more damage than anyone else, so healing them is easier and a more valuable choice.
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??? they’re broken now and you still cry lmaooooo. Overwatch players are the worst gamers in gaming history.